Canon Adds EOS R50 and EOS R8 to the Growing EOS R Mirrorless Camera System

[londonxt]

I was one of the people hoping for an R8 FF entry level. To me, it really seems they have merged the R and the RP. Specs (sensor/ fps/ af) look great to me, the body seems a bit too basic. Is a joystick really that expensive? I thought it might get the R7 feature...
I understand that Canon has omitted the Touch Bar since there were so many complaints. They have replaced it with... nothing... that's a shame.
Battery life seems to be really crappy... I can't´really understand that, too.

I’m willing to carry a spare battery(ies) if it’s coupled with a smaller and lighter body.

I’ve found myself in the curious position of pining for a body that’s just that bit smaller and lighter but unwilling to go APS-C.

My journey has gone from big body film to big body 5d series up until MKIII, when the EOS R was launched I jumped for its smaller factor.

Combined with a 50mm RF 1.8 lens it is surprisingly portable but I was horrified by the battery life in the beginning but soon adapted begrudgingly accepting the limitations of technology.

Now I’ve found myself doing lot of cycling tours and urban walking and look to travel light with the camera tucked in a small sturdy sling bag or even bike handle bar bag but even the EOS R was just that little too bulky to fit perfectly and weight always adds up over prolonged walking.

My priority has always been one shot photography and in that regard DR range and sensor size/quality trumps AF “gimmicks”, shots per second and perhaps even IBIS (for now).

I never really got on with the EOS R controls, the touch screen AF selection promised much but I find myself with an AF point set to random corners whenever I put the camera to the eye. I long for the EOS 3 eye select focus (I also had the EOS 50e) but the R3 took that to a market segment I don’t belong in.

So this R8 has certainly peaked my interest, the downsides of a smaller density sensor and less weather sealed body are the big compromises for me, wouldn’t mind paying a bit more for a body with that. My R puts up with a lot of rain. Typically I would have to sell the old body or lens to finance any upgrade so I’ll have to sit on this thought for a while, probably until the R8s enhanced replacement is due

 

[bbasiaga]

No need to wait:


View attachment 207502


During the last few months the Z5 body was sold for 1050,- EUR in Germany, with the R8 at 1800 EUR.. Now it went back up in price, but even so it seems to be the substantially better camera. Hard to argue against it for a newcomer right now.

Nikon is priced aggressively, trying to save their brand from obscurity. For many people they offer a good value at this point in time though. The AF system is the big weakness. Clearly steps behind the R6/R5, and several more steps behind what is in the R3/R6II/R7/(presumably the R8). But if all you need is something like what was offered in the R 4-5 years ago, the Nikon would suit. Its probably a half step between that an the R5/6 in performance, based on the reviews).

Still, the numbers of battery life are wrong:
The R8 battery life is 370 / 220. That are the values I get from Canon.

The battery life numbers are mainly meaningless anyway. I regularly get way more with my R6 than its CIPA rating. And a few times I was pushing it really hard and got way less. So you're going to get what you get. The mirrorless cameras really have only this weakness left compared to their DSLR predecessors. However weakness is not the right word. Its a consequence for the camera being in a new league of processing and AF performance. That said, a battery with fewer mAh will last less time than one with more, but the performance is probably more overlapping than the numbers may show.

Brian

 

[koenkooi]

If I remember correctly, R5 requires 9V (18W) PD when charging and 20V (45W) PD for powering while turned on.

I think you're technically correct that the R5 negotiates for that, but the actual charging itself uses 5V:

And live power 9V:


I don't have an analyzer that shows what it negotiated for initially, I suspect that we're both correct

 

[bbasiaga]

I don't think either of these bodies is for me at this time. I am happily shooting the R6, and recently got an M6II.

Is the r50 the same size as the M50? maybe I need to go to Youtube and see if there is a side by side. I love that form factor. Its taken over with my M6II for now, but knowing that miniature size body is alive in the R line is good for the future.

R8 looks good at its price. After the initial release it'll trend toward the original RP price point and be in a really nice spot in the lineup. I can't believe it got 40fps.

I might have to check out that 24-50. If it makes my R6 sort of pocketable, which really means fits in my Peak design 6L sling with the lens on, that could be fun to have for grab and go.

-Brian

 

[HikeBike]

In my opinion, Canon hit these out of the park. These look like great cameras at their price points.

Is there room for an R9 in the lineup at this point? I can't really see it happening.

 

[Maximilian]

The battery life numbers are mainly meaningless anyway. I regularly get way more with my R6 than its CIPA rating.

Brian, it's the same as with mpg (l/100km).
You and I get different values with both.
But when comparing products / cameras / cars it is a standardized measurement. I'd call that far from "meaningless".
And I get upset, when people argue with wrong numbers / alternative facts / lies.
And then I'll correct it.

 

[Skyscraperfan]

The Nikon Z6 II costs €1949 in Germany. That is just €150 more than the R8. The Z6 II has IBIS, a CFexpress slot, a full mechanical shutter and mini HDMI instead of micro HDMI. The Z6 II has more lens options than the R8. You can even use all your old EF lenses with an adapter.

 

[neuroanatomist]

I was one of the people hoping for an R8 FF entry level. To me, it really seems they have merged the R and the RP. Specs (sensor/ fps/ af) look great to me, the body seems a bit too basic. Is a joystick really that expensive? I thought it might get the R7 feature...
I understand that Canon has omitted the Touch Bar since there were so many complaints. They have replaced it with... nothing... that's a shame.
Battery life seems to be really crappy... I can't´really understand that, too.

I don't think I used the touch bar on my EOS R more than once, so I really won't miss it. A joystick on the R8 would be nice, but while those did well with the 10s of AF points on a DLSR, they still fall short with a frame full of AF points on a MILC. Touch screen selection (restricted to the upper right quadrant) worked well for me on the R. Honestly, once you've used the Smart Controller (R3 / 1D X III) for AF point selection, everything else seems kludgy – with fast-paced shooting, nothing else comes close. Personally, my use of the R8 will be only for travel and usually deliberate (tripod, careful composition), so a relatively poor EVF and touch screen focusing will be fine.

Battery life ratings are useless, actual shots on a full battery depend so much on your shooting style. Despite the great AF and 40 fps e-shutter, the R8 does not seem like a good choice for fast-paced shooting, so I doubt many people will be inconvenienced by the need to change a battery during the day. The R7 would be good for a fast pace, albeit with a smaller sensor.

 

[Chaitanya]

What quirkiness? Do you mean the comment from Bryan/TDP shared from a friend, “…a power source with a capacity of 5 Volts at 3 Amps (or higher) and a true USB Type-C connection (not a USB Type-B to USB Type-C cable) are required?”

I suspect that means his friend tried using a phone charger to charge the R8, and it didn’t work. Not surprising. My R3 and M6II also require an iPad/laptop-type USB-C charger and cable.

Yep, Lok Cheung in his video preview(video has been removed but that demo is still present in Kai W's video) demonstrated R8 wont charge with USB-A to USB-C cable while when connected with USB-C to USB-C cable it started charging all the while only pulling 1A @ 5V(so standard USB charge speeds). If camera is using standard charge speeds then ideally it should work with any USB chargers instead of relying on PD based ones.

 

[neuroanatomist]

The Nikon Z6 II costs €1949 in Germany. That is just €150 more than the R8. The Z6 II has IBIS, a CFexpress slot, a full mechanical shutter and mini HDMI instead of micro HDMI. The Z6 II has more lens options than the R8. You can even use all your old EF lenses with an adapter.

Sounds great. Why don't you buy one, then?

 

[koenkooi]

[...] The battery life numbers are mainly meaningless anyway. I regularly get way more with my R6 than its CIPA rating. And a few times I was pushing it really hard and got way less. So you're going to get what you get.[...]

The CIPA tests for battery life include lots of reviewing using the back LCD, using the built-in flash and turning the camera off and on again every few shots. CIPA has all test protocols available on their website for free, so you can have a look at how well it matches your usage.

When using the MP-E, I get way, way worse numbers because it involves using the EVF hours on end while taking only a handful of pictures during that time. For twitchy dragonflies it's maximum burst all the way, you can get 1000s of shots on a single battery

 

[neuroanatomist]

Yep, Lok Cheung in his video preview(video has been removed but that demo is still present in Kai W's video) demonstrated R8 wont charge with USB-A to USB-C cable while when connected with USB-C to USB-C cable it started charging all the while only pulling 1A @ 5V(so standard USB charge speeds). If camera is using standard charge speeds then ideally it should work with any USB chargers instead of relying on PD based ones.

Fine. Probably Canon used the same USB-C PD controller they have in their other bodies, and while I haven't tested it I suspect the R3 draws more than 1A @ 5V to charge the LP-E19 (but maybe not). Personally, I'd rather have a controller that won't fry if I connect my USB PD 96W or 140W Apple power supply than one that can work with a USB-A charger. YMMV.

 

[koenkooi]

Yep, Lok Cheung in his video preview(video has been removed but that demo is still present in Kai W's video) demonstrated R8 wont charge with USB-A to USB-C cable while when connected with USB-C to USB-C cable it started charging all the while only pulling 1A @ 5V(so standard USB charge speeds). If camera is using standard charge speeds then ideally it should work with any USB chargers instead of relying on PD based ones.

The USB A charging spec only allows for 5V/1A, everything above that is out-of-spec vendor stuff, Qualcomm being the worst offender. If you have something that provides more than 5V/1A over USB A, start reading up on warranty and fire insurance. The type-C to A cables are generally only USB 2.x on the A end.

USB 3.1 allows 0.9A over a proper port, using a proper USB 3.x type A cable. The non-PD battery charging spec allows 1.5A, but has specific requirements. From the USB BC 1.2 spec:

Previously a USB Portable Device with a battery and charging capability simply took power from a USB port without any control. With BC 1.2, a Portable Device can get more power and the battery can be charged faster. It is important to verify that a Portable Device complies with the BC 1.2 specification while communicating with a Charging Downstream Port and identifying a Dedicated Charger, and ensuring that it continues to operate as a functional USB device.
Many existing dedicated chargers have offered a USB compliant physical connection but lacked a USB compliance program. This led to many chargers having characteristics incompatible with USB specifications.

USB-C PD finally standardized higher current modes, which is a good thing. But newer revisions make everything optional so cheap crap can still get certified

Anything USB is a mess, I'm very happy that I don't have to deal with it anymore for $dayjob!

 

[entoman]

The R8 is disappointing to me in design despite having really nice specs, I owned the RP for a while and the body just isn’t very ergonomic, I feel like it’s lazy for canon to just reuse the parts and leave out things like a control wheel or joystick (which even the cheaper R10 has).

Do you really think a joystick is needed, given the sophistication of modern AF systems such as that in the R8?

All you need to do is to leave the AF spot in its default central position, over the subject, and then recompose. As long as you keep half-pressure on the shutter button, the subject will remain in focus, regardless of how you recompose, and regardless of where the subject moves. The joystick is pretty much a redundant feature these days. Moving the AF spot manually via a joystick or via the touch screen just slows you down.

A second dial is also no longer needed, because RF lenses have a control wheel that can be assigned to aperture, shutter speed, ISO or exposure compensation.

 

[neuroanatomist]

The USB A charging spec only allows for 5V/1A, everything above that is out-of-spec vendor stuff, Qualcomm being the worst offender. If you have something that provides more than 5V/1A over USB A, start reading up on warranty and fire insurance.

Yeah, Apple's SuperDrive draws over spec through USB-A. It's fine when connected directly to a USB-A Mac, but most hubs and even some USB-C-to-A dongles don't support it. Before anyone asks, CDs/DVDs are an archaic storage media that used to contain data, software, music and video, and looked like this:



Don't get me started on Zip drives.....

 

[bf]

Where is that "new form-factor"?? Was it left in the rumors? It seems 8 stands for P as RP and R as M of M50. I don't see anything different in the LCD rotation either!

 

[koenkooi]

Yeah, Apple's SuperDrive draws over spec through USB-A. It's fine when connected directly to a USB-A Mac, but most hubs and even some USB-C-to-A dongles don't support it. Before anyone asks, CDs/DVDs are an archaic storage media that used to contain data, software, music and video, and looked like this:

View attachment 207506

I'm culturally obligated to say this every time CDs get mentioned: The center hole is the exact size of a pre-Euro Dutch 10 cent coin, a so-called 'dubbeltje'.

Don't get me started on Zip drives.....

The stupidly strong ejection spring did provide enough force to fling a Zip disk across the room, distracting you from getting actual work done while trying to find the optimum launch angle.

 

[Flip'n flippy]

More content creator stuff, what a let down. Canon, when are you going develop a RF high resolution, professional build quality, top lcd screen, tilting (NOT FLIPPY) back lcd screen camera for us photographers? The R5 is not it, my 5ds-r has higher resolution.

 

[entoman]

For 400 Euros more than the R8, you can buy a Panasonic S5 II, which seems a much better deal. Like the R7 it also has IBIS and a mechanical shutter, but also full frame and some other nice features. And it supports third party lenses including all Canon EF lenses with an adapter.

Then get the Panasonic, if you want to spend the extra, it's an excellent camera. Or save yourself $400 and get the R8, which is effectively a mini R6ii with a slightly lower spec and shorter battery life. Sometimes I think you just come here to search for something to groan about...

 

[PinholeR5]

I really like the R8. Yeah, It would have been better at < USD $1K, but then again, it would be better at USD $1 . For me it replaces both the RP and the R and I had uses for both. RP for compact travel and R for video on tripod (mostly work related FHD video). For me it will be superior to both with a price in between both. It hit the spot for me.