Canon EOS 5D Mark IV Being Tested by Photographers

[j-nord]

At release 5D iii sensor tech was current (nothing ahead, it was just a current technology). With the release of D810, D750, A7r ii etc., all canon sensors are FAR behind now.

Someone is in a good mood there... It was only just funny to read that 4 year old tech is 2 years behind competition. Further, I just see no point in making absolute statements like "all canon sensors are FAR behind now".

+1

I wonder what CanonGuy thinks of the fact that Canon's new APS-C sensor in the 80D has more low ISO DR than the FF sensor in Nikon's flagship D5.

Facts get in the way. It's impossible to take good pictures with out industry leading sensors even if you have industry leading glass.

 

[j-nord]

At release 5D iii sensor tech was current (nothing ahead, it was just a current technology). With the release of D810, D750, A7r ii etc., all canon sensors are FAR behind now.

Someone is in a good mood there... It was only just funny to read that 4 year old tech is 2 years behind competition. Further, I just see no point in making absolute statements like "all canon sensors are FAR behind now".

+1

I wonder what CanonGuy thinks of the fact that Canon's new APS-C sensor in the 80D has more low ISO DR than the FF sensor in Nikon's flagship D5.

Facts get in the way. It's impossible to take good pictures with out industry leading sensors even if you have industry leading glass.

Are you just claiming it is impossible to take good pictures with current Canon sensors? Just to be sure I understand you right...

It's sarcasm related to the 'great canon sensor debate'.

 

[unfocused]

"World Press Photo".

How many of them own their own camera vs use "The Company's"?

Almost all. Most of these photographers are freelance or contract photographers. Staff photographers at large newspapers may have access to pool cameras, and photographers on assignment for publications like National Geographic or Sports Illustrated, also may have access to specialized equipment through a pool. But for most of the world's photojournalists, especially freelance and contract photographers, it's Bring Your Own Camera.

 

[unfocused]

The Canon Ambassadors are doing final field testing and marketing work, they have pre-release models...actually they have had them for awhile now. I told you months ago 4k was for sure in. You people are in for a fun all around "little" camera in a few months!!! Even i am impressed with it and may just well save up my pennies for one myself. Can't say much on details but don't expect high Megapixels or crazy fast fps but do expect the best DR ever from a Canon!

of course you don't believe me...

Why wouldn't anyone believe you. You haven't said anything that hasn't been known or expected for months now.

Although I would be surprised if the 5DIV has better dynamic range than the 1DX II. I assume you forgot about that.

 

[j-nord]

The Canon Ambassadors are doing final field testing and marketing work, they have pre-release models...actually they have had them for awhile now. I told you months ago 4k was for sure in. You people are in for a fun all around "little" camera in a few months!!! Even i am impressed with it and may just well save up my pennies for one myself. Can't say much on details but don't expect high Megapixels or crazy fast fps but do expect the best DR ever from a Canon!

of course you don't believe me...

Why wouldn't anyone believe you. You haven't said anything that hasn't been known or expected for months now.

Although I would be surprised if the 5DIV has better dynamic range than the 1DX II. I assume you forgot about that.

Wait, the new camera is going to better than the old one? That's breaking news!

 

[Jack Douglas]

Again, always bears repeating:

http://petapixel.com/2016/02/19/here-are-the-cameras-that-won-world-press-photo-2016/
(Also, see the highest rated comment below the story. :)

Award-winning photos taken on Canon cameras = 28
Award-winning photos taken on Nikon cameras = 12 (yes -- there are some EXMOR sensors in there)
Award-winning photos taken on Sony cameras = 1 (*zero* from the A7 brand)

In fairness, these folks would probably have won their awards with any camera, but the fact that they chose to stick with Canon through these terribly lean DR times speaks volumes. These folks (correctly) see the bigger value proposition of what camera to use. They consider everything -- sensors, AF, lenses, flashes, build quality, 3rd party offerings, reliability, ergonomonics, handling, service, resale, etc.

I'm not saying I don't want more DR, and I'm not saying your desire to have more is misplaced. I am saying that in the big picture, Canon continues to delight us in ways other than the sensor far far far more than my sensor is letting me down, and until that changes, I'm happily staying put.

- A

P.S. I'd honestly love more breakdowns of who uses what from other sectors than press photography, but I've had tough luck getting last 12-24 month sort of data. Please msg me offline and forward a link if you don't mind.

Yah canon had/has higher market share and thats the reason they got lazy. If a Sony can make those amazing sensors with having less than 5% market share of dslr, Canon also should be able to do so. I see pain and simple lack of drive to innovate there. Sony stakeholders are just praying so that canon be the same for the next few years lol. It doesn't take long to be market scrapper from market leader in this fast moving world.

I'm afraid repeating just won't accomplish anything. It's a mindset that is rather narrow, that fixates on specifics and does not want to see the broader picture. To each his own.

I'm happy to stick with Canon and I am still very pleased with what my 6D can do. Not to say I don't get GAS though!

Jack

 

[midluk]

Based on what they have learned it will be a failed "mirrorslapper" that has somewhere between 20 and 45 mp.; between 3-18 fps, will shoot either 1080 HD, or 4K or 8K or 16K (or might not have any video at all because some people resent "paying" for video); either will or won't have a tilt screen, touch screen, wifi or gps; might have better dynamic range at base ISO; might have DPAF; is likely to have an autofocus system; and will have slots for memory cards.

LOL ;D

 

[ahsanford]

Based on what they have learned it will be a failed "mirrorslapper" that has somewhere between 20 and 45 mp.; between 3-18 fps, will shoot either 1080 HD, or 4K or 8K or 16K (or might not have any video at all because some people resent "paying" for video); either will or won't have a tilt screen, touch screen, wifi or gps; might have better dynamic range at base ISO; might have DPAF; is likely to have an autofocus system; and will have slots for memory cards.

One wonders if AvTvM has no mirrors in their house at all...

- A

 

[George D.]

The Canon Ambassadors are doing final field testing and marketing work, they have pre-release models...actually they have had them for awhile now. I told you months ago 4k was for sure in. You people are in for a fun all around "little" camera in a few months!!! Even i am impressed with it and may just well save up my pennies for one myself. Can't say much on details but don't expect high Megapixels or crazy fast fps but do expect the best DR ever from a Canon!

of course you don't believe me...

Which part, the specs or the pennies? If the price isn't right 4K or 8K bet it's no deal.

After 5D2 it seems series 5 is definitely becoming a multi-target group product. Stills people really don't care about video nor will they ever. Debatable if video people really care about stills. So one imposes on the other. I really can't say if improving on video improves on stills so we might actually benefit from video R&D. A win-win case of sorts or we're just wasting resources. In any case the Mk. IV has to be a model that sells. That means don't expect risky features like with the original 5D.

4K is a move that leaves half the target group (or more) unimpressed. Maybe that's why it leaked early. Let's wait 'till August to see what is impressive for the rest of us.

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

can not see the 5D4 trumping the 1D2 on too many things, some thing has to give, my question is what?

Frame rate: 7 fps vs. 14; Autofocus won't be as good; High ISO performance won't be as good because of the 24mp sensor instead of the 1D's 20 mp; smaller buffer; weathersealing won't be as good; SD/CFast slots instead of CF/CFast. Probably some other differences as well.

20MP vs 24MP makes no noticeable difference for high ISO SNR and one might hope the low ISO DR is better so the 5D4 sensor, one would hope, would basically be better, more DR, more MP, virtually as good SNR

5D3 and 1DX AF were pretty similar other than the the 1DX mirror did move faster so I guess the AF got to look a little longer in some situations and the color mode tracker which many seemed to think didn't often work so well anyway

probably a little weaker weather-sealing and 7fps vs 14fps and voice notes.

the metering might be much worse again with maybe no spot linked to AF point again? (just a guess, although other brands offer it at lower prices)

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

yeah, I hear you on this. 5D IV will be a "landscape" camera, of course it can do them.

The 5D4 will do it all, but if you are a specialist in landscapes -- like if it's the source of your income 90% of the time and it sits on a tripod, I'm hard pressed to think of a reason you'd choose the 5D4 over the 5DS unless that sensor is so good it fundamentally changes the game (which is unlikely, I think we'd all admit) ...hence my original question to bitm2007.

(I expect the 5D4 to improve the DR, but not to some dreamlike level where the ND grads can be retired.)

- A

If they somehow got the DR to be like Exmor than I'd bet a great many landscape shooters would rather a 5D4 over a 5Ds. Although if they are almost 100% landscape only an A7R II with a lot more MP plus the same DR (or sadly, maybe noticeable more) would seem better still than either.

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

While typing this another member stated it would likely NOT have HDMI nor 10 bit. I am with them on their logic. It is a total shame. This was their opportunity to not just catch up but move ahead. I cannot figure out their logic. Genuinely, they have such capable people.

I have seen somewhere that it is rumored NOT to have 4K HDMI out and that the 4K is only 8 bit not 10. I was very much hoping that Canon would make the leap to ProRes 422 10 bit and provide HDMI clean out WITH audio finally. The really big change occurring in both photography and videography is dynamic range and low light capability with holding noise at reasonable levels. With regards to video, 4K television is an industry sell mostly since we all know you cannot even see a difference between HD and 4K until your screen is 72 inches and you sit back like 12 feet OMG! That said, HDR, High Dynamic Range television is very noticeable to most everyone side by side with even the best television next to it. And we now need cameras that can shoot photos and video to provide it and for video that means 10 bit not 8, monitors to see it, and software to work with it.

C'mon Cannon Please!!! I love you give it to us, let me stay with you LOL

agree with you on DR, ultra wide gamut and 10 bits and all but disagree about 4k

need a 72" screen??? The difference is clear as day and night on my 24" 4k screen, just as much as on my 60".

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

Please, tell us a bit more then. Like FPS, video capabilities, etc.

I did not ask for. Sorry, I have no information on those. 28 MP is from one photographer who I am not 100% sure. But the second one telling me about the DR and noise is reliable. The second one is also testing the 16-35 III.

All I can say are these two are coming very soon and I will buy both of them.
[/quote]

that would be a real shame if the DR stuff is true

I have bad feeling I'll be sticking with a slightly messy mix of Sony plus my old 5D3, perhaps eventually going to Nikon to get it all in one body if they ever get it all together (Nikon has been being foolish and putting poor efforts into video at times). Still, even if nothing all together in an ideal package, some exciting stuff out there now.

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

I was told 28mp using a new 0.18um cmos sensor will give 1.4 stops more base iso DR and roughly 1/2 stop higher ISO noise performance over the 1dx2

If that is true, and it very well may not be, that actually would pretty much be Exmor performance. It would be totally there for SNR and for base DR, I forget the exact numbers, but it seems like it would be at least close to Exmor, probably within about 1/2 stop, maybe even just a fraction off.

If it did actually have that as a sensor and some nice, oversampled 4k of the crisp detail, no DNR mushy and waxing it to a nasty fake look, the A7R II video just gives such natural crisp detail with no smushing or waxing as Canon video (other than for Cxx stuff) always seems to do, they give it some 100% view video focusing aids that could be pretty sweet. If they gave it 10bit CLOG to make up for 28MP vs 42MP in a way (granted they are different pluses and minuses) I'd certainly favor that trade off myself.

 

[Chuck Alaimo]

Gotta say it. Getting kind of sick of the 4k whiner bregade. You've made your point, 4k is going into the 5d4 but is not good enough. Now us stills shooters have to find ways to manage 3 types of memory cards instead of 2 - at a much greater cost to boot. I do hope that the new battery is compatible with older models, and vice versa. The old 5d3 batteries should be able to power the camera for stills shooting with no crippling. Hopes, but if we lose the ability to use other batteries then that just plain sucks as it also increases the initial cost to operate. Please please please let us use 5d3 batteries in the 5d4!!!!

I'd love to rock the 5d4 5ds combo for weddings. But this let's try to make a segment of users who will never be happy happy thing is silly!!!!!!!

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

So... one source says not to expect much DR-wise and another that it's 1,4 stops higher compared to the 1DX2 (!) That's rumors for you I guess :

hah yeah just hope the second one is the real one

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

The Canon Ambassadors are doing final field testing and marketing work, they have pre-release models...actually they have had them for awhile now. I told you months ago 4k was for sure in. You people are in for a fun all around "little" camera in a few months!!! Even i am impressed with it and may just well save up my pennies for one myself. Can't say much on details but don't expect high Megapixels or crazy fast fps but do expect the best DR ever from a Canon!

of course you don't believe me...

Why wouldn't anyone believe you. You haven't said anything that hasn't been known or expected for months now.

Although I would be surprised if the 5DIV has better dynamic range than the 1DX II. I assume you forgot about that.

Wait, the new camera is going to better than the old one? That's breaking news!

5D3 had less DR than than the 1DX not more
5D3 has less DR (although such a small difference it didn't really matter) than the 5D2

so....

 

[Loswr]

One wonders if AvTvM has no mirrors in their house at all...

Well, he has the one in his 5DIII. Might be hard to use it for shaving...

 

[slclick]

One wonders if AvTvM has no mirrors in their house at all...

Well, he has the one in his 5DIII. Might be hard to use it for shaving...

Shaving... pishposh! All the MILC guys are waxing. (or was that waning?)

 

[AdamBotond]

Speaking of specific DR and noise rumors of the upcoming 5D IV... I was wondering whether how evaluate those at this point assuming there is no way to even open RAW files, yet. You certainly can not draw conclusions based on JPEGs, that have much to do with the software of 5D IV, which has also not been finalized yet obviously.

So do you think that any of those DR, noise related rumours should be considered reliable assuming that no one has ever seen a single RAW file of 5D IV as of yet? I guess we won't really have a clear perspective of DR, noise specs, etc until first RAWs become available. Any thoughts on that?