EOS M5 - first impressions

[gpp]

Thanks.

 

[Zv]

I had a brief play about with the M5 today during my lunch break. Feels good to hold, the store had the 18-150 lens on and it felt nicely balanced. Shutter sound is OK, could be quieter but feels softer than my M2. EVF was surprisingly nice, I kinda liked it but then again I know nothing about EVFs. I think I could see myself getting one but not just yet. I can wait a while!

 

[GadgetDave]

Good Info, thanks!

 

[Act444]

I had a chance to play with a pre-production model myself a couple weeks ago. They didn't let me put a card in, but 1st impressions were relatively positive. The EVF is a really nice touch and I appreciated the additional buttons and dials - felt more like an actual camera and less of a "toy". Two reservations though: price and size. The M10 with 55-200 telephoto JUST squeezes into my small Dashport 30(?) bag - the M5 even with the mini 15-45mm lens was a tighter squeeze (wouldn't fit 18-150 or 55-200). I don't know if there is a similar Dashport bag with a little more depth that could fit M5 w/telephoto, but if I have to use my regular camera bag, I feel I may as well take a 5D.

Perhaps will wait for an update to the M3 or M10, or a price drop? I dunno yet on this one.

 

[Deleted member 378664]

With my M3, I can only use Canon's own speedlites & triggers however, any of my off-brand TTL triggers do not work properly (ex: Yongnuo & Godox TTL Equipment). Do you have any off-brand TTL equipment to test with the M5? Everything worked smoothly when I had the original M and M2.

Hello JP4DESIGNZ.

Sorry for the late reply. Just hadn't much time to test my Yongnuo 622C Transceivers with the M5. But now I have done this test. Everyhting worked as it should. ETTL, M, 2nd curtain sync, HSS. I tested with M5, two Yongnuo YN 622C transceivers and the 580EXII Speedlite.

regards
Frank

 

[NorbR]

I received my M5 this Friday, and have been playing a bit with it this week-end. Photorex already gave a great summary (and yes the first thing I did was try out that AEB drive speed, and indeed it has been fixed, yay ;D ) but I'll add a few points.

The good:

• overall the feel is a bit more solid to me than the M3 (just a bit, see below). The screen, in particular, feel much more solidly constructed.
  
• handling is really good. This is very subjective, but I really like the grip and the ergonomics in general. 2 days with it, and I already feel at home.
  
• unsurprisingly, the handling is better with adapted EF lenses. The 50mm 1.8 STM is right at home, not sure an EF-M 50mm is needed anymore (Canon if you're reading, I'm just kidding, get back to work on those primes ) The 35mm f2 is borderline, but still quite convenient to handle. I haven't tried anything else yet, those are the two lenses that I expect to use on the M5 with any sort of regularity
  
• extremely customizable. A big part of this is due to the Touch and Drag AF, which works beautifully, and frees up the 4-way dial (which I otherwise always set up for direct AF point selection) for a bunch of functions. That, plus the rest of the buttons, plus the Dial Func. button which is extremely convenient, make for a very high level of customizability
  
• the M3 had this weird thing that previews on the camera screen were not really sharp. I can't really explain it, but I know it has been observed by others on this forum. On the M5, this is gone. Pin sharp when zooming it at 1:1.

The not-so-good:

• it still feels a bit plasticky, around the grip in particular. Pressing the buttons feels very plasticky, almost squeaky, the grip itself feels like I might crush it if I squeeze too hard (ok that's a bit of hyperbole, but it's not the most solid feel). Like I said above, a bit better than the M3, but still not feeling rock solid (like the original M was).
  
• I can confirm that time to review is disappointingly slow. It takes about 1 to 2 seconds for the first image to be displayed after pressing the review button. I can't recall the M3 being that slow ... (and this is with a SanDisk Extreme Pro card). Otherwise the UI feels very reminiscent of the M3. And yes, it's a bit sluggish at times, and the original M was better from that point of view.
  
• battery life - maybe it belongs in the category below, it's clearly too soon to tell anything about it, and resting a camera is not the easiest thing on the battery, lots of screen time going through menus ... but still, I'm unimpressed for now. Not surprising, this is essentially an M3 with an extra EVF, and the M3 was already a mediocre performer in that category.

The can't-say-anything-about-it-yet:

• IQ. Sorry. Jury's still out. But from first JPEGs I see nothing to complain about. I wasn't worried anyway. Looking forward to Lightroom support so that I can play with it more.

 

[archiea]

Hey gang, question on shutter lag (without af).

On the M1/M3 you have single / motor drive. Motor drive can take quick 4/7fps bursts respectively. However I often use single frame shooting mode with a manual rangefinder lens (i.e. Any af lag irelevant). I shoot firing the shutter often while manually focusing. You would think a camera than can shoot 7 or even 4 fps can keep up with me. My 5D mark 3, heck even my old 20d was very responsive with its shutter release respone, thus beginning my love affair with dslrs. However the m3 is not, reminding me of some of the early "turn of the century" digital cameras.

In single frame mode, the m3 has a shutter delay even with af off! Poweshots have a similar problem, adding to my belief that the m3 has poweshot guts, hence the slow ui. When I shoot repeated single frame shutter releases, the m3 warms up and the level indicator freezes! Its not rebel performance or even the ancient 20D performance. Sony and fuji don't have that problem.

The problem appears that the m3 can't chew gum and walk. It can shoot to buffer in drive mode, THEN dump to card with a wait, but it cant shoot->write, shoot->write and the speed of the shutter release. And i'm talking from the first frame on not 5 frames in or something. This is a fundalmental flaw with the whole m line it seems.

I cant get this verified with the m5 because all videos show it in either motor drive or with the AF enable. Can someone here check and see if there is a shutter lag in the m5 in single shot mode AND with the af OFF. Thanks a bunch!

 

[Deleted member 378664]

7. no build in intervalometer (but it can be triggered with an external remote control).

correction to this one:
There is a time lapse functionality in video mode. But it is limited to some degree.
The camera itself finishes the time lapse video. You do not need to do that in post. You are getting a video out of cam.
The longest interval time between two shots can be 30 sec. and the highest count of pictures taken is 900. This results in a max. video length of 36 sek.

regards
Frank

 

[bholliman]

I've had my M5 for 5 days now, and still haven't had time to do any expensive shooting with it. I did take a few dozen shots of the kids playing outside yesterday and was pleased with the auto focus hit rate in servo mode. My keeper rate was very good for still trying to figure out how to use the camera.

There is a noticeable lag when viewing images on the lcd screen, but not enough to be an issue for me.

This evening, I took some bracketed tripod shots of the sunset with the 15-45mm kit lens that turned out very nice from what I can tell from the jpg's. I'll open up DPP tonight and see what I can do with the RAW files (looking forward to the Adobe LR update).

 

[Frodo]

Hey gang, question on shutter lag (without af).
...
In single frame mode, the m3 has a shutter delay even with af off!

Just tried this with my M3. 18-55mm with AF off. No lag to speak of.

 

[overniven]

Is the M5 better with adapted lenses than the M3 was? I couldn't use my 70-200 F4. It's focusing was very very slow.

 

[crashpc]

Night and day overniven, night and day...

 

[d]

I'm yet to see any info on whether the M5 exhibits the same amount of vignetting as the M3, M2, M etc, or has managed to reduce this. Can anyone comment or has read something somewhere?

d.

 

[photogdan]

I'm yet to see any info on whether the M5 exhibits the same amount of vignetting as the M3, M2, M etc, or has managed to reduce this. Can anyone comment or has read something somewhere?

d.

I've only had mine for a couple of hours but I haven't noticed any vignetting issue. I haven't done specific tests, just a few sample shots. Then again it wasn't an issue for me on the M or M3.

What did jump out at me immediately is the improved dynamic range and noise performance over the M and M3. Maybe I'm just excited about a new toy but the IQ seems to be a very nice improvement over the M3.

 

[Deleted member 378664]

I'm yet to see any info on whether the M5 exhibits the same amount of vignetting as the M3, M2, M etc, or has managed to reduce this. Can anyone comment or has read something somewhere?

d.

Vignetting is an attribute of lenses only. Has noting to do with the cam/sensor behind the lens. The M5 has an aps-c sensor with the same physical dimensions as the M's before and the distance to the mount is also the same. Why should any vignetting (caused by the lenses) has gone away with the M5? That's physical not possible.

Frank

 

[Fleetie]

I'm yet to see any info on whether the M5 exhibits the same amount of vignetting as the M3, M2, M etc, or has managed to reduce this. Can anyone comment or has read something somewhere?

d.

Vignetting is an attribute of lenses only. Has noting to do with the cam/sensor behind the lens. The M5 has an aps-c sensor with the same physical dimensions as the M's before and the distance to the mount is also the same. Why should any vignetting (caused by the lenses) has gone away with the M5? That's physical not possible.

Except it is. The short flange distance of the M series means that light hitting the corners and edges of the sensor does so at a more oblique angle (away from the normal, which is the ideal), than is the case with longer-flange-diatance DSLRs. This means that less of the light makes it to the photodiodes underneath the microlenses and the colour filters.

I think I read that Leica addressed this in their own M-series rangefinder digital cameras, which also have a short flange distance, by modifying the microlenses at the edges and corners of the sensor, to increase the amount of light that gets to the photodiodes.

Without such measures, what you see is vignetting.

 

[Deleted member 378664]

Vignetting is an attribute of lenses only. Has noting to do with the cam/sensor behind the lens. The M5 has an aps-c sensor with the same physical dimensions as the M's before and the distance to the mount is also the same. Why should any vignetting (caused by the lenses) has gone away with the M5? That's physical not possible.

Except it is. The short flange distance of the M series means that light hitting the corners and edges of the sensor does so at a more oblique angle (away from the normal, which is the ideal), than is the case with longer-flange-diatance DSLRs. This means that less of the light makes it to the photodiodes underneath the microlenses and the colour filters.

But one can not expect that this kind of vigentting is getting better with the M5 in respect to the M3 or M without changing this flange distance and therefor introducing yet another mount. EF-M is EF-M, same lenses same sensor sizes, same flange distances -> no change in the kind of vignetting you described. It is inherent within the M system.

 

[AvTvM]

...
I think I read that Leica addressed this in their own M-series rangefinder digital cameras, which also have a short flange distance, by modifying the microlenses at the edges and corners of the sensor, to increase the amount of light that gets to the photodiodes.

don#t you think Canon might be doing this as well?

 

[Fleetie]

...
I think I read that Leica addressed this in their own M-series rangefinder digital cameras, which also have a short flange distance, by modifying the microlenses at the edges and corners of the sensor, to increase the amount of light that gets to the photodiodes.

don#t you think Canon might be doing this as well?

Yes, they may very well be. And I hope they are. And I hope it's being done physically, to the microlenses, rather than just in software/firmware.

 

[Fleetie]

Vignetting is an attribute of lenses only. Has noting to do with the cam/sensor behind the lens. The M5 has an aps-c sensor with the same physical dimensions as the M's before and the distance to the mount is also the same. Why should any vignetting (caused by the lenses) has gone away with the M5? That's physical not possible.

Except it is. The short flange distance of the M series means that light hitting the corners and edges of the sensor does so at a more oblique angle (away from the normal, which is the ideal), than is the case with longer-flange-diatance DSLRs. This means that less of the light makes it to the photodiodes underneath the microlenses and the colour filters.

But one can not expect that this kind of vigentting is getting better with the M5 in respect to the M3 or M without changing this flange distance and therefor introducing yet another mount. EF-M is EF-M, same lenses same sensor sizes, same flange distances -> no change in the kind of vignetting you described. It is inherent within the M system.

Not true. Canon *could* have modified the faceting of the microlenses on the M5 sensor, to reduce the vignetting effect, by increasing the amount of light reaching the photodiodes on the periphery.

Whether they *have* done so, I do not know.