Industry News: Sony officially announces the Alpha A7s III

BeenThere

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Sep 4, 2012
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I can honestly say I am going to buy this camera, Canon has officially shit the bed with a hybrid camera. If the 1DX didn’t have a record limit And 4k120 I would be purchasing that for a all around camera. This thing honestly looks Pretty amazing, I have been saying for a while along with many other people I don’t care about insanely higher resolutions just give us a really good 4K and I think Sony has delivered that, I will still keep my 1DC’s and a lot of my other stuff but this thing is going to be an awesome tool to have. It’s weird seeing canon push the envelope and have reliability issues and now we are seeing Sony becoming the reliable workhorse.
Exactly the way purchasing decisions should be made. Get what works best for you in your situation. Nobody knows your needs better than you. Go forth and make great videos.
 

addola

Sold my soul for a flippy screen
Nov 16, 2015
129
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Impressive camera from Sony, and it doesn't overheat when shooting video, apparently!

AF detection down to -6 EV @ f/2.0 is crazy impressive! Compared to the R6, that means it can focus in conditions that are a stop darker because the R6 is rated @ f/1.2, granted this is a 12 MP camera vs a 20 MP sensor.
 

privatebydesign

Garfield is back...
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So ok to mention Sony overheating (after an hour?), but everyone gangs up on ya if you mention Canon overheating at 20 minutes....then 3 minutes...
People are shooting over an hour of video on the R5 and R6, just not at the highest frame rates and resolution, forum and media posting would have you believe that isn't possible. People might be limited to shooting 3min of 8k AFTER an hour of being in a high frame rate continuous shooting situation with 1,100 shots and 120Hz screen use, that doesn't sound like an unrealistic performance limit for a 5 series, I'd expect a 1 series to never stop so would not expect to see current 8k in it!

Personally I think everything is fair game, I don't care when something will stop working, Canon or Sony, I just assume that is a performance limit but I do want to know when it will stop working. If I schedule a 90 minute interview and want to shoot long form then I need to know my camera can shoot video for over 90mins, no Canon hybrids can they are all limited to 29:59, simple, a Canon isn't the tool for that job.
 

davidhfe

EOS RP
Sep 9, 2015
303
447
I don't disagree at all - I guess I'm just not there yet.

My wife just explained it to me this way:

Some people look at photos that come out of a cell phone and think they look great. Photographers look at photos that come out of a cell phone and all they see are the faults. I'm guilty of this. Cell phone photos are better than they used to be but TO ME they don't compare with a dedicated stills camera.

I guess video specs are the same to the guys that are heavily into that. I just look at $3,500 dollars for this and wonder why people don't just buy a dedicated video camera whose whole purpose in life is to shoot video? I guess there aren't many options with these features at that price point.
There's nothing at this price point and form factor. I honestly have no idea why video shooters love the SLR style so much—they're designed for viewfinder use—but they do seem to so who am I to argue.
 

Pape

EOS RP
Dec 31, 2018
595
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Maybe canon still makes model bit like this someday
12mpixel super computing photogrpahy camera what can do 4k for movie peoples too as side effect.
 

Codebunny

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Sep 5, 2018
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So they really went for the daft smaller CF Express A cards. Seems like they are set on small bodies and going to a different memory card standard than the big boys.
 
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This is sure to be an amazing camera. I was tempted to cancel my R5 order, but as a 75% video/25% photo guy, I simply can't photograph a high-end wedding with 12mp.

And while I can't speak for others, I'm not hesitant to shoot professional video with the R5. I'm doubtful any of my paying clients could tell a difference between the regular 4k (which doesn't overheat) and the "HQ" over-sampled mode (a mode that has to be turned on...R5 4k/24p overheating doesn't just happen out of the box like most are thinking). And my suspicion is that 90% of those furiously complaining about overheating couldn't spot the difference without a side-by-side comparison. Surely nobody on a low-res (1080) monitor or on their phone is. Do I wish the HQ mode didn't overheat? You betcha. But I'm glad Canon gave it to us with limitation rather than not at all.

I'm also surprised nobody is talking about the oversampled 4k crop mode on the R5 (which has no overheating issues). For best quality video (and constant reliability) I foresee myself using this mode almost exclusively. Super35 fov, with DPAF, oversampled 5.1k into 4k, 10 bit 4::2:2 C-log..... Everyone running around with super shallow DOF on the FF hype train has given it somewhat amateur associations IMO. I'm a big fan of stopping down a bit on S35 and letting composition and lighting do the cinematic lifting. Most movies are shot on S35, afterall.

Ultimately, very few people are going to be limited by what they can do creatively, or the revenue they can generate professionally, with almost any camera from any manufacturer these days. These are incredible tools across the board. As a hybrid shooter though, the R5 still seems the best option. Hoping mine arrives this week to thoroughly test.
 

davidhfe

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Sep 9, 2015
303
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People are shooting over an hour of video on the R5 and R6, just not at the highest frame rates and resolution, forum and media posting would have you believe that isn't possible. People might be limited to shooting 3min of 8k AFTER an hour of being in a high frame rate continuous shooting situation with 1,100 shots and 120Hz screen use, that doesn't sound like an unrealistic performance limit for a 5 series, I'd expect a 1 series to never stop so would not expect to see current 8k in it!

Personally I think everything is fair game, I don't care when something will stop working, Canon or Sony, I just assume that is a performance limit but I do want to know when it will stop working. If I schedule a 90 minute interview and want to shoot long form then I need to know my camera can shoot video for over 90mins, no Canon hybrids can they are all limited to 29:59, simple, a Canon isn't the tool for that job.
This is the great irony here. The R5 has video performance that's on par with everything else in it's class—Z7, A7R4, Leica, etc. That is, soft/aliased full frame and great S35 performance. The IBIS is a bit aggressive for wide angle shooting, but it's got great AF. There are a few issues though:

- First, Canon screwed up with the release here. Hindsight is 20/20, but they should have shoved half the video modes into a custom function and not hyped up this being all things to all people.
- Second, folks want the R5 to be that "be all end all" camera because Canon doesn't have an answer here other than spend 2x as much for a cinema body. It's again making it look like canon either "can't" do these things or "doesn't want" to do these things to protect a cinema cam line.
- Lastly, the R6 is in a really tough spot. It's low res for 2020, but that could be forgiven if it was hitting the DR and rolling shutter performance of the A7SIII. And because of the body construction, it's got some thermal issues.

--

Took a quick break to watch Gerald's video. Canon really needs to stay on their toes here. Sony continues to make inroads on every complaint area—menus, EVF, ergonomics, autofocus, and they are clearly continuing to work hard on sensor fabs. If I'm Canon, I'm very concerned about what an A7R5 starts to look like.

--

The issue here is that everyone is in a total state of flux with the new mounts. If I'm a hybrid shooter on an A7R4 and need video capabilities, I know I can pick up a second body that tucks into my bag and uses the same cards, batteries, accessories. An R5 shooter doesn't have that option right now. In the past, you could do lean on Canon stills and Sony video, all using EF. But as EF shooters move to RF, that flexibility is gone. You start to look a lot more locked in to your system, and the Sony system is finally looking attractive.
 

TomR

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Jun 9, 2020
135
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So you're expecting the A7R4 to be discontinued today?
Obviously talking about the video side. I'm sure the stills are great on the r5, but that's all it is, once you start shooting stills you can't go to video cause the camera is overheated.

On the flip side 12 mpx is enough for me cause I only post photos to social. If you shoot prints the Sony is obviously not the camera for you
 
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davidhfe

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I'm also surprised nobody is talking about the oversampled 4k crop mode on the R5 (which has no overheating issues). For best quality video (and constant reliability) I foresee myself using this mode almost exclusively. Super35 fov, with DPAF, oversampled 5.1k into 4k, 10 bit 4::2:2 C-log..... Everyone running around with super shallow DOF on the FF hype train has given it somewhat amateur associations IMO. I'm a big fan of stopping down a bit on S35 and letting composition and lighting do the cinematic lifting. Most movies are shot on S35, afterall.
I'm about 90% stills, 10% video and see myself using the S35 crop almost exclusively. Especially now that I can mount an EF-S lens—I have an 10-22 that's been hiding in a drawer for the last 4 years.
 

NorskHest

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There's nothing at this price point and form factor. I honestly have no idea why video shooters love the SLR style so much—they're designed for viewfinder use—but they do seem to so who am I to argue.
I film a lot of protest and political content, the ability to do foto and video is indespensible as a freelancer. I sell footage and go into places most don't so to have both is a must. Here in Minneapolis I was out shooting and my 16-35 and 1dc were hit by rubber bullets, amazing the lens was ok and so was the body. They were not point blank but there was a blunt object that hit them. There is no denying that there is a place and time for all sorts of cameras but the low light of this a7 camera will allow for cleaner and more usable content. While out filming protests I witnessed people tying to steal news crews big cameras and people tried taking mine aswell but a slr style body is something tou can actually hold and run with if you need to. Will a sony take a betting like a 1d? probably not but to have both is a great thing. on a side not all these great tools coming out we never could have dreamed of, there is often so much anger and shit talk from our tribalism that we dont actually look and the genius ehind the tech. if you shoot sony thats great, if you shoot canon, thats great too. we should stop always fighting and just start capturing and using and adapting the tools that best suit us. and here is a link of what i shoot.
https://www.fox9.com/news/the-fall-of-the-third-precinct-a-timeline-of-events
 
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privatebydesign

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This is the great irony here. The R5 has video performance that's on par with everything else in it's class—Z7, A7R4, Leica, etc. That is, soft/aliased full frame and great S35 performance. The IBIS is a bit aggressive for wide angle shooting, but it's got great AF. There are a few issues though:

- First, Canon screwed up with the release here. Hindsight is 20/20, but they should have shoved half the video modes into a custom function and not hyped up this being all things to all people.
- Second, folks want the R5 to be that "be all end all" camera because Canon doesn't have an answer here other than spend 2x as much for a cinema body. It's again making it look like canon either "can't" do these things or "doesn't want" to do these things to protect a cinema cam line.
- Lastly, the R6 is in a really tough spot. It's low res for 2020, but that could be forgiven if it was hitting the DR and rolling shutter performance of the A7SIII. And because of the body construction, it's got some thermal issues.

--

Took a quick break to watch Gerald's video. Canon really needs to stay on their toes here. Sony continues to make inroads on every complaint area—menus, EVF, ergonomics, autofocus, and they are clearly continuing to work hard on sensor fabs. If I'm Canon, I'm very concerned about what an A7R5 starts to look like.

--

The issue here is that everyone is in a total state of flux with the new mounts. If I'm a hybrid shooter on an A7R4 and need video capabilities, I know I can pick up a second body that tucks into my bag and uses the same cards, batteries, accessories. An R5 shooter doesn't have that option right now. In the past, you could do lean on Canon stills and Sony video, all using EF. But as EF shooters move to RF, that flexibility is gone. You start to look a lot more locked in to your system, and the Sony system is finally looking attractive.
Canon don't need to do anything, the R5 and the sleeper R6 are going to be hits with primarily photographers, Sony look like they have done a very accomplished incremental upgrade in the α7S III, but it is overwhelmingly a video camera and less a hybrid.

I don't see any competition at all if you know what market you are in the choice is pretty clear. Unfortunately for Canon most YouTube personalities and social media influencers are in the Sony video centric market, they shoot video and don't care about stills resolution over 1080px instagram posts, but I do not believe they represent the market in general. I have zero need for an α7S III, I will be getting an R5.

Indeed even comparing the α7S III and R5 is intrinsically biased (one way or the other) as their feature sets are as diametrically opposed as possible. Compare the R5 to the α7R IV, compare the R6 to the α7 III, truthfully Canon haven't pitched a video centric hybrid in the α7S III market.
 

davidhfe

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Sep 9, 2015
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Obviously talking about the video side. I'm sure the stills are great on the r5, but that's all it is, once you start shooting stills you can't go to video cause the camera is overheated.

On the flip side 12 mpx is enough for me cause I only post photos to social. If you shoot prints the Sony is obviously not the camera for you
Hmm, see that's a lot more nuanced than "shat down canons throat" and is a proposition I'm in total agreement with. The A7S3 is great for video but won't hit my needs as a photographer. The R5 is great for stills, but doesn't hit the needs of pro video shooters. A 12 MP instagram post looks lousy on printed at A3+. The soft 4k from the canon's full frame 4K will look pretty great on instagram, but crappy if you're targeting 4K TV delivery.

No quarter to canon hyping up the 8k, but these are different cameras.
 
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Bert63

What’s in da box?
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No my friend it is actually overheated after 23mins at 4k60 even overheated before the R5 which is strange

Not so strange perhaps. It'll be interesting to see what the reviewers experience when they start putting the camera through its paces.

Another user here stated that this camera can do 4K120 with no limits or overheating but I can't find anything that supports that assertion.
 

privatebydesign

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Not so strange perhaps. It'll be interesting to see what the reviewers experience when they start putting the camera through its paces.

Another user here stated that this camera can do 4K120 with no limits or overheating but I can't find anything that supports that assertion.
 
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davidhfe

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Sep 9, 2015
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Canon don't need to do anything, the R5 and the sleeper R6 are going to be hits with primarily photographers, Sony look like they have done a very accomplished incremental upgrade in the α7S III, but it is overwhelmingly a video camera not a hybrid.

I don't see any competition at all if you know what market you are in the choice is pretty clear. Unfortunately for Canon most YouTube personalities and social media influencers are in the Sony video centric market, they shoot video and don't care about stills resolution over 1080px instagram posts, but I do not believe they represent the market in general. I have zero need for an α7S III, I will be getting an R5.

Indeed even comparing the α7S III and R5 is intrinsically biased (one way or the other) as their feature sets are as diametrically opposed as possible. Compare the R5 to the α7R IV, compare the R6 to the α7 III, truthfully Canon haven't pitched a video centric hybrid in the α7S III market.
I think they should release a video focused camera in the ILC form factor. Either high MP with cooling in a bigger body, or low MP in the R style body. I don't know that canon has the sensor for the latter. (There's a whole sidebar about the volume advantage Sony has here but I digress). I don't know if that's an XC-R, a R5c, or what.

I, as a Canon shooter about to invest heavily in RF over the next few years (100-500, then an UWA zoom, then go back and replace the EF 24-70 and 70-200), am starting to wonder what an A7R5 will be. I still don't like the aesthetics of Sony/Fuji/Leica (heresy, I know) but with the A7SIII it looks like Sony's got the ergonomics stuff nailed.

Edit: One other note. As I've said I'm 90% stills, and will rent a video body if need be. If I move to RF, I can't rent into the Sony video system anymore without also needing lenses. In the past I'd just grab a metabones and not worry about it. The mount changes are throwing some serious uncertainty into the world for me.
 
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H. Jones

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truthfully Canon haven't pitched a video centric hybrid in the α7S III market.
I'm very interested to see if this is what the coming RF mount camera will be. It could make a lot of sense for Canon to turn the C100 pricepoint into a video-centric hybrid, versus cinema-only, with this in mind. The XC-10 did 12 mp photographs alongside 4K video, which was definitely a slight attempt towards a hybrid.

I definitely don't think Canon would lose much of anything by allowing a 12 megapixel C100 RF mount replacement to also shoot stills now that Sony has pushed ahead with a 12 megapixel A7SIII.