The Canon EOS R5 C has been rejected for Netflix Certification

[RunAndGun]

Maybe it’s as simple as the R5C doesn’t have built in ND?

Lots of Netflix approved cams with no internal ND(like RED or the aforementioned FX3).

 

[RunAndGun]

And everyone always seems to forget or just doesn’t understand, the “Netflix Approved” camera list only applies to Netflix Original programming. For example, if someone went out and shot a doc on an iPhone 4 and Netflix liked it and wanted it, it’s fine. The “standard” only applies to their produced content.

 

[Scenes]

Lots of Netflix approved cams with no internal ND(like RED or the aforementioned FX3).

Fair point

 

[Scenes]

And everyone always seems to forget or just doesn’t understand, the “Netflix Approved” camera list only applies to Netflix Original programming. For example, if someone went out and shot a doc on an iPhone 4 and Netflix liked it and wanted it, it’s fine. The “standard” only applies to their produced content.

I think most people here understand that. And as some industry guys have pointed out, if you’re shooting freelance in LA it’s pretty much a requirement to have a netlfix approved camera as right or wrong it’s what the market wants. For the rest of us it’s more a badge of honour and bragging rights to clients.

 

[jam05]

It's a B cam. Who would need to use it more than 10% on a Netflix production? Ten percent is a lot of B roll for one individual camera. Certainly wouldn't be used as a main camera for Netflix anyhow. No need to address it at the moment or ever even. Basically a nothing burger. Something for nerds to chat about.

 

[jam05]

I think most people here understand that. And as some industry guys have pointed out, if you’re shooting freelance in LA it’s pretty much a requirement to have a netlfix approved camera as right or wrong it’s what the market wants. For the rest of us it’s more a badge of honour and bragging rights to client

 

[jam05]

A freelance in LA has no requirement to have a netflix approved camera nor do many adhere to such BS. If Netflix wants your content, it won't matter. If Kevin Hart's producer says that he's gonna use some B roll from a non certified camera, that's what they do. Who you are, matters. If you're a nobody and don't know anybody then one jumps through hoops that many don't have to.

 

[sirbarton]

The Netflix approval is a good and bad thing. As multiple people have mentioned, it really only applies to Original productions and all studios have guidelines for image acquisition. The difference is that Netflix (like most streamers) is a Studio and a Network. You can make content on lots of non-approved cameras and the Netflix "Network" can acquire the streaming rights and it doesn't matter.

But the upside is that they test cameras and they provide really succinct "best practices" on their website for all to view. It's not just something sent to produciton and post when a production starts.

The reality is that most viewers wouldn't know the difference from a RED Monster 8K acquired program and one shot on and Alexa XT upscaled to 4K. In fact a lot of cinematographers would prefer the Alexa.

 

[Scenes]

Thought… could it be the micro HDMI?

 

[Scenes]

A freelance in LA has no requirement to have a netflix approved camera nor do many adhere to such BS. If Netflix wants your content, it won't matter. If Kevin Hart's producer says that he's gonna use some B roll from a non certified camera, that's what they do. Who you are, matters. If you're a nobody and don't know anybody then one jumps through hoops that many don't have to.

Just going by what Freelancers in LA have said earlier in this thread. Are you in LA yourself? I'm not, so be great to hear a different take on it if it doesn't effect your work?

"Even if you have no intention to shoot something for Netflix, if you work in the entertainment business in LA, having a Netflix-approved system increases the value and usability of your camera." - Robotfist

 

[DBounce]

Gerald undone video review and DP Reviews web review spring to mind. It has two stops extra usable dynamic range compared to the R5. It’s pretty well established it’s why the footage cuts so well with C70 and Red Komodo comparisons.

Edit- attaching a still from CineD going in depth on usable range tests. It's 2 stops better than the R5.
https://www.cined.com/canon-eos-r5-c-lab-test-rolling-shutter-dynamic-range-and-latitude/

View attachment 205600

Nothing you have posted compared or referenced the Canon Eos R3 in respects to the R5C. Cined has yet to do any test of Canon’s newest sensor technology that is found in the R3. I believe you are thinking of comparisons to the R5 vs R5C… of which there are numerous to choose from. Zero for the R3. That goes for Mr.Undone also.

 

[Juangrande]

Not really. I have a R5 C. The idea of getting a R3 went through my mind and I dropped after the announcement of the R5 C.

My line of thinking was: get a R5. I've rented one and the overheat was a major issue for me. I let go.

Then the R3 was announced, but the camera did have some issues with overheating in slow motion. I was about to pull the plug on regardless, then Canon announced the R5 C and I got it instead.

The biggest difference between the R5 C and all of the Canon's mirrorless cameras is control. When shooting slowmotion, I can choose the project frame rate (24, 30 or 60) and also how many frames I'm shooting (up to 120). On the R5 and R3 I'm stuck in project with 30 frames and shooting 120. This is far from ideal.

The other thing was the IBIS. IBIS is a major plague when rigging a camera to a vehicle, so we use fixed sensor cameras. The R5 C solves that by getting rid of the IBIS.

Again, these things are minor, but it works seamless for me and the work that I do.

I thought IBIS was something that could be turned off. So how could that be an issue when rigging to a vehicle. Just turn it off, or am I missing something?

 

[Scenes]

Nothing you have posted compared or referenced the Canon Eos R3 in respects to the R5C. Cined has yet to do any test of Canon’s newest sensor technology that is found in the R3. I believe you are thinking of comparisons to the R5 vs R5C… of which there are numerous to choose from. Zero for the R3. That goes for Mr.Undone also.

Yes, apologies. You're correct. But I thought it was also established in many comparisons between the R3 and R5 they had pretty much the same dynamic range? So if the R5C is an established 2 stops wider than the R5 why would a direct R5C to R3 comparison show anything different?

 

[Scenes]

I thought IBIS was something that could be turned off. So how could that be an issue when rigging to a vehicle. Just turn it off, or am I missing something?

As I understand it turning if off just essentially parks the sensor in the middle of the magnets that suspend it. That doesn't mean it can't be jiggled around and inadversly affect the image when off in things like fast pans or car mounts - unlike an actual fixed sensor that doesn't have IBIS. I think CVP? in the UK did a great car rig comparison video showing this.

 

[adrian_bacon]

But here's the thing: if it's a Netflix original, Netflix  is the producer. This certification only counts towards Netflix original productions.

Then why does everybody care that they're using Netflix approved equipment in their productions if Netflix isn't already in touch with them about their production? In the hopes that Netflix will notice and pick them up first as a Netflix original? This is where I have my issue... In that case, Netflix isn't really the producer, they're just simply first in line, and should be just giving minimum video specs for finished video like most other broadcasters do. If memory serves, for standard over the air broadcast, it's 1080 in mpeg2, 8 bit 422 at 50Mbps or something like that, at least here in the US. I haven't had to submit anything for standard broadcast for a while so I could be wrong there, but what equipment you use in those scenarios is irrelevant as long as your finished video conforms. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for standardizing things across the board as it generally makes everybody's life easier, but that standardization shouldn't be in the hands of Netflix alone.

 

[RunAndGun]

Then why does everybody care that they're using Netflix approved equipment in their productions if Netflix isn't already in touch with them about their production? In the hopes that Netflix will notice and pick them up first as a Netflix original? This is where I have my issue... In that case, Netflix isn't really the producer, they're just simply first in line, and should be just giving minimum video specs for finished video like most other broadcasters do. If memory serves, for standard over the air broadcast, it's 1080 in mpeg2, 8 bit 422 at 50Mbps or something like that, at least here in the US. I haven't had to submit anything for standard broadcast for a while so I could be wrong there, but what equipment you use in those scenarios is irrelevant as long as your finished video conforms. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for standardizing things across the board as it generally makes everybody's life easier, but that standardization shouldn't be in the hands of Netflix alone.

Kind of going off down a rabbit hole, but you do bring up a good point. There are (big) differences in acquisition, delivery and broadcast(to the viewer) specs. I'd say the majority of us on here don't have to worry about anything except the acquisition specs, as we're not delivering finished content(i.e: fully produced, ready-to-air shows) to networks or "airing" that finished content ourselves(in the more traditional sense, not YouTube channels, etc.).

If anyone want to have some "fun", look up the (show) delivery specs for PBS...

 

[WhatDoesMStandsFor]

Then why does everybody care that they're using Netflix approved equipment in their productions if Netflix isn't already in touch with them about their production? In the hopes that Netflix will notice and pick them up first as a Netflix original? This is where I have my issue... In that case, Netflix isn't really the producer, they're just simply first in line, and should be just giving minimum video specs for finished video like most other broadcasters do.

Not really. A good example was The Edge of Democracy, a doc shot in Brazil. Netflix didn't have any hand on it until the post production - when they've closed the deal, they had to recut the whole doc to acomodate +90% of a certified camera. Good thing they had shot most of it on a C300 Mk II, which is certified.

So yeah, in most cases Netflix is involved from the beginning, but there are cases in which they get involved in a later stage, and this avoids extra costs in reshooting.

 

[DBounce]

Yes, apologies. You're correct. But I thought it was also established in many comparisons between the R3 and R5 they had pretty much the same dynamic range? So if the R5C is an established 2 stops wider than the R5 why would a direct R5C to R3 comparison show anything different?

View attachment 205607

That’s not video dynamic range. That is stills.

 

[WhatDoesMStandsFor]

It's a B cam. Who would need to use it more than 10% on a Netflix production? Ten percent is a lot of B roll for one individual camera. Certainly wouldn't be used as a main camera for Netflix anyhow.

Have you ever watched Hyperdrive? There's a lot of cameras placed everywhere. You can reach 10% of a whole production pretty quickly.

And I've heard there was trouble at some point, because they had to start rigging RED cameras to the cars, as at the time there was no viable alternative. And in a motorsposrt competition, rigging a fully built cinema camera can add a ton of weight to the car and be dangerous to the driver. Far from ideal.

 

[WhatDoesMStandsFor]

Thought… could it be the micro HDMI?

Doubt it. If they really cared about this, they would ask for SDI in all of certified cameras.