There may be a higher-end APS-C mirrorless announced in late 2020, early 2021 [CR2]

flip314

EOS RP
Sep 26, 2018
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You all might be missing the real opportunity here: 800mm f/11 + RF-S speed booster on an RF-S body. Ratchet that image circle down to 1.6 crop, and you now have an effective 1120mm f/8. In fact, that might be the primary reason those f/11 lenses exist.
No, the speedbooster works like a reversed teleconverter so the effective focal length doesn't much change from the original lens. The 800mm f/11 would be closer to 800mm f/8.

The only way you get the extra stop is by focusing extra light onto the APS-C sensor (shrinking the image circle), while the reason you see a crop otherwise is that the image circle is larger than the sensor.
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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No, the speedbooster works like a reversed teleconverter so the effective focal length doesn't much change from the original lens. The 800mm f/11 would be closer to 800mm f/8.

The only way you get the extra stop is by focusing extra light onto the APS-C sensor (shrinking the image circle), while the reason you see a crop otherwise is that the image circle is larger than the sensor.
It actually works in the opposite direction from tiggy's calculation.

A 1.6X speedbooster on an 800mm lens gives the lens+speedbooster combination an actual focal length of 500mm. Then you apply the 1.6X "crop factor" and you're right back at an "effective" 800mm field of view.
 

Michael Clark

Now we see through a glass, darkly...
Apr 5, 2016
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Does Nikon have a separate APS-C line and mount for mirrorless? I know they had a small sensor mirrorless for awhile, but it wasn't APS-C. I can't find anything on their site about a line of mirrorless bodies specifically for APS-C similar to Canon's M mount.
The Z50 is a new Z-mount APS-C camera. The Nikon Z50 has been called a "mirrorless D500" by some.

It's kind of like a potential R7, which is being touted as a "mirrorless 7D".
 

unfocused

EOS-1D X Mark III
Jul 20, 2010
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So, Nikon has introduced a camera many consider the successor to the D500, correct?
Interesting. Are you sure you are talking about the right camera?

DPReview on the Z50:

The company says the camera is designed to attract a generation of users who don't consider themselves to be photographers... In keeping with its Instagram-friendly intent, the Z50 can shoot images with a series of significant processing effects applied...the way the AF system is implemented is clumsy and a little slower to operate than most of its rivals... The thing we like most about the Canon EOS M6 II is something it has in common with the Z50: comfortable, straightforward ergonomics and a generally well-sorted user interface. The Canon's AF features are better integrated but there's not much of a performance gap....there are more lenses that match the M6 II, which gives it the edge, for now.
 
Jul 26, 2020
6
2
I’m really keen to get a replacement for my 7D mark ii
I like the R6 with the animal autofocus, powerful Digic X processor and great low light performance but not keen on losing the extra reach of the crop factor and the RF lenses like the RF 100-500 are ridiculously expensive compared with the EF 100-400 or my old EF 400 f/5.6 and the RF extenders are overpriced and can’t be stacked together
My dream camera would use the R6 with a downsized version of it’s 20 mp sensor with same pixel density to make a sensor of approximately 8 mp which would be like a crop of it’s full frame sensor so you get the low light performance with a file size of only 40% of the R6
People will moan that 8 mp is too little but that’s bullshit : 8 million pixels is massive on a crop sensor !
If you crop a full frame 20 mp image from a 1 DX iii or an R6 down to aps-c crop it will still look great if the image was good quality to start with
I’d much rather have fewer high quality large pixels that absorb lots of light than lots of tiny ones which can’t capture much light
The 7D2‘s worst weak point is it’s low light performance compared to full frame because it has too many tiny pixels crammed onto it’s little sensor
thanks
 

SteveC

R5
Sep 3, 2019
1,205
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I’m really keen to get a replacement for my 7D mark ii
I like the R6 with the animal autofocus, powerful Digic X processor and great low light performance but not keen on losing the extra reach of the crop factor and the RF lenses like the RF 100-500 are ridiculously expensive compared with the EF 100-400 or my old EF 400 f/5.6 and the RF extenders are overpriced and can’t be stacked together
My dream camera would use the R6 with a downsized version of it’s 20 mp sensor with same pixel density to make a sensor of approximately 8 mp which would be like a crop of it’s full frame sensor so you get the low light performance with a file size of only 40% of the R6
People will moan that 8 mp is too little but that’s bullshit : 8 million pixels is massive on a crop sensor !
If you crop a full frame 20 mp image from a 1 DX iii or an R6 down to aps-c crop it will still look great if the image was good quality to start with
I’d much rather have fewer high quality large pixels that absorb lots of light than lots of tiny ones which can’t capture much light
The 7D2‘s worst weak point is it’s low light performance compared to full frame because it has too many tiny pixels crammed onto it’s little sensor
thanks
If 8MP is adequate in your hands and for your purposes they won't look better on a camera that has them in crop versus 20 MP in non-crop.

(From what you wrote I got the impression you may be laboring under the mistaken belief that it would, but I wasn't sure of that. So I decided to clarify that point just in case.)
 
Jul 26, 2020
6
2
If 8MP is adequate in your hands and for your purposes they won't look better on a camera that has them in crop versus 20 MP in non-crop.

(From what you wrote I got the impression you may be laboring under the mistaken belief that it would, but I wasn't sure of that. So I decided to clarify that point just in case.)
Well with the crop sensor we will have a compromise of some sort so perhaps a downsized R5 sensor would work better which would be about 17 mp ?
 

SteveC

R5
Sep 3, 2019
1,205
972
Well with the crop sensor we will have a compromise of some sort so perhaps a downsized R5 sensor would work better which would be about 17 mp ?
Who knows? Actually, my guess is that I would expect the 90D/M6-II sensor (already developed, very fast performer, but 32 MP), long before I'd expect them to actually create a totally new 17 or 8 MP sensor for this camera. (And that's true whether it ends up behind an EF-M mount or an RF mount.) But then again, if they perceive that the market for this camera wants lower resolution, I could end up being mildly surprised.

If the sole issue you have with whatever they do is: too high a resolution, you can partially mitigate it by simply having the camera take lower-res pictures. That would certainly solve any file size issues. To be sure it would have to do some conversions, but you'd get some noise reduction from that. (I'm already looking forward to dealing with 45 MP starting Thursday/Friday!)
 
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masterpix

EOS 90D
Jun 29, 2016
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And again one might ask the question, if I have the R5 with 45MP sensor, crop it to 2/3 size means that any sensor below 20MP is not going to be any APS-C advantage over the R5. So they will ahve to get at least something like the D90 sensor into the R5 body to get anything close to 7D replacement. just think of the 800mm lens on 2/3 crop sensor... 1300mm? that will be a monster.
 
Jul 26, 2020
6
2
The blue part above is the slippery slope. If R7 is a mirrorless 7D3 and that is all they offer with R mount + APS-C, they can (as others have said here) get away with just 2-3 crop RF lenses -- an ultrawide zoom a la EF-M 11-22, standard zoom a la EF-M 15-45 or 18-55, etc.

But they minute they cross over into the bigger / wider use-case / more varied userbases of general crop shooters (even at the 90D price point), there will be pressure to offer a proper line of crop-only RF glass -- they'll want small telephoto zooms, 60mm 1:1 macro, pancakes, etc. That's tantamount to double/triple dipping on EF-S and EF-M, and I think Canon would only go there if they intended to get rid of EF-S altogether. They will certainly eventually get to that point, but it may not be that soon. Crop SLRs still make Canon a ton of money, don't they?

- A
People buy 7Ds for using with big telephoto lens not wide angle but could use a speed booster adapter to use existing wide angle EF lens
 
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