Two New Full Frame Cameras in 2014? [CR1]

[scottkinfw]

congrats on the PhD- a great accomplishment.

sek

 

[Rienzphotoz]

two new full frame cameras coming in 2014 with availability in the early part of 2015.

EXCITING!

 

[scottkinfw]

I am with you on this Dylan. I am just trying landscape photog this week so I can see what many are saying about more DR (please no flame wars, but I do now see the point). Having used the camera almost since it came out, I am still trying to master it. Hopefully by the time the IV comes out, I will have done so. So my addition/question to you post is, beyond what we agree on, what else might be on the horizon that could make the IV great, that we didn't think of? Hmmmm?

sek

To get me upgrade to 5D Mark IV, Canon needs to have these:

1. One full stop better in high ISO
2. 8-10 fps (even when the battery at 3/4 or half left)
3. Tries not to sell @ $4000 from beginning, then, drops to $2500 few months later

 

[J.R.]

At this point, I'm completely satisfied with the MK3. What I'd like is some new lenses.

+1 ... Same here.

 

[scottkinfw]

What is BVI?

To get me upgrade to 5D Mark IV, Canon needs to have these:

1. One full stop better in high ISO
2. 8-10 fps (even when the battery at 3/4 or half left)
3. Tries not to sell @ $4000 from beginning, then, drops to $2500 few months later

That last point was completely avoidable, If you bought from BVI.

 

[AvTvM]

Eos M Fullframe ?

If it does materialize, I guess AvTvM will be happy ... but then, maybe not because it will be made by Canon

oh yes, I would be very happy to see an EOS M with FF sensor from Canon any time soon.
As a matter of fact I am not anti Canon. I just criticize them for not being more innovative and not giving us better products today rather than just dishing out improvements only in ever so small increments, each of which costs a couple grant.

After all, I do prefer the Canon EOS user interface over anything else I've tried so far from other manufacturers. It is really well done - physical layout, hardware control elements and menu system.
Wow, I guess I am a little too gentle with Canon today. ;D

Now an EOS M ... hell yes, if it has all the good from the 6D [WiFi, GPS, more sensitive central AF field] AND everything good from the 5D III [AF-performance, fps] AND a 36 MP sensor AND 14 EV DR AND 1 EV better ISO 3200 than 5D II ... ah yes, and please totally silent operation - ideally with purely electronic global shutter and X-Sync down to 1/1000s AND not larger than Sony A7R ... AND not more expensive. hehe! ;D

 

[J.R.]

What is BVI?

To get me upgrade to 5D Mark IV, Canon needs to have these:

1. One full stop better in high ISO
2. 8-10 fps (even when the battery at 3/4 or half left)
3. Tries not to sell @ $4000 from beginning, then, drops to $2500 few months later

That last point was completely avoidable, If you bought from BVI.

I initially thought why the heck "British Virgin Islands" ??? but then it struck me ... BigValueInc

 

[RAWShooter126]

Cinema FF in the mid price range (5Dc) would be nice. New 1D model is very likely. But I feel like Canon is sort of the Apple of the photog industry where it continuously pushes new technology, instead of developing around the old ones. Would like to see some epic glass come out so I'm not tempted to jump ship as I think Nikon is slightly better in that department.
I would like to see a FF with some more Dynamic range. Don't care for too many more megapixels because I think 22 on my 5D3 is enough. Low light on the 5D3 isn't bad really, even at 6,400 in my opinion, but I highly doubt I would upgrade at all for the next 3 yeas or so, which a 1D would be my most likely target, if I don't end up with a "D4s" or something, if the green screen tint issue in the D4 is no longer present.

 

[unfocused]

...This is a NL rumor, so take it with a huge grain of salt.

Yes, and it's kind of garbled too.

Break it down:

The 5D IV will push toward higher specs. No Sh*t Sherlock. Did you think it would push toward lower specs? No information on when this would be released. Could be 2015, could be 2016, who knows. Just a random statement tossed in there.

Canon's new studio camera will be the one to maximize image quality Again, let's state the obvious. If it's a studio camera it better maximize image quality, else why make it?

There will be no 3D Of course not, Canon will never use the 3D designation unless they build a stereo camera. Too confusing.

By early 2015 there will be four full frame cameras Let's see: a 6D, a 5D, a 1Dx and a studio camera. Yep, that's four.

Two of which will be announced next year Okay, if they have three cameras now. They aren't replacing any of the three, but adding a fourth, where does the "two" come from. Either somebody is bad with math or one of the three could be updated. But which one?

My suspicion is that the 6D won't be updated for awhile says Keith

I’m willing to wager the EOS 6D won’t be replaced before the EOS 5D Mark III or EOS-1D X. says Craig

First off, neither Keith nor Craig are particularly good at predictions. No assessment of their ability to extract information from inside sources – there is a big difference. Craig has the best sources in the industry, and once a rumor hits CR2 or CR3 he's almost never wrong. I'm just saying that when it comes to personal opinions/predictions, the batting average doesn't seem to be any better than anyone else on this forum.

So, let's discount the idea that the 6D won't be replaced before the 5D or the 1D and put them all on equal footing.

Me, I'd bet on the 6D being updated first. There is a lot of headroom between the 6D and the 5D so Canon could throw a 70D/7D autofocus system into the 6D II without seriously impacting sales of the 5D or 1D. The 6D also seems like a prime candidate for the current dual pixel technology. I don't see 5D or 1D owners particularly caring about that until it shows some significant benefits beyond what it offers in the 70D.

The 1Dx is the oldest in the lineup, so it could be updated, but neither Canon nor Nikon like to update the flagship too frequently because the professional customer base just isn't that into frequent upgrades. Still, a late 2014 announcement with availability in 2015 is certainly possible.

Or, it could be the 5DIII. The only reason to update the 5DIII would be because I just bought one, so with my track record, it could get an update. But, honestly, I'm pretty hard pressed to see what they would update that would motivate buyers to upgrade. Especially since the current 5DIII has been a pretty phenomenal seller.

Bottom line, I'd be surprised to see any of these three updated, but my personal bet is the 6D.

 

[Mt Spokane Photography]

I think that the dual pixel technology will make its way into full frame. Obviously, Canon is putting a lot of effort into the technology, and it might even make the mirror go away sooner than I think its possible.

Getting rid of the mirror and pentaprism is going to reduce manufacturing costs. Canon has already stated that Cameras will be robotically assembled by 2014, so it makes sense to design a simpler camera as soon as its possible.

 

[keithcooper]

"...This is a NL rumor, so take it with a huge grain of salt."

Yes I do too too, sorry I didn't point this out, but I generally assume that anything more than 3 months out gets what here would be an automatic CR1 rating.

Much like Craig I get a lot of (very) obvious rubbish sent (like the detailed list of 14 EF, EF-s and EF-m lenses for 2014 last week) but sometimes it sounds more plausible than others (YMMV)

 

[Marsu42]

If two new full frame cameras are on the horizon and one is an EOS-1DXs type of body, what could the other one be? I’m willing to wager the EOS 6D won’t be replaced before the EOS 5D Mark III or EOS-1D X.

I'd bet on the same side - what do you think?

POLL: 6D2 or 5D4 in 2014?: http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=18330.0

 

[Rick]

Why does a "studio" camera need to be large and heavy? To impress the customers? Weatherproofing? I don't think it'll be raining in the studio.

 

[Chuck Alaimo]

my bet is that the 6d will get it's II marker before we see a 5dIV. It's the entry level model after all, and they can do some very minor tweaks which will improve the camera without interfering with higher level models (5d3 and 1dx).

6d upgrade -

up the frame rate slightly, add the cf card slot, add a sync port...done....that still leaves room for improving (up the sync speed, add a few Xpoints, etc etc...)

edit --- with that said, I could see them announce a 5d14 in 2014! Announce is not release though - if they announce it it won't be released for a while --- they could announce the mk4 in 2014 but release it 2015, then turn around and announce the 6d2 and release it very shortly after (like they do with XXD and XXXD models) (still seems like a really short lifespan for the mk3 though).

 

[Chimay]

Canon will obviously have to respond to the competition (Nikon D800, Sony A7R) and put out a high-end / pro-level camera with more resolution. A new 1 series and a new 5 series are the most obvious answers for that. It doesn't take an oracle to figure out that pretty much any FF camera in the pipeline now will have more pixels than the current line up (as well as, hopefully, better IQ, dynamic range, etc.).

Yes, I know that every time this gets mentioned, there are inevitably people out there who chime in with remarks about how 23mpix is plenty, and how it's not about the pixels, etc. And for those people, that's probably true. But if you are a landscape or architectural photographer - or even if you just like to crop your photos a lot - then you probably want higher resolution and more pixels.

Speaking as an architectural photographer, I can tell you that the ideal tool for my job is a medium format technical camera with a digital back and lenses with no barrel or pin distortion, that I can shift to maintain perspective control and stitch multiple frames together. But they are cumbersome and extremely expensive, so I'm always looking for the best DSLR that gets closest to that ideal. For me, 23mpix barely cuts it. 36 or higher would be welcome.

 

[RGomezPhotos]

Well, the big MP camera is the first obvious camera. But I thought the new 5D would come out in late 2014. Hmm..

I think the 6D is going to be refreshed then. It may be the FF equivalent of the Rebel. A refresh every year or so...

 

[dgatwood]

up the frame rate slightly, add the cf card slot, add a sync port...done....that still leaves room for improving (up the sync speed, add a few Xpoints, etc etc...)

Not sure why they would bother adding a CF slot. SD cards are comparable in maximum speed, and typically lead capacity-wise (256 GB SD cards were available for an entire year before anyone announced a comparable CF card). SD cards also take up less space in your camera bag, and have the advantage of being compatible with readers that are built into most laptops, whereas CF cards aren't.

Two slots of the same type are much more user-friendly than two different slot types, because you don't have to carry around cards of two different types. And given that SD is ahead of CF and is likely to continue pulling ahead (because CF-based devices are basically lost in the noise as a percentage of cameras sold), I'd much rather see them do dual SD cards that can be used either in alternation (which would increase your shots per second or ensure that your buffer never gets full or both) or in combination (as a backup) at the user's option.

 

[Don Haines]

up the frame rate slightly, add the cf card slot, add a sync port...done....that still leaves room for improving (up the sync speed, add a few Xpoints, etc etc...)

Not sure why they would bother adding a CF slot. SD cards are comparable in maximum speed, and typically lead capacity-wise (256 GB SD cards were available for an entire year before anyone announced a comparable CF card). SD cards also take up less space in your camera bag, and have the advantage of being compatible with readers that are built into most laptops, whereas CF cards aren't.

Two slots of the same type are much more user-friendly than two different slot types, because you don't have to carry around cards of two different types. And given that SD is ahead of CF and is likely to continue pulling ahead (because CF-based devices are basically lost in the noise as a percentage of cameras sold), I'd much rather see them do dual SD cards that can be used either in alternation (which would increase your shots per second or ensure that your buffer never gets full or both) or in combination (as a backup) at the user's option.

I would hope to start seeing CFast card slots in the cameras. They are supposed to support transfer rates of 1GByte/sec and storage capacities of 2TBytes

 

[traveller]

...This is a NL rumor, so take it with a huge grain of salt.

Yes, and it's kind of garbled too.

Break it down:

The 5D IV will push toward higher specs. No Sh*t Sherlock. Did you think it would push toward lower specs? No information on when this would be released. Could be 2015, could be 2016, who knows. Just a random statement tossed in there.

Canon's new studio camera will be the one to maximize image quality Again, let's state the obvious. If it's a studio camera it better maximize image quality, else why make it?

There will be no 3D Of course not, Canon will never use the 3D designation unless they build a stereo camera. Too confusing.

By early 2015 there will be four full frame cameras Let's see: a 6D, a 5D, a 1Dx and a studio camera. Yep, that's four.

Two of which will be announced next year Okay, if they have three cameras now. They aren't replacing any of the three, but adding a fourth, where does the "two" come from. Either somebody is bad with math or one of the three could be updated. But which one?

My suspicion is that the 6D won't be updated for awhile says Keith

I’m willing to wager the EOS 6D won’t be replaced before the EOS 5D Mark III or EOS-1D X. says Craig

First off, neither Keith nor Craig are particularly good at predictions. No assessment of their ability to extract information from inside sources – there is a big difference. Craig has the best sources in the industry, and once a rumor hits CR2 or CR3 he's almost never wrong. I'm just saying that when it comes to personal opinions/predictions, the batting average doesn't seem to be any better than anyone else on this forum.

So, let's discount the idea that the 6D won't be replaced before the 5D or the 1D and put them all on equal footing.

Me, I'd bet on the 6D being updated first. There is a lot of headroom between the 6D and the 5D so Canon could throw a 70D/7D autofocus system into the 6D II without seriously impacting sales of the 5D or 1D. The 6D also seems like a prime candidate for the current dual pixel technology. I don't see 5D or 1D owners particularly caring about that until it shows some significant benefits beyond what it offers in the 70D.

The 1Dx is the oldest in the lineup, so it could be updated, but neither Canon nor Nikon like to update the flagship too frequently because the professional customer base just isn't that into frequent upgrades. Still, a late 2014 announcement with availability in 2015 is certainly possible.

Or, it could be the 5DIII. The only reason to update the 5DIII would be because I just bought one, so with my track record, it could get an update. But, honestly, I'm pretty hard pressed to see what they would update that would motivate buyers to upgrade. Especially since the current 5DIII has been a pretty phenomenal seller.

Bottom line, I'd be surprised to see any of these three updated, but my personal bet is the 6D.

You're assuming that a second full frame DSLR won't be something totally new, like some cr*ppy Nikon Df me-too ;D

 

[klickflip]

Depressing news for people that would like to see a high MP studio camera sooner (like myself)

It really is shocking that Canon will prob take 3 years to announce a high MP D800 equivalent, since the D800 was outed/released, or 4 years to actual release - Q1/2 2015.
Which probably means that the D800 was in Dev for 2 years before Feb 2012. Or another way to look at it is canon is 5 years behind Nikon / sony tech. And for sure they will not be sitting on their current tech gleeing for 5 years which it what it seems since the success of the 5D mkII.

What will Nikon / Sony be offering in 2015, Sony doing a mirrorless Medium format / larger sensor with Zeiss lenses at a half the cost of anything comparable? Imagine a larger A7r for $5-6K and lenses 1.5K a pop, bargain of the century which will kill the 1D xS DOA!!

Or Fuji stepping back into pro MF which they do so well - they designed and made the hasselblad HD platform and lenses and now they have some nice sensor tech too, plus they have a brilliant heritage in large Rangefinders, so a larger format x-pro like the old 67 and 69 ones in late 2015 could happen also.

What in the hell happened to the ones they were meant to be testing at the 2012 olympics??? My bet is that it was a higher MP sensor but the same IQ which they are struggling with.
And the statement from 2012 I remember from a Canon exec that said if the market wanted a higher MP camera they could deliver that tomorrow ... !

I for one will probably be getting a Sony A7r to fill the gap and if it and the zeiss lenses are any good. Will be hiring one soon to test it out, and more amazing all for a very reasonable cost you can get a decent camera with excellent sensor and a couple of decent primes.

I'm still slightly bemused by the 1D form, as weather sealing will be low on many's list - Studios?! landscape/ outdoor advertising photogs maybe but most will be used to setting up hides / gazebos to wait out the weather to get the shot.

A chunkier 5Dish or mini 1D would be nice, I never use anywhere near 1 battery's capacity on a busy shoot ( event and wedding and sports guys may eat a lot more tho)

What I do feel is it will be a way to make more profit, as Canon do know a lot of people are waiting such a camera. So charging premium will help, but they must have done the maths as a 5Dish body with a high MP sensor would be more accessable and sell more units. But say a 1D form body would make $3K profit and a 5Dish body may make $500 per unit.

It had better be one hell of a camera to justify a $7-9K price tag. We will be looking for sensor quality much beyond a D800 - more like Phase One P45 or IQ40 or HD5 50, and if they keep the flash sync to 160/200( needs to be 320+ at least) it will loose some appeal from people that use location flash units, which would be a big group of users in my eyes, that will be also eyeing up MFDB options by now.

As a general pro camera I think they got the 5D III right (a better sensor would have been nicer) Its lovely to use, quick enough for most circumstances even sports and with a decent set of L's (primes for me ) its a great combo.
So I'm not sure what upgrades they can do - maybe a 24MP sensor better IQ, wider AF coverage, little bit more FPS? Dual pixel looks very good for video.. which I hardly every use and many in this position too. Could Dual pixel AF be made to work with translucent mirror and get much more instant and accurate focus on any lens ( from copy to copy)? Now that would be interesting, and maybe useable Wifi that can cope with raw files.

I guess alot of video guys would love dual pixel AF on a 5D, so that may get released sooner than we think.

If it wasnt for my love of the L Primes i'd be outa here a long time ago!! Arghhh.