Updated Canon 2016 Roadmap
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It was pretty clear.... he claims that gear defines the professional and that if you are not using a 1 series body that you are not a pro......Mikehit said:
The thing is, the 5D2 was seen as THE wedding photographers camera until the 5D3 came out, and then it was seen as THE wedding photographer's camera..... I don't know a single wedding photographer (but I am sure there are some) who shoots with a 1DX..... they (at least the Canon ones) shoot with 5D3's, 5D2's, 6D's, 7D's, 7D2's, and yes, several have 70D's too.....
A wedding is not like the big game. You don't need that 14FPS burst to try and catch the ball as the bat hits it, or to catch the split second as the tag is made...... you don't need that 1DX high voltage battery to drive that 600F4 lens.... for some inexplicable reason, the wedding party poses for you! They hold still! They let you move around for different angles.... they let you get close enough so you don't need that supertelephoto... they even keep posed until after you get the ring shot..... Instead of trying to get that 100th of a second contact with the ball, you have 2 hours to get that picture of Uncle Fred dancing.....
Different tools for different jobs! A real pro chooses the right tool for the task rather than letting the tool define the task.
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Don Haines said:
I'm no pro, but one would think the a camera with a silent shutter is a wedding game-changer for non-posed / available light shots.
I realize that's not the majority of your classic posed / lit portraiture, but when you're shooting 'street' at a wedding and want to catch attendees unawares or don't want to distract the bride and groom, I would imagine silent shutter is gold for that.
- A
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Don Haines said:
There are lots. Think about it, AF and low light performance for both IQ and AF are two stellar reasons.
Negatives are cost, size, and lack of silent shutter. As for cost, that largely depends on your market segment and pricing strategy, there are a lot more sub $1,000 a wedding shooters than +$5,000 stills wedding shooters. Size? Well I see comparatively few wedding shooters using 5 series cameras without a grip so the size argument for many is utterly moot. Silent shutter, now that is a bugbear, I was asked to stop shooting a showjumping event over the weekend because even though I was 30' away from the ring and 60-80' from the horses even using silent mode in a 1Ds MkIII the horses were distracted! It was an amateur event though and neither the riders nor horses were not used to photographers.
Very high profile 1DX wedding shooters? Scott Kelby and Jeff Ascough would be two. Ascough, who is a Canon Ambassador, has taken to the high iso IQ and the AF accuracy in low light the 1DX MkII gives him over his 5D MkIII's.
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dilbert said:
No. I am saying it isn't necessary to use (and here I am quoting you)
My comment was not brand specific at all and my reference to Alex Majoli was to show a Magnum photographer who uses a point-and-shoot on a professional assignment.
So either you are unable to udnerstand a counter argument or you are deliberately obfuscating. Then I realised it is Dilbert I am conversing with....
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3kramd5 said:
But Dilbert clearly was.
Apparently a professional used a body+grip style. So anyone who chooses not to use such a style camera is not being professional ergo, anyone choosing to not uses a body+grip style is not showing a degree of professionalism in their approach.
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dilbert said:
When I got married, I reviewed the work of several local photographers within budget. I didn't ask them about makes and models, and wouldn't care if they volunteered the info - it is of no consequence.
When I downselected, we directly discussed what I liked in her portfolio, what I did not like, and what my expectations were. None of them had to do with makes or models. We did discuss what lighting she would bring since it affects the ambiance of the event, but again I wouldn't disqualify her for using yongnuo triggers for example.
If she were unable to deliver because she selected gear which wasn't sufficient to return the expected results (relative to her portfolio), there would have been a problem. There was not, and FWIW she wasn't using full-sized bodies.
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ahsanford said:PureClassA said:
Canon put out a new 50 prime just last year, the 50mm f/1.8 STM. That should completely address any 50mm prime needs for everyone for the foreseeable future.
- A
But the 50 1.8 and the 50L are two completely different lenses. With a new 35L II, a new 50L II should almost be a given, particularly with the new optical formula they employed for it
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unfocused
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privatebydesign said:
Not to nit pick too much, but Kelby is primarily a sports photographer. I was at one of his seminars a year or so ago and he said he is trying to concentrate on sports, because he enjoys it the most. I suspect that he uses a 1D X because he needs it for sports, rather than for the occasional wedding shoot.
Just for fun, I took a look at some of my Creative Live courses. Lindsay Adler and Roberto Valenzuela were both shooting non-gripped Canons.
I guess they are not up to Dilbert's standards.
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PureClassA said:ahsanford said:PureClassA said:
Canon put out a new 50 prime just last year, the 50mm f/1.8 STM. That should completely address any 50mm prime needs for everyone for the foreseeable future.
- A
But the 50 1.8 and the 50L are two completely different lenses. With a new 35L II, a new 50L II should almost be a given, particularly with the new optical formula they employed for it
My posting might have been in jest. (I admit I was subtle: sarcasm, bold/underline for emphasis, winky face, etc. :
)- A
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unfocused said:
There are a lot of high end pros shooting the 5D MkIII and 5DS/R ungripped, including probably the greatest portrait shooter currently working (IMHO), Gregory Heisler, they cross the entire gamut of shooting scenarios and include people like Joel Grimes, Jasmin Star, Joey L, Peter Hurley and on and on and on. But they aren't wedding shooters (apart from Star) so Dilbert will ignore them. Though to your point on Kelby, he can have whatever gear he wants and if he wanted to shoot weddings with a 5D anything he could, he shoots weddings with the 1DX because he wants to.
A great photographer can get great images with just about any camera made in the last five or so years. For the vast majority of us, the not so great, equipment can make more of a difference, for instance if you have faster AF and are a slower person you can get images you couldn't without the faster AF, or if you have more exposure latitude you can be less conscious of exposure. But the greats are the ones who work to a level where the gear is close to irrelevant, it is simply an extension of their vision and having a grip or not is as irrelevant as having f1.4 or f1.2, their content will trump any perceived equipment 'limitations'.
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dilbert said:
Do I take the opinion of a Magnum photographer over someone who spends time living fantasies on a Rumors forum?
Nope. I think it is fair to say that pros see the 5D/1D series offering functions and rugged build that make is worthwhile and Canon is servicing that market. If there was no such market those cameras would not exist.dilbert said:
Image quality comes from a combination of the lens and the sensor. The body merely offers functionality and has virtually no effect on image quality. The xxxD sensors are also used in the xxD and 7D bodies so there will be no image quality difference between them. And given many pros use the 7D, why is it a problem using the xxxD models? People were shooting superb wedding photos with the 3MP and 8MP early digital models and it is still possible.dilbert said:
I have long contended that the idea of pros using modern 36MP/50MP bodies with ISO capabilities into 52,000 is more about their ego than about what really matters to the general public.
Or are you saying that the award-winning National Geographic magazine spreads shot on 35mm transparency are, quite frankly, amateurish rubbish because we now have 50MP bodies?
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I checked the websites for all (that I could find) 28 wedding photographers that I could find within a 100 kilometer radius of where I live.
0 out of 28 mentioned the cameras that they shoot with. 0! NONE!
On 2 of the websites you could see a picture of the photographer holding a camera, and in both cases it was a non-1 series Canon without a grip.
0 out of 28 mentioned the cameras that they shoot with. 0! NONE!
On 2 of the websites you could see a picture of the photographer holding a camera, and in both cases it was a non-1 series Canon without a grip.
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Don Haines said:
Wow, you should become a wedding photographer. Once you aquire and advertise access to the properly-shaped camera body, as the only clear professional within a 100km radius, you'll have your pick of clients and be able to name your price.
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While I was at the zoo last year with my gripped 70D (and a 100-400 II) I heard two women talking about the photographer at a wedding one of them attended. She complained about the "unprofessional photographer" who only had an inappropriate camera (likely some mirrorless), much smaller than the professional camera I was using. She said, she would never have hired her, although I don't think she has had a look at the resulting pictures (which are likely better than what I could have taken with my skill level and my camera).
So at least for perception of professionalism in the uninformed public, camera size matters. But I think few could distinguish a 1D from a gripped xxD (unless seen side by side). And many would likely see a 1DX(II) as disturbing because of shutter sound.
So at least for perception of professionalism in the uninformed public, camera size matters. But I think few could distinguish a 1D from a gripped xxD (unless seen side by side). And many would likely see a 1DX(II) as disturbing because of shutter sound.
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