Is Scotch tape the answer to your Canon EOS R5 overheating issues?

Here we go again :

+++ It’s really important you’re clear in what info you’re spreading. I’m seeing a lot of misinformation - probably due to lots of independent tests

A.M.: show me what part of my post is misinformation. read it again:

2.5 hours with cards in camera, externally with battery grip (4K60 full sensor All-I via external recording only)
Ah, fair. You’re right. Apologies. I jumped the gun on you because I was too focused on 24/30 and answering the initial post. That is my bad, you did state clearly 60FPS.

All in all, I think if someone really wants the R5 to work for them, they definitely can with an external recorder. Also, with these RF cinema cameras around the corner, it would be a pretty cool pairing.
 
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not my conspiracy theory. I replied to someone else’s post. you should at least use available measurements and don’t dismiss inconsistencies in how you are reading posts. No apologies required. :D

You're bold as usually. I don't give a ..., who do you comment, more so, if you can't properly quote posts, introducing your own markup. It is you who mentioned a conspiracy theory, without giving any explanation to possible measurements ppl made.
 
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Ah, fair. You’re right. Apologies. I jumped the gun on you because I was too focused on 24/30 and answering the initial post. That is my bad, you did state clearly 60FPS.

All in all, I think if someone really wants the R5 to work for them, they definitely can with an external recorder. Also, with these RF cinema cameras around the corner, it would be a pretty cool pairing.
No worries. Yes, for the price of those high capacity CFE cards....And additional benefit of having prores codec in the external recorder.
 
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The R5 can record 4K all day for those that need it. However for those that need it the R5, indeed any Canon hybrid short of the 1DC, would be a poor choice as apart from that 1DC they all have a 29:59 single shot limit unless shooting to external, which virtually everybody shooting long form 4K would be doing anyway. Of course by that point, recording externally, the R5 has been demonstrated to be able to shoot 8k and 4kHQ (full capture downsampled 8k) pretty much without time limits too.

At some point all these straw man criticisms of the R5 will collapse, genuine users rather than keyboard cowboys with nothing between their ears but air will find workflows for whatever it is they need and there will be no end of top quality content coming from them. Meanwhile the cowboys will have moved on to the next target of their collective angst, however I have a better suggestion for those cowboys, face into a mirror and see where the real issues and lack of creativity lie, it isn’t in the ‘limitations’ of any particular piece of equipment.

i was trying to think of the last time a Canon body release got this much hate, it doesn’t take much looking as it was the R, not a good word was said about it at release, six months later many of those mouthpieces had adopted it and were praising its abilities.....

Now really - what is that? Calling those, who possibly care about their money spent, being a cowboys? Noone (maybe apart from video folks) is neglecting, R5 is probably the best all-aroundre nowadays. But why to call such ppl a cowboys, if there is something fishy about the recovery times, unless explained? Stating that you can shoot 4K HQ video for certain times is completly different to finding out, that after using camera for stills you might actually get zeroed out for the video.

The argument of the quality content R5 will eventually deliver, reminds me of the arguments of Sony A7SIII defenders re stills photos, bringing up memories, when you could do quality photo using 6 mpx ... Surely you could. But please let ppl sort out the situation re video. They deserve to find out, what are exact video times they can easily depend upon, no strings attached ...
 
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Yes, my thoughts exactly. Well put (y)

The problems is I am actually on the half empty side of this cup....... I really can't see Canon making this happen by accident.

The saving grace assumption I have is that the IBIS unit - these are first-gen Canon IBIS FF cameras - might actually be damaged easier by warmth, so they are being crazy protective. But that would mean that the camera is poorly engineered from the get-go.

So yeah, let's wait and see. The people that already have units can at least enjoy the beautiful photos and videos it takes.
 
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You're bold as usually. I don't give a ..., who do you comment, more so, if you can't properly quote posts, introducing your own markup. It is you who mentioned a conspiracy theory, without giving any explanation to possible measurements ppl made.
Say what...:) here is what I said:

“Canon's decision to intentionally cripple the R5” is yet another conspiracy theory.

meaning: I do not trust that Canon intentionally crippled the R5. Do you??

so I guess you cannot properly read? And if you can, Perhaps you could start (let me quote you) “giving a.... “ before jumping in a conversation.
 
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One thing I think a lot of people are missing with the temperature and timer thing is that in thermodynamics, heat damage is not always just about the measured temperature. Heat damage can be caused by a cumulative heat effect. This about a pizza in an oven. The temperature in the space is at 400 F, but it takes time for the heat to transfer into the product and heat up the internal product. (Note: this is most true for items that are not themselves the main heat producer, but the heat is produced from a different source.)

"Cooking" (i.e. heat transfer) is a combination of heat and time. And it is not just one set pair of values (400F for 12 minutes). It is a relative scale, such that higher temps result in shorter times to reach an internal temperature.

First, we need to be clear where the measured temperature is located at. Is the EXIF temp from the processor?

Second, what is the component that is most sensitive to heat build up and needs protection? Sensor? Processor? other circuitry?

When you look at all the comments saying it has to be a fake timer issue, but the values are never exactly the same, as an engineer I simply see an algorithm for accumulated heat using both temperatures and time. For example, in the video, when he battery is put back in the camera, he gets 5 minutes. That would be based just on the current temperature, since there is no saved accumulated heat information saved.

If the critical component is internal to the sensor and has some measure of "insulation" such that it does not heat up or cool down quickly with a temperature differential, you can not just go by the EXIF temp, or surface measured temp, etc.

Just something to think about!
 
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The guy is not trying to solve the problem, nor does he suggest it as being a solution. All he is trying to provide is the possible proof, that there might be an artificial timer used, instead of the thermal read-out.

You are too bold to mark all internet being just armchair fools. Many ppl might have some technical backgroud. E.g. I am an IT guy for 30 years, we have built Astro CCD camera, doing the HW, firmware, software and all that.

While I don't feel competent enough to judge the current situation, I would not downplay other's experience. There is definitely something fishy here, like sitting in menu for one hour, doing few pics and not getting even a 1sec of a 4K HQ video, measuring 43C temperature, whereas getting to 63C during the 8K video and getting 20 minutes of the shooting time from the cold start.

The problem might not be the limitation of the lenght of particular video modes, those got advertised, but weird cool down times, most probably not being based upon a temperature reading or not a temperature reading alone (the timer stuff). Simply put - noone wants to use camera for stills in a lightly manner for cca half to one hour, and get zeroed on the 4K HQ video capability.

I give credit when due even on the interwebs, and all I have seen so far are whiners and armchair engineers making idle speculation or outright controversy out of nothing. Speculation taken too far makes people fools. No offense, but IT doesn't make you an expert in the Canon R5 thermals. Neither do people pointing a FLIR at the R5 suddenly know all about the situation. None of these tests equate to die temperatures for ASICs and other internals, and you have no idea what temperature threshold is the protection limit for these parts. Some parts really don't like to be hot over their lifetime and so for reliability are kept at lower temperatures.

I have specific experience with high speed circuit design and thermal management and will leave it at that, but I would never go around speculating I understand a design unless I did the thermal analysis or pulled out schematics or looked at the code for ASICs, FPGAs or uControllers myself. To pretend I know, even with my experience, is a lie unless I have done adequate testing and reverse engineering. On a product like this, insanely compact and complicated, that isn't going to happen from some youtube test. To sit around doing inane amateur tests and then to make biased assumptions about artificial timers and blah blah blah is people stoking their ego, NOT honest intellectual discourse. Sometimes saying "I don't know" is the best course, but too many people don't like the feeling of admitting it, even when the subject matter is way out of their area of knowledge.

Calling the time limits artificial or fishy in the first place is an assumption and an emotional label. Engineers have to make a choice on how to put in stops around various physical realities of the components and their interaction as a system. Even if the record times WERE arbitrarily chosen, SO WHAT?! Canon told us about it including the part about other camera activity reducing those times. So for the millionth time I suggest people go buy another camera if you don't like it instead of falsely acting like some detective! Since people are not having an honest discussion about how electronics and product engineering actually work, I will continue to down play what these people are saying because the way they are going about this is amateurish, has an unintelligent and non-rigorous tone, and the vast majority of them have an agenda of some sort: to get clicks or prove the camera is flawed. It isn't; Canon told us exactly how it behaves before shipping started.

There are plenty of reasons the camera internals might heat up just in the menu or shooting stills. In my own tests, just using the EVF for long periods of time generates heat. IBIS also seems to generate heat. Try a 1 hour timelapse at 5 second intervals and just disabling those two is the difference between a warm and cold body at the end of the hour. So I could draw conclusions from my own amateur test that something about the heat and cooling is real, not artificial, but why bother? The camera worsk for me as designed. I'm sure everyone has heard that removing the CFE card helps. SERDES for the CFE might always runs idle characters even without data flowing. We could speculate all day. I could do some pretty fancy tests if I really wanted to, or I could buy the right tool for the job (which I did, and it's a pretty great camera with a few flaws like every product must have).

If Canon has some errors to fix or optimizations for the firmware that make this better, great. Not uncommon for new product. If they actually made a hardware mistake and fix it, great, but I find that very unlikely. However, until I hear well researched logic that doesn't fall apart trivially I will keep calling out all these hokey tests and assumptions for what they are: hot air (see what I did there)?

The only testing I've seen that actually benefits anyone is from those actually working with the camera instead of trying to make it fail, or providing workarounds like using external recorders- those people are accepting the camera for what it is at least instead of continuing on this path of labeling things nefarious or fishy or artificial or whatever.
 
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Your rant ignores the possibility that Canon is simply lying about the extent of the overheating problem to provide cover for once again needlessly crippling a camera body. It doesn't take an advanced engineering degree to look at data that suggests actual internal temperatures are completely uncorrelated to temperature warnings and shutdowns and conclude that the whole situation is simply the result of a software cripple dressed up as a design necessity. Even if you're fine with Canon's decision to intentionally cripple the R5, I don't know how you can defend lying about it.

You have zero evidence to support your chosen belief. You think you are a victim and your statement is rife with logical fallacies. What more needs to be said? You are already rabidly convinced you know the answer and you don;t even demand rigorous understanding of engineering. It shows the dishonesty in your method of thinking. All you care about is reaching the same conclusion every time: cripple hammer, cripple hammer, squawk!

I don't call engineering OR marketing decisions a cripple because I am an adult who both understands that no product is perfect, has technical knowledge sufficient to not makeup inane beliefs, and I can select the proper tool for the job when I buy a camera. Canon told everyone what the camera can do and it does it. There are other options on the market- choose one. I own 3 brands and types of cameras for different jobs and I don;t go around whining endlessly at the limitations of each, or expect one company will come along and make the perfect One Camera.
 
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