A New EOS Pro Body With 46mp Next Month? [CR1]

[raptor3x]

Its interesting that Fred Miranda posted that he trusts the OP more than the Rumor sites. The poster is a long time FM member.

Probably because he called that the 7D2 would use a 70D like sensor and all the major improvements would be in the AF and FPS while CR was talking about Foveon sensors.

 

[PureClassA]

It certainly COULD be a MF competitor though NOT a MF sensor. A sensor that is capable of yielding damn near MF image quality BUT being able to retain your giant selection of EF lenses .... and have a great crop camera (18MP crops !!) with fast FPS for sports. Think of the folks who buy a 5D3 for critical work like portraiture and landscapes, and still get a 1DX (and possibly a 7D) for sports and action...

8k to them would be a real bargain.

 

[mkabi]

There's one other thing we can almost be certain of: this sensor is HIGHLY unlikely to end up in the 5D4. Canon lost a bunch of 1DsIII sales to the 5D2 and I can't see them doing that again.

But what then? They lose all sales to D810 and Sony?
They can't just have some 8k camera that offers high MP and high DR and expect that to compete with the $2000-2500 stuff. The 8k cam might also have high fps and this and that and be the best, but 8k is simply too much for most people to afford no matter how much they'd love to get it (and some don't like mega large bodies).

Isn't it better to have 85,000 sales of 5D4 than 4000 sales of 1DsX?

How do you know that Canon is losing people to D810 and Sony?
Lets be honest, you can go back to 2010 (like Neuro posted somewhere) and you will see people DRoning on about the lack of DR in Canon compared to Nikon from before 2008 (there is proof of this... actual proof). It hasn't improved since then... what makes you think that will change any time soon? And, obviously, increasing MP is not going to improve that...
If DR is what you are looking for... then by all means Nikon is your brand... go towards the light...

With that said, if you increase MP, there is a chance you are going to hurt those high ISOs (if daytime landscape photography is your only need for a camera, I'm not even...)
And, there are those that will complain about the large file sizes taking up too much hard drive space, thereby increasing the need for other resources to work with such files... all in all, it might hurt rather than inflate 5D sales... so your 5D4 could only sell 4000 units.

Go to Tony Northups youtube page and look up that video of why he can't switch to Nikon, even though he wants to...

 

[Steve]

Probably because he called that the 7D2 would use a 70D like sensor and all the major improvements would be in the AF and FPS while CR was talking about Foveon sensors.

Uh, no, pretty much everybody everywhere was saying the same thing about the 7DII - ie better AF + FPS but no real sensor improvement. The 7DII is about exactly what I, and most people, expected which is why no one was really excited by it.

 

[Bruce Photography]

There's one other thing we can almost be certain of: this sensor is HIGHLY unlikely to end up in the 5D4. Canon lost a bunch of 1DsIII sales to the 5D2 and I can't see them doing that again.

But what then? They lose all sales to D810 and Sony?
They can't just have some 8k camera that offers high MP and high DR and expect that to compete with the $2000-2500 stuff. The 8k cam might also have high fps and this and that and be the best, but 8k is simply too much for most people to afford no matter how much they'd love to get it (and some don't like mega large bodies).

Isn't it better to have 85,000 sales of 5D4 than 4000 sales of 1DsX?

Depends on your margins.

But why can't I have 85,000 sales of 5D4 *AND* 4000 sales of 1DsX?
And how do I achieve that if I'm Canon?

8MP APS-C (20D, 30D, 350D) = 21MP FF (5D2, 1Ds3, 5D3)
10MP APS-C (40D, 400D, 1000D) = 26MP FF
12MP APS-C (450D) = 31MP FF
15MP APS-C (50D, 500D) = 38MP FF
18MP APS-C (7D, 700D, 650D, 600D, 550D, 60D, 60Da, 100D) = 46MP FF (1DsX or 3D?)
20MP APS-C (70D, 7D2) = 51MP FF

Your numbers showing that by using the same pixel density that is already in Canon's APS-C format cameras but producing a full frame sensor with the same pixel density should produce a sensor in the range of that rumor. I think that Nikon probably had that choice but decided to back off to 36MP to retain a higher DR and also not to "frighten" those out their that said there were "Too Many Megapixels - my little slow computer couldn't handle those 40+mp files." And don't waste my time in quoting the "uncompressed" size which I never use and can never understand why anyone would use it. 14 bit non-loss compression works great on all the D800 line.

If Canon did this, I would probably buy it. Canon at this point may feel that it is now time for Canon to truly establish dominance even if they don't sell a boatload. With a price like that they will have a great profit margin and have something to take to every trade show and not just a fast APS-C camera.

 

[eml58]

Too much MP for my taste.

Sounds just about right for landscapes. If only it has the DR...

Completely agree, totally.

This would be a Pro Body, main competitors being the Phase One IQ250, Pentax 645z & Haselblad H5D, basically anything with the Sony 50MP CMOS Sensor in it (and you can bet good money that Sony are about to drop that Sensor into their own body, sooner not later), is that worth competing with ?? I think so, I hope Canon does as well.

Price ??, about right, Competes well with the price of the 645z, certainly competes more than well with the Phase One & Haselblad (Sony will do it for 1/3 the price, but that have zero Lenses to match without Zeiss).

Will it happen, no idea, but I certainly hope so.

 

[Dylan777]

Too much MP for my taste.

Sounds just about right for landscapes. If only it has the DR...

Completely agree, totally.

This would be a Pro Body, main competitors being the Phase One IQ250, Pentax 645z & Haselblad H5D, basically anything with the Sony 50MP CMOS Sensor in it (and you can bet good money that Sony are about to drop that Sensor into their own body, sooner not later), is that worth competing with ?? I think so, I hope Canon does as well.

Price ??, about right, Competes well with the price of the 645z, certainly competes more than well with the Phase One & Haselblad (Sony will do it for 1/3 the price, but that have zero Lenses to match without Zeiss).

Will it happen, no idea, but I certainly hope so.

Edward & jrista,
Sold my a7r last week(keeping my FE55). I plan to add a7s in future. I guess I'm more into high ISO than DR.

 

[jrista]

Too much MP for my taste.

Sounds just about right for landscapes. If only it has the DR...

Completely agree, totally.

This would be a Pro Body, main competitors being the Phase One IQ250, Pentax 645z & Haselblad H5D, basically anything with the Sony 50MP CMOS Sensor in it (and you can bet good money that Sony are about to drop that Sensor into their own body, sooner not later), is that worth competing with ?? I think so, I hope Canon does as well.

Price ??, about right, Competes well with the price of the 645z, certainly competes more than well with the Phase One & Haselblad (Sony will do it for 1/3 the price, but that have zero Lenses to match without Zeiss).

Will it happen, no idea, but I certainly hope so.

It would have to have a large sensor to really compete, though. Put a 50mp FF and 50mp 44x33mm MF head to head, and the MF is going to win. The Sony 50mp MF in the backs or MF cameras from any one of those companies would pulverize a Canon 50mp FF in any IQ comparisons. Again, that boils down to equivalence...more total light for a given subject framing, better IQ. Pixel counts really wouldn't matter.

 

[PureClassA]

Too much MP for my taste.

Sounds just about right for landscapes. If only it has the DR...

Completely agree, totally.

This would be a Pro Body, main competitors being the Phase One IQ250, Pentax 645z & Haselblad H5D, basically anything with the Sony 50MP CMOS Sensor in it (and you can bet good money that Sony are about to drop that Sensor into their own body, sooner not later), is that worth competing with ?? I think so, I hope Canon does as well.

Price ??, about right, Competes well with the price of the 645z, certainly competes more than well with the Phase One & Haselblad (Sony will do it for 1/3 the price, but that have zero Lenses to match without Zeiss).

Will it happen, no idea, but I certainly hope so.

Edward & jrista,
Sold my a7r last week(keeping my FE55). I plan to add a7s in future. I guess I'm more into high ISO than DR.

Let me know how the A7s is. Are you going to use it with Canon lenses w/ adapter, or Zony lenses? (Yup, Zony...Zeiss+Sony lenses. ) I'd be curious in knowing how the AF performance is with the A7s and Canon lenses with adapters if you go that route.

Amen! I'd love to know too! Thought about doing an A7R for video with my EF lens kit.

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

Too much MP for my taste.

Sounds just about right for landscapes. If only it has the DR...

Completely agree, totally.

This would be a Pro Body, main competitors being the Phase One IQ250, Pentax 645z & Haselblad H5D, basically anything with the Sony 50MP CMOS Sensor in it (and you can bet good money that Sony are about to drop that Sensor into their own body, sooner not later), is that worth competing with ?? I think so, I hope Canon does as well.

Price ??, about right, Competes well with the price of the 645z, certainly competes more than well with the Phase One & Haselblad (Sony will do it for 1/3 the price, but that have zero Lenses to match without Zeiss).

Will it happen, no idea, but I certainly hope so.

Edward & jrista,
Sold my a7r last week(keeping my FE55). I plan to add a7s in future. I guess I'm more into high ISO than DR.

Let me know how the A7s is. Are you going to use it with Canon lenses w/ adapter, or Zony lenses? (Yup, Zony...Zeiss+Sony lenses. ) I'd be curious in knowing how the AF performance is with the A7s and Canon lenses with adapters if you go that route.

One interesting thing about the A7S is it has extremely detailed and aliasing free 4k video (although only 8bit not 10bit and you do need a $2000 attachment to record it). But man, it's like looking out a window! (it also has 1080p with internal recording, no ML RAW like the 5D3 has, but for in cam recorded non-RAW 1080p it's probably the best I've ever seen from a DSLR in every regard, the best SNR and best detail while also being free from aliasing, but if you are willing to deal with RAW video, the 5D3 with ML gives a pretty darn good 1080p, the best of any DSLR IMO)

It's only time before they have an A7S2 that has internal 4k recording too.

 

[unfocused]

Some guy no one knows makes an account calling himself "Psychic1" and posts a statement with absolutely no backstory on how he comes to know this. They seem inordinately excited by very thin rumors there on FM Canon Rumors.

Corrected the post. Now the CR rating should be corrected to "0"

 

[peederj]

I think Canon has to do something like this, not only to finally respond to the D800 (they've also just gotten around to responding to the RX100...seems their intel is poor these days), but to motivate glass sales, as we will then have a 135 camera that exposes the limitations of the current generation of glass well.

With gapless microlenses I don't think pixel pitch is as much of a low-light/DR problem as people make it out to be. The per-pixel DR will have a lower maximum of course, but when downsampled to a delivery resolution the DR increases proportionally again. This is why the D800 sensor has a very competitive DR regardless. And the current generation of sensors has remarkable DR even with a very high pixel pitch. I wouldn't worry so much about that...the doubling of pixels will mostly affect your storage requirements for RAW. And storage is getting cheap fast and quick weekly.

And yes the FF wide zoom (11-24/4) and this is aimed squarely at landscape just like the 7D2 is at action. This will also be a very good studio portrait and weddings camera. How long will it take Sony to release a new sensor to jump ahead again?

 

[digigal]

...
Let me know how the A7s is. Are you going to use it with Canon lenses w/ adapter, or Zony lenses? (Yup, Zony...Zeiss+Sony lenses. ) I'd be curious in knowing how the AF performance is with the A7s and Canon lenses with adapters if you go that route.

Do any of the rental places rent out the A7 + Metabones adapters?

Several months ago I rented the A7R + Metabones adapter for my Canon lenses and a Zeiss Lens to take to NYC to play with for a week from Borrowlenses.com Great service--highly recommend them.
Catherine

 

[cellomaster27]

I think that this is really exciting! And for ppl on here, remember this is canon RUMORS, not canon fact. Isn't it for news like this that we (I) keep coming back here for?? ;D Just say that this camera, whatever its called, comes through. Seeing the 100-400mm II and 11-24mm would make alot of sense with this camera. Keep em rumors coming!

 

[dolina]

If they move to CFast memory cards then the read/write limitation of CF cards wont be an issue for a 46MP body with a high continuous shooting/burst rate.

Although those CFast cards are sure are expensive. ATOMOS 64GB 200MB/s read * 80MB/s write CFast card goes for $160 while Lexar 256GB 510MB/s read & 370MB/s writes goes for $1300.

 

[9VIII]

We know that Canon has had the ability to release large sensors with huge resolution for many years now, I can only hope they deem the market ready for one sooner rather than later.
I still suspect that their timing is connected to both the FPS that they can get with their current processors, and the price of memory.
The 1Dx at 36MP would only get 6FPS, maybe (hopefully) they just don't think that anything less is worthy of a 1D anymore. And if they're pushing 50-100MB files on people, 64GB memory cards had better be cheap.

 

[PureClassA]

I'll speak only for myself here ... IF IF IF IF this rumor pans out to be even 75% accurate (36MP 1DX) I will buy it in pre order. Here's why:

Most of what I do is simple artistic and portraiture. My 6D works fabulously for 90% of my work load. HOWEVER - I do once or twice a year rent a 1DX to shoot a super fast action, professionally staged (lighting) dance recital weekend that typically yields 8000 frames in a weekend.

If I can get the resolve of a high grade portrait camera and the obscene AF and radical light performance of a 1DX ... I'm in. All in. If this rumor is true the money will fly out of my corporate account faster than the IRS can tax it.

 

[privatebydesign]

I don't understand everybody grizzling about the price. In 2002, yes 12 years ago, the 1Ds was released at $7,999, and it commanded a premium for quite a while. In 2004 the 1Ds MkII was released at $7,999, and it commanded a premium for quite a while. In 2007 the 1Ds MkIII was released at $7,999, and it commanded a premium for quite a while.

That is what pro photographers and keen hobbyists have been paying for well over ten years for Canon's top of the line 1 Series camera. There is so much pent up demand for the true 1Ds MkIII successor I suspect there will be unprecedented demand for this camera, if it is real, that they will trade at a premium and no deals will be had for a couple of years.

Personally, even though I am a 1Ds MkIII user and have been for years, I am more interested in the 1Dx MkII as I have no real desire to go over the mid 20's in MP and would prefer the higher fps. But, if it is a killer camera I could see me getting one of each.

 

[deleteme]

Remember the rumored price range is eight to nine THOUSAND. You could pick up a D810 and 14-24mm f/2.8 for six grand, and pocket the extra two grand.

If this rumor is true, then this definitely is not a D800 series competitor. If anything, given the price, this sounds more along the lines of one of those Canon medium format rumors than anything...price wise it sounds like it would compete with the Pentax MFDs.

I was going to say at that price I might as well go for the Pentax 645z and a few lenses. For me high res is always on a tripod with LV focus. A 1D series body would have little benefit to me.

 

[Arkarch]

...
Let me know how the A7s is. Are you going to use it with Canon lenses w/ adapter, or Zony lenses? (Yup, Zony...Zeiss+Sony lenses. ) I'd be curious in knowing how the AF performance is with the A7s and Canon lenses with adapters if you go that route.

Do any of the rental places rent out the A7 + Metabones adapters?

LensRentals had the A7r last I checked. Not sure about the A7s. They also have the Metabones adapters. I was going to rent the A7r this weekend, but I have to house sit, so probably next weekend. I'll look for the A7s when I do, would be interesting to see how it works with my 600mm.

Just rented an A7R + metabones and remote from LR. Good way to cover the sensor gap for critical trips.