A Rundown of EOS 7D Mark II Information

[Don Haines]

So some rumour comes out that the camera will have feature X. The rumour gets recirculated on various websites and eventually people start using the recirculated rumour as "proof" that the initial rumour is correct. Someone else repeats the rumour and then it is considered confirmation.

Until it is announced by Canon, I will not believe any rumour.... but it is fun to speculate on what colour the 24Mpixel, binable to 6Mpixel, DPAF, 16bit A/D and 18 stop DR, 12FPS, 4Kvideo, WiFi GPS touchscreen, superior low light to 1DX camera will come in

(and before anyone attacks those specs... NO, I am NOT serious about them! ..... or maybe I am......)

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

Regardless, I expect Canon to drain my bank account just like they always do. Something they are very very good at!

You think?

I'm still using my 10-year-old and 9-year-old Canon dSLRs because none of the updates since have been particularly interesting. I have several friends with Canon dSLRs, and they are similar. One is still using his 40D, one is still using his Rebel XT, one is still using his T3i. I'm still using a 20D, 5D and a T2i at work. I've watched every Canon release carefully in the last 10+ years.

Depends on what you shoot. For those of us that shoot sports, wildlife, other fast action, then we would be missing out on a VASTLY improved AF system in the likes of 1DX and 5D3.

I shoot primarily fast-action.

And you stuck with 20D, Xti and 5D???

Just the 20D and 5D. The Rebel is for work, which is not fast action.

Hmm I couldn't wait to be rid of those for action work. I mean sure you can get great shots, but it was frustrating that misses were a lot more than when using 1D2n.

 

[bardamu]

10 pages of comments in such a short space of time? The anticipation around this camera seems to be almost as great as that preceding the 5D mk iii release. I thought nobody gave a s**t about crop cameras anymore?

 

[Lee Jay]

Just the 20D and 5D. The Rebel is for work, which is not fast action.

Hmm I couldn't wait to be rid of those for action work. I mean sure you can get great shots, but it was frustrating that misses were a lot more than when using 1D2n.

I get hit rates of high 90s for moderate action and mid 90s for very fast action.

And, no, that's not good enough.

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

So some rumour comes out that the camera will have feature X. The rumour gets recirculated on various websites and eventually people start using the recirculated rumour as "proof" that the initial rumour is correct. Someone else repeats the rumour and then it is considered confirmation.

Until it is announced by Canon, I will not believe any rumour.... but it is fun to speculate on what colour the 24Mpixel, binable to 6Mpixel, DPAF, 16bit A/D and 18 stop DR, 12FPS, 4Kvideo, WiFi GPS touchscreen, superior low light to 1DX camera will come in

(and before anyone attacks those specs... NO, I am NOT serious about them! ..... or maybe I am......)

But once again CR guy calls those ones CR1 and doesn't say these are WHAT WE KNOW WILL HAPPEN.

 

[bardamu]

I expect this to be an excellent camera, but also, to look at it critically, a niche camera. For those needing high-grade AF, high FPS and shooting predominantly with longer lenses, it will be ideal. But the poor state of the EF-S lens line-up will inevitably limit its usefulness as a one-camera-does-all option. Better off with a Fuji, or any FF. The release of the 16-35 f4 does actually help Canon's crop range a little bit, since 26-56mm is a fairly useful zoom range to have with weather sealing.

Having said that, Canon will still sell plenty of them. 10% will have a legitimate need for it, 90% will buy it for the prestige, or out of curiosity. Which is ok.

 

[Don Haines]

So some rumour comes out that the camera will have feature X. The rumour gets recirculated on various websites and eventually people start using the recirculated rumour as "proof" that the initial rumour is correct. Someone else repeats the rumour and then it is considered confirmation.

Until it is announced by Canon, I will not believe any rumour.... but it is fun to speculate on what colour the 24Mpixel, binable to 6Mpixel, DPAF, 16bit A/D and 18 stop DR, 12FPS, 4Kvideo, WiFi GPS touchscreen, superior low light to 1DX camera will come in

(and before anyone attacks those specs... NO, I am NOT serious about them! ..... or maybe I am......)

But once again CR guy calls those ones CR1 and doesn't say these are WHAT WE KNOW WILL HAPPEN.

Then why isn't this rumour a CR3?

We don't know for sure until an official announcement. For all we know, Canon had prototypes out for testing with an incomplete list of features and that these are the people supplying the rumours... For all we know, the CR guy could have one of those incomplete prototypes... the point is, until an official announcement, we don't know.

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

One thought that I originally had but then put aside until someone else brought it up, is that someone may have mixed up multi-level EXPOSURE METERING SENSOR with multi-level IMAGING SENSOR.

The other person looked over all of their multi-level imaging sensor patents and says that they look to be very inefficient for high ISO [and thus very unlikely to be used].

In which case we would be back to Canon still not mentioning a thing about improving imaging sensors at all (other than for AF).

And as Jrista said, driving those pixels would be a bit of a step up.
And Canon already used multi-level exposure metering sensors.

So I fear that this is likely just something that got lost in translation. (although they did call it NEW sensor tech and since they already use multi-layer for the exposure metering sensor I don't know maybe it is the imaging sensor after all)

 

[Marauder]

haven't read the whole topic, just few first pages, but are you people really believing this rumour? its a rumour, yet you are treating it as a fact.

"We’re getting little bits of information, and what we’re getting is going to be true."

I also believe in Santa Claus

Yeah, well--who doesn't?! 8)

But I concur, that bit about "and what we're getting is going to be true" tends to make this rumour likely to pan out. There's no CR#, which is odd, but it sounds like what they've given us has been verified by a trusted source.

More to the point, it gels with previous rumours...

...Nonetheless, colour me impressed. All the features on my own wish list (superb AF and burst rate in a well built body) are being met, if these specs are accurate--and I suspect they are...I don't expect to be disappointed. Quite the opposite--I think this camera is going to ROCK!!!!

I'm guessing that for a large segment the deal maker/breaker is going to be the sensor. And, we really don't have anything close to a reliable rumor on that yet.

Instead, there are some crazy-high expectations floating around and there is a segment of the internet population that is expecting a sensor that defies physics. When that doesn't materialize there will be much whining and gnashing of teeth.

I personally would be very surprised if some major breakthrough in sensor technology is incorporated in the 7DII. In part, because I'm not sure that such a breakthrough technology is even possible. I'm expecting a 24mp sensor with some incremental improvements that place it a little higher on the scale to the 70D sensor. But, I'm not expecting a miracle.

Oh, I'm not holding my breath on the sensor being something that will somehow magically give the APS-C camera full-frame IQ. Although I AM curious as to what the sensor will be like and what improvements it might bring. I'm "hoping" it provides equal to or better IQ than other current APS-C sensors, but time will tell. But for me, the main draw is, and always has been, a much better AF system and faster burst rate, hopefully coupled with a deep buffer. The AF on the 7D gets trashed more than it ought to--I generally do get good results with it--but there is room for improvement! And the 8fps and fairly deep buffer of the 7D are already still impressive, but improvements in that technology will open up opportunities to get even more interesting shots, especially when tied to a truly superb auto focus system.

 

[jrista]

I'm guessing that for a large segment the deal maker/breaker is going to be the sensor. And, we really don't have anything close to a reliable rumor on that yet.

Instead, there are some crazy-high expectations floating around and there is a segment of the internet population that is expecting a sensor that defies physics. When that doesn't materialize there will be much whining and gnashing of teeth.

This is probably the truest statement anyone has made about the 7D II so far. I've tried and tried to demonstrate to everyone, through theory, math, and even some visual examples (of which I clearly need to do more) that an APS-C sized sensor will NEVER perform as well as a FF sensor (all else being equal). The 7D II may close the gap, temporarily, between the 7D line and the 5D line, but it won't overtake the FF in terms of IQ.

I personally would be very surprised if some major breakthrough in sensor technology is incorporated in the 7DII. In part, because I'm not sure that such a breakthrough technology is even possible. I'm expecting a 24mp sensor with some incremental improvements that place it a little higher on the scale to the 70D sensor. But, I'm not expecting a miracle.

A breakthrough is possible, given that Sony did it. The problem with Canon sensors is not that they don't have the same DR as Sony sensors. The problem with Canon sensors is some two stops of that DR is being eaten up by high downstream electronic noise. If Canon can either do away with ADC units in the DIGIC processors, and move them onto the sensor die, or find some other way of making the ADC units and downstream amplifiers less noisy, they could have a pretty radical breakthrough.

For me, given that I've dug through the bowels of the internet to find all the sensor patents from Canon that I could, I KNOW that Canon actually HAS the technology to move the ADC onto the sensor die, and make it column-parallel. I am also nearly certain they have already used it once...in the 120mp APS-H sensor that operated at 9.5fps (I honestly don't know how else they could read out such a sensor at such a high rate unless they hyperparallelized the ADC units).

The question in my mind is...why the hell hasn't Canon already employed the technology they HAVE PATENTS FOR, and have had patents for for a while, in the 5D III, 1D X, and 6D? Given that they did not use some of the awesome technology they HAVE already...I agree with your assessment, although for different reasons...I would be surprised if the 7D II gets a major boost in sensor IQ.

 

[Don Haines]

This is probably the truest statement anyone has made about the 7D II so far. I've tried and tried to demonstrate to everyone, through theory, math, and even some visual examples (of which I clearly need to do more) that an APS-C sized sensor will NEVER perform as well as a FF sensor (all else being equal). The 7D II may close the gap, temporarily, between the 7D line and the 5D line, but it won't overtake the FF in terms of IQ.

and even if there was some new magic technology that allowed the 7D2 to outperform the 5D3, you can bet that the same magic technology would be rushed through development and we would see a 5D4 that restored the FF advantage....

 

[jrista]

This is probably the truest statement anyone has made about the 7D II so far. I've tried and tried to demonstrate to everyone, through theory, math, and even some visual examples (of which I clearly need to do more) that an APS-C sized sensor will NEVER perform as well as a FF sensor (all else being equal). The 7D II may close the gap, temporarily, between the 7D line and the 5D line, but it won't overtake the FF in terms of IQ.

and even if there was some new magic technology that allowed the 7D2 to outperform the 5D3, you can bet that the same magic technology would be rushed through development and we would see a 5D4 that restored the FF advantage....

Exactly.

 

[brad-man]

This is probably the truest statement anyone has made about the 7D II so far. I've tried and tried to demonstrate to everyone, through theory, math, and even some visual examples (of which I clearly need to do more) that an APS-C sized sensor will NEVER perform as well as a FF sensor (all else being equal). The 7D II may close the gap, temporarily, between the 7D line and the 5D line, but it won't overtake the FF in terms of IQ.

and even if there was some new magic technology that allowed the 7D2 to outperform the 5D3, you can bet that the same magic technology would be rushed through development and we would see a 5D4 that restored the FF advantage....

This is my assumption as well. This new sensor will likely indicate the future of the next generation of Canon's SLR sensors. Canon has been relatively stagnant on sensor evolution for too many years, and I feel that their reputation as an innovative camera company is on the line. If half of these specs are true, I can see why this new camera won't be called mark ll. New body style, new sensor, new AF system, new camera. Not a mark ll anything.

 

[Greenmeenie]

No wifi or touch screen? Bummer. All future canon prosumer cameras should have BOTH wifi and touch screens IMHO.

 

[kalieaire]

TBH, as far as the 7D is concerned, it's supposed to be Canon's best video product.

No wifi or 4K is a huge deal breaker for me.

I own the Canon 300D, 20D, 5D, 5D2, 5D3, and previously owned a 7D. I use video in my day to day work, but I'm also a Panasonic GH4 owner.

Using the Panasonic GH4 with 4K, Focus Peaking, Wifi, flip out/touch screen, and a host of other very USEFUL features. I really can't take Canon seriously anymore with any of their offerings.

I'll probably stick with Canon for a little bit for stills, but eventually switch back to film for all my photography needs and use the Panasonic or Red cameras for cinema.

 

[NancyP]

Why aren't people running a betting pool on this TBA camera's specs? ;D
Well, I for one have been getting my quota of anticipatory pleasure in reading the rumors, whatever the truth may be, and hanging out with fellow Canonistas.

 

[Marauder]

This is probably the truest statement anyone has made about the 7D II so far. I've tried and tried to demonstrate to everyone, through theory, math, and even some visual examples (of which I clearly need to do more) that an APS-C sized sensor will NEVER perform as well as a FF sensor (all else being equal). The 7D II may close the gap, temporarily, between the 7D line and the 5D line, but it won't overtake the FF in terms of IQ.

and even if there was some new magic technology that allowed the 7D2 to outperform the 5D3, you can bet that the same magic technology would be rushed through development and we would see a 5D4 that restored the FF advantage....

Exactly.

Although expecting it to match the IQ and noise performance of a full frame (or even APS-H) is not reasonable, I do hope that this sensor has the performance to match or exceed other APS-C sensors out there. That, combined with class leading frame-rate, AF system and build will make this an epic camera.

 

[NancyP]

Oh, and yes, I think that people have gotten the message that full frame has, other things being equal, more potential for highest image quality. I am not arguing that point.

However, there are plenty of people who will buy a well-rounded action APS-C camera with excellent, but not "medium format killer", image quality. Please review the concept of a tool designed for a specific task. Action shooters want a specialized camera. If they want to shoot high-res landscapes, they know they need a different camera. I have a 6D as a lightweight landscape and general use camera, and want to upgrade my current 60D to a specialized action APS-C camera that I can lift. I am a 115# weakling currently shooting with a 3# lens and aspiring to an f/4 supertele, and 7.5# of lens plus a non-1DX-size camera body seem handholdable, add a 1DX, not so sure about handholding the extra weight even though the higher voltage battery is mighty attractive.

 

[Marauder]

Oh, and yes, I think that people have gotten the message that full frame has, other things being equal, more potential for highest image quality. I am not arguing that point.

However, there are plenty of people who will buy a well-rounded action APS-C camera with excellent, but not "medium format killer", image quality. Please review the concept of a tool designed for a specific task. Action shooters want a specialized camera. If they want to shoot high-res landscapes, they know they need a different camera. I have a 6D as a lightweight landscape and general use camera, and want to upgrade my current 60D to a specialized action APS-C camera that I can lift. I am a 115# weakling currently shooting with a 3# lens and aspiring to an f/4 supertele, and 7.5# of lens plus a non-1DX-size camera body seem handholdable, add a 1DX, not so sure about handholding the extra weight even though the higher voltage battery is mighty attractive.

Exactly. A 7D II won't touch a 6D or 5D III for landscapes or as a wedding/event camera, but it can be a viable alternative to a 1D series camera for the wildlife/action/sport shooter--especially on a budget. $2000-2500 isn't inexpensive--but it's a good deal less than 5 or 6 grand!!!

 

[RGomezPhotos]

No touch-screen? It's sort of nice. But it's really a gee-whiz feature. For people who like using point and shoots. I can change settings much faster and easier without it. And in sports, that's much more critical.

An articulating screen.. Now THAT could be useful in many ways. Even for a pro. But it introduces a major weak point in the construction.. Not worth it for the .01% of the time I would use it.