Bingo! New Canon 5Ds has 50.6 MP new rumored specs

[Eldar]

Canon has planned 2015 to be a wall-to-wall new product marketing nuclear bomb. It's aggressive and I love it.

Ok...I'd love to see it....maybe this is Canon just being uber aggressive and trying to suck all the air out of CP+. But, it is certainly a break from recent history.

It's rumored that Sony is going to be making a huge power play soon, so Canon might finally be scared of their rabid market share grabbing. Canon might be a big, slow company, but when they feel truly threatened, they put the hammer down.

Shades of when AMD finally woke the guys at Intel up, and Intel acted decisively. If we're at a point where the established companies start feeling threatened, that's probably good thing.

Except that in this case the big company is Sony. Perhaps it is the other way around, and the sleeping giant that was awoken is Sony, not Canon. Canon are more like AMD and will probably go the same way.

I believe it is a bit far fetched to claim Sony is the sleeping giant of the camera world, especially DSLR. What did Sony sell year by year the last 20 years, compared to Canon? What is Sony´s lens line up worth next to Canon´s? Sony is big, but in this business they are still an embryo that may turn into something, whereas Canon has been on top for as long as I can remember.

I am looking forward to Friday like a child for Christmas

Sony can draw on the insight, expertise and experience of the rest of their divisions however. Not to mention that they have a lot more resources available. If they make a serious effort in camera tech there is no way Canon are going to be able to keep up.

Sony has a higher sales volume than Canon. But revenue is falling and they have been losing money for 4 of the last 5 years. In the same period, Canon has grown sales and made a healthy profit every year. Canon ticked in as No.1 on patents in the USA by a foreign company (any business), for the 10th year in a row. So who can draw on which resources ??

 

[Loswr]

Sony can draw on the insight, expertise and experience of the rest of their divisions however. Not to mention that they have a lot more resources available.

You're right, you shouldn't have mentioned it, or at least you might have bothered checking your facts before spouting nonsense.

Canon: three main divisions, moderately diverse product portfolio, 42.3B market cap

Sony: many divisions, very diverse product portfolio, 26.8B market cap

Now, who do you think has more resources available for camera development? Yeah, that's what I thought. :

 

[PhotographyFirst]

Canon has planned 2015 to be a wall-to-wall new product marketing nuclear bomb. It's aggressive and I love it.

Ok...I'd love to see it....maybe this is Canon just being uber aggressive and trying to suck all the air out of CP+. But, it is certainly a break from recent history.

It's rumored that Sony is going to be making a huge power play soon, so Canon might finally be scared of their rabid market share grabbing. Canon might be a big, slow company, but when they feel truly threatened, they put the hammer down.

Shades of when AMD finally woke the guys at Intel up, and Intel acted decisively. If we're at a point where the established companies start feeling threatened, that's probably good thing.

Except that in this case the big company is Sony. Perhaps it is the other way around, and the sleeping giant that was awoken is Sony, not Canon. Canon are more like AMD and will probably go the same way.

I believe it is a bit far fetched to claim Sony is the sleeping giant of the camera world, especially DSLR. What did Sony sell year by year the last 20 years, compared to Canon? What is Sony´s lens line up worth next to Canon´s? Sony is big, but in this business they are still an embryo that may turn into something, whereas Canon has been on top for as long as I can remember.

I am looking forward to Friday like a child for Christmas

I don't know about sleeping giant...maybe sleeping dwarf at the moment. But I see Samsung as the next major force. They have an extremely compelling product in the NX1. The programmable hardware with the whole "camera hardware apps" concept, the SDK they are developing (which sounds like it will rival Canon's for richness, if not surpass it), and the lenses they are starting to develop (like the 300mm f/2.8, which sounds like it will at least match Canon's for features...not sure about optical quality yet), etc. put Samsung in a position where they could, if they execute well, start to give Canon a run for the money. I think Samsung might actually bring the mirrorless market to life...as they actually seem to be doing it right. A camera that rivals the 7D II on key features, with solid DSLR-like ergonomics...just without the mirrorbox.


I'm not calling them a giant...but I do believe they could become one in five to ten years. They certainly became the giant in the smartphone industry, and in less time than that.

Good points. Samsung has the money and tech to compete. They just need better work on brand recognition and perception. They have the pull to get their products on top shelves in places like Best Buy, Costco, and Fred Meyer.

I don't follow the TV market, but when I bought my last flat screen TV is was Samsung, and everyone I knew was buying Samsung. They dominated Sony and everyone else for price and quality at one time. My TV is still working great and I see no reason to upgrade. In fact, I am typing on it with a remote keyboard at this moment. It's also been a stellar computer monitor for me.

 

[Eldar]

Canon has planned 2015 to be a wall-to-wall new product marketing nuclear bomb. It's aggressive and I love it.

Ok...I'd love to see it....maybe this is Canon just being uber aggressive and trying to suck all the air out of CP+. But, it is certainly a break from recent history.

It's rumored that Sony is going to be making a huge power play soon, so Canon might finally be scared of their rabid market share grabbing. Canon might be a big, slow company, but when they feel truly threatened, they put the hammer down.

Shades of when AMD finally woke the guys at Intel up, and Intel acted decisively. If we're at a point where the established companies start feeling threatened, that's probably good thing.

Except that in this case the big company is Sony. Perhaps it is the other way around, and the sleeping giant that was awoken is Sony, not Canon. Canon are more like AMD and will probably go the same way.

I believe it is a bit far fetched to claim Sony is the sleeping giant of the camera world, especially DSLR. What did Sony sell year by year the last 20 years, compared to Canon? What is Sony´s lens line up worth next to Canon´s? Sony is big, but in this business they are still an embryo that may turn into something, whereas Canon has been on top for as long as I can remember.

I am looking forward to Friday like a child for Christmas

I don't know about sleeping giant...maybe sleeping dwarf at the moment. But I see Samsung as the next major force. They have an extremely compelling product in the NX1. The programmable hardware with the whole "camera hardware apps" concept, the SDK they are developing (which sounds like it will rival Canon's for richness, if not surpass it), and the lenses they are starting to develop (like the 300mm f/2.8, which sounds like it will at least match Canon's for features...not sure about optical quality yet), etc. put Samsung in a position where they could, if they execute well, start to give Canon a run for the money. I think Samsung might actually bring the mirrorless market to life...as they actually seem to be doing it right. A camera that rivals the 7D II on key features, with solid DSLR-like ergonomics...just without the mirrorbox.


I'm not calling them a giant...but I do believe they could become one in five to ten years. They certainly became the giant in the smartphone industry, and in less time than that.

That is more likely. Samsung is in a very strong financial position (both Sony and Canon are dwarfs in comparison) and they have shown in market after market that they are capable of making it. I believe, as you say, that the quality of their next lens releases will determine if they will make it.

 

[3kramd5]

With computers, you have the enthusiasts/geeks (like me) who care which chipset they use let alone processor manufacturer. With cameras, you have enthusiasts/geeks (like me) who are interested in architecture and low-level performance.

Sure, I used to build my own computers, choosing which mainboard with what chipset and whatnot to assemble - but nowadays it's all so generic that it's hardly worth it and imho only a few geeks are left with some brand attachment.

Every time I go to upgrade, I wonder if the time has come that it's cheaper to buy a ready-made system. In my experience (most recent build being several months ago), it's not. It's still cheaper to assemble you own, given equivalent components. Naturally, it comes with the potentially painful process of determining exactly what isn't working, and the annoying return trip to Fry's (or UPS) to return it.

I don't have any brand attachment. In the past 5 years I've used Asus, MSI, Gigabyte, and EVGA motherboards; I've used Antec, PC Power & Cooling, and Corsair power supplies; I've used EVGA, XFX, Sapphire, and Asus video cards; I've used Patriot, Corsair, and Crucial memory. Spinning hard drives go to the best bang for the buck; SSDs I tend towards Samsung but also have Patriot. However, all my processors have been Intel. There's practically no competition at the performance level. There used to be.

Except that in this case the big company is Sony. Perhaps it is the other way around, and the sleeping giant that was awoken is Sony, not Canon. Canon are more like AMD and will probably go the same way.

Sony is certainly a big company, but in this market they're AMD to Canon's Intel.

Is it an entirely sound analogy? Certainly not. But may the "throw everything at the wall and see what sticks" type of competition spur the production side of Canon to get together with the R&D side of Canon? Maybe. Hopefully.

 

[jrista]

Sony can draw on the insight, expertise and experience of the rest of their divisions however. Not to mention that they have a lot more resources available.

You're right, you shouldn't have mentioned it, or at least you might have bothered checking your facts before spouting nonsense.

Canon: three main divisions, moderately diverse product portfolio, 42.3B market cap

Sony: many divisions, very diverse product portfolio, 26.8B market cap

Now, who do you think has more resources available for camera development? Yeah, that's what I thought. :

Canon's largest business unit is their office equipment unit, with over 53% of revenues. The digital photography division has tanked in terms of revenue recently, due to the advent of smartphone cameras, and is only a part of their consumer equipment business (which also includes camcorders and printers, which are still big business.)


Canon does innovate, however out of their thousands of patent filings a year, relatively few have to do with digital photography, and very few if any have to do with sensor development each year. If you take the ~10% they spend on R&D each year, that's about 4.5 billion dollars. If you figure Canon distributes those funds around their business units by size, then about 1.7 billion is spent on R&D on the consumer equipment business...most of that likely goes to photography equipment, and most of that probably goes to lens R&D, and a solid chunk probably goes to AF and metering R&D. Who knows how much goes to sensor R&D...but Canon isn't even a blip on the radar as far as sensor innovation goes.


In contrast, Sony's patent filings each year have more and more to do with digital photography and video, particularly sensors (one just has to look at image sensor's world blog to see Sony's name is among the top innovators, alongside Omnivision, Aptina, Samsung, Toshiba and a couple of others. Hell, even Rambus is a bigger innovator in the sensor market than Canon is...)


Sure, Canon may have more funds for R&D...but Sony seems to be investing more of what they have into camera technology than Canon does in total.

 

[AvTvM]

Sony can draw on the insight, expertise and experience of the rest of their divisions however. Not to mention that they have a lot more resources available. If they make a serious effort in camera tech there is no way Canon are going to be able to keep up.

unless Sony really goes broke before that happens. ;D

 

[raptor3x]

If you take the ~10% they spend on R&D each year, that's about 4.5 million dollars. If you figure Canon distributes those funds around their business units by size, then about 1.7 million is spent on R&D on the consumer equipment business...most of that likely goes to photography equipment, and most of that probably goes to lens R&D, and a solid chunk probably goes to AF and metering R&D. Who knows how much goes to sensor R&D...but Canon isn't even a blip on the radar as far as sensor innovation goes.

1.7 million on R&D for an entire division of a major corporation seems way too low.

 

[jrista]

If you take the ~10% they spend on R&D each year, that's about 4.5 million dollars. If you figure Canon distributes those funds around their business units by size, then about 1.7 million is spent on R&D on the consumer equipment business...most of that likely goes to photography equipment, and most of that probably goes to lens R&D, and a solid chunk probably goes to AF and metering R&D. Who knows how much goes to sensor R&D...but Canon isn't even a blip on the radar as far as sensor innovation goes.

1.7 million on R&D for an entire division of a major corporation seems way too low.

Sorry, I used the wrong unit. It's 1.7 billion. That's a lot, however Sony has accumulated tens of billions in debt the last few years, the majority of which was invested into their sensor division.

 

[dflt]

Why do people think that sensor R&D is all about consumer grade tools? Military, defense industry, maybe?

 

[dufflover]

Money and resources doesn't necessarily translate into anything. ... you'd think Apple would come up with something super crazy with all their resources yeah?

/runs away

CF card: even though SD cards have reached decent speeds now (and more importantly camera manufacturers are putting the correct spec'd slot in FFS!) the CF card can still be faster and I think just part of the 1-series and 5-series identifying features. I mean think about how "un-pro" it would be if a 5-series suddenly had a flip screen, no CF card, and a pop up flash - forget the other features, snobs would be talking it down like crap because of all the "n00b" features.

 

[kphoto99]

CF card: even though SD cards have reached decent speeds now (and more importantly camera manufacturers are putting the correct spec'd slot in FFS!) the CF card can still be faster and I think just part of the 1-series and 5-series identifying features. I mean think about how "un-pro" it would be if a 5-series suddenly had a flip screen, no CF card, and a pop up flash - forget the other features, snobs would be talking it down like crap because of all the "n00b" features.

CF card is a pro feature you say.

Let me see, in the back of my drawer I have a Canon camera that uses a CF card, so it must be pro. Is a PowerShot A300. Yes, definitely it is a pro camera with pro feature 8)
(Also no pop up flash, more pro)

 

[AvTvM]

CF card: even though SD cards have reached decent speeds now (and more importantly camera manufacturers are putting the correct spec'd slot in FFS!) the CF card can still be faster and I think just part of the 1-series and 5-series identifying features. I mean think about how "un-pro" it would be if a 5-series suddenly had a flip screen, no CF card, and a pop up flash - forget the other features, snobs would be talking it down like crap because of all the "n00b" features.

Well, I generally don't give a damn what other people think or say about me or my gear. Life is way more pleasant that way.

I still have a stock of CF cards that I use in my 5D3, since the SD slot is basically unusable due to CCC [Canon Creative Crippling]. :

But the 5D3 is the only device in my possesion that still uses CF cards. I have skipped regular size SD cards and am standardizing on Sandisk Extreme Pro Micro SDXC cards - currently 90 MB/s which is fast enough to clear buffer speedily and I don't ever shoot video. I use the Micro-SD cards inside the "regular size SD-adapters", so they are the same size as regular SD cards (which I personally find quite good, have never lost one) and they are also protected quite well that way. I can put them straight into any camera with an SD slot - eg my n00by EOS M 8) - as well as many (non-Apple) phones, tablets and virtually all notebook computers. So I do not need an extra USB card reader any longer.

I would like my 5D 3 to have a popup fill flash which also serves as optical master for Canon EX speedlites. And a built-in RT commander in addition - apparently this is still not featured in the 5D2/R. Cannot see anything "n00b" in using advanced controls over wireless flash setups.

And lastly, I would absolutely LOVE to have a 360 articulated TOUCH-Screen on any camera that I ever use. Love the touch screen on the EOS M - much quicker to change settings in Q-Menü that way and to select AF-field.

If this makes me look "un-pro" in the eyes of the ignorant, then the better. It's less conspicuous, which helps in a lot of shooting situations. ;D

 

[erjlphoto]

Anyone want to guess on the price?

5Ds 1999.95
5Ds r 5999.95 (evil smirk)

 

[msatter]

CF card: even though SD cards have reached decent speeds now (and more importantly camera manufacturers are putting the correct spec'd slot in FFS!) the CF card can still be faster and I think just part of the 1-series and 5-series identifying features. I mean think about how "un-pro" it would be if a 5-series suddenly had a flip screen, no CF card, and a pop up flash - forget the other features, snobs would be talking it down like crap because of all the "n00b" features.

Well, I generally don't give a damn what other people think or say about me or my gear. Life is way more pleasant that way.

I still have a stock of CF cards that I use in my 5D3, since the SD slot is basically unusable due to CCC [Canon Creative Crippling]. :

But the 5D3 is the only device in my possesion that still uses CF cards. I have skipped regular size SD cards and am standardizing on Sandisk Extreme Pro Micro SDXC cards - currently 90 MB/s which is fast enough to clear buffer speedily and I don't ever shoot video. I use the Micro-SD cards inside the "regular size SD-adapters", so they are the same size as regular SD cards (which I personally find quite good, have never lost one) and they are also protected quite well that way. I can put them straight into any camera with an SD slot - eg my n00by EOS M 8) - as well as many (non-Apple) phones, tablets and virtually all notebook computers. So I do not need an extra USB card reader any longer.

I would like my 5D 3 to have a popup fill flash which also serves as optical master for Canon EX speedlites. And a built-in RT commander in addition - apparently this is still not featured in the 5D2/R. Cannot see anything "n00b" in using advanced controls over wireless flash setups.

And lastly, I would absolutely LOVE to have a 360 articulated TOUCH-Screen on any camera that I ever use. Love the touch screen on the EOS M - much quicker to change settings in Q-Menü that way and to select AF-field.

If this makes me look "un-pro" in the eyes of the ignorant, then the better. It's less conspicuous, which helps in a lot of shooting situations. ;D

Canon will fullfil all those wishes....however it will take 15 years in 5 iterations.

 

[msatter]

Anyone want to guess on the price?

5Ds 1999.95
5Ds r 5999.95 (evil smirk)

WHAT!! I thought that 'r' was standing for reduced price.

 

[Marsu42]

CF card is a pro feature you say.

You have to admire these marketing people - how do they manage to make cf appear "pro" and a swivel screen or pop-up flash "amateur"? With these markers, they don't even need to legitimize why a certain product costs xyz €/$ because every customer immediately sees how "pro" it is, i.e. how much worth it has to have.

 

[unfocused]

CF card is a pro feature you say.

You have to admire these marketing people - how do they manage to make cf appear "pro" and a swivel screen or pop-up flash "amateur"? With these markers, they don't even need to legitimize why a certain product costs xyz €/$ because every customer immediately sees how "pro" it is, i.e. how much worth it has to have.

The crazy thing is, they don't even have to do anything. The customers themselves arbitrarily decide that certain features are not "pro." Look at the negative comments that get generated anytime someone suggests that a $3,000 camera ought to be at least as functional and connected as a cell phone – ability to navigate menus by touch screen, connectivity to the internet, basic photo editing functions – all things that would make life easier and offer more options for professionals, but whenever someone suggests that on this site, you get comment after comment from users who refuse to evolve.

 

[AvTvM]

CF card is a pro feature you say.

You have to admire these marketing people - how do they manage to make cf appear "pro" and a swivel screen or pop-up flash "amateur"? With these markers, they don't even need to legitimize why a certain product costs xyz €/$ because every customer immediately sees how "pro" it is, i.e. how much worth it has to have.

The crazy thing is, they don't even have to do anything. The customers themselves arbitrarily decide that certain features are not "pro." Look at the negative comments that get generated anytime someone suggests that a $3,000 camera ought to be at least as functional and connected as a cell phone – ability to navigate menus by touch screen, connectivity to the internet, basic photo editing functions – all things that would make life easily and offer more options for professionals, but whenever someone suggests that on this site, you get comment after comment from users who refuse to evolve.

+100

Lots of "disconnected fat old mirrorslappers" around here. ;D

 

[Lee Jay]

CF card is a pro feature you say.

You have to admire these marketing people - how do they manage to make cf appear "pro" and a swivel screen or pop-up flash "amateur"? With these markers, they don't even need to legitimize why a certain product costs xyz €/$ because every customer immediately sees how "pro" it is, i.e. how much worth it has to have.

The crazy thing is, they don't even have to do anything. The customers themselves arbitrarily decide that certain features are not "pro." Look at the negative comments that get generated anytime someone suggests that a $3,000 camera ought to be at least as functional and connected as a cell phone – ability to navigate menus by touch screen, connectivity to the internet, basic photo editing functions – all things that would make life easily and offer more options for professionals, but whenever someone suggests that on this site, you get comment after comment from users who refuse to evolve.

I'd love to have a pop up flash on my 5D because it would be useful and I wouldn't have to carry my mini flash. Connectivity to the internet and basic photo editing functions would add no value for me as I'd never use them for anything, and I certainly wouldn't pay for a cell data plan for my camera.