Sony Sensors Coming to Canon DSLRs? [CR1]

[Don Haines]

I think it would be a mistake for them to surrender chip design--both for Canon and for the users. There needs to be MORE sensor competition--not less.

+1, but Canon needs to do something in the high res department. But if they cannot compete themselves, limited competition is better than no competition at all.

I just talked to a well-off landscape photog still shooting mf film scans as he finds they are better than a 20mp dslr for what he does. When I told him about the upcoming Sony ~50mp cameras, he was thrilled and nearly ready to dump all his Canon gear right away. As a wildlife photog, this isn't my world, but there you are.

If they wanted too, they could produce one easily. Take a 7D2 sensor design, build the design FF size, and you have a 50Mpixel FF camera that shoots 4FPS and needs 40 shots to fill the frame buffer.

The way I figure it, Canon should have 4 FF cameras in it's lineup....
the 1D series for indestructability and speed
the 5 series aimed at weddings and "do it all"
the 6 series as a low end camera
a new series of high megapixel cameras for landscape.

Let's see what the new year brings.... I predict a massive fleet update.

 

[stochasticmotions]

This I would love to see, doesn't stop canon from continuing to produce other sensors but this might give them a quick way to put out a high resolution camera while they continue to design their own for a next generation camera.

 

[steliosk]

its about time!

Canon is VERY late bringing that tech to DSLRs, better late than never.

According to the competition, the overall Canon system might be great but the sensors are crap.

I was impressed after playing with a G7X which has a Sony sensor
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canon-powershot-g7-x/9

 

[Marauder]

I think it would be a mistake for them to surrender chip design--both for Canon and for the users. There needs to be MORE sensor competition--not less.

+1, but Canon needs to do something in the high res department. But if they cannot compete themselves, limited competition is better than no competition at all.

I just talked to a well-off landscape photog still shooting mf film scans as he finds they are better than a 20mp dslr for what he does. When I told him about the upcoming Sony ~50mp cameras, he was thrilled and nearly ready to dump all his Canon gear right away. As a wildlife photog, this isn't my world, but there you are.

If they wanted too, they could produce one easily. Take a 7D2 sensor design, build the design FF size, and you have a 50Mpixel FF camera that shoots 4FPS and needs 40 shots to fill the frame buffer.

The way I figure it, Canon should have 4 FF cameras in it's lineup....
the 1D series for indestructability and speed
the 5 series aimed at weddings and "do it all"
the 6 series as a low end camera
a new series of high megapixel cameras for landscape.

Let's see what the new year brings.... I predict a massive fleet update.

That's pretty much the way I see it too. Lots of people are expecting the 5D Mark IV as also being the large MP camera, but I don't think that makes sense. If high MP was a panacea, then the D810 would stand alone in the higher mid-range FF lineup for Nikon--but they've discovered it isn't. It may be great for studio work and for landscapes, but it lacks a more moderate MP camera's "do anything, go anywhere." While the D800/D810 have been successful, they lack the flexibility that is the hallmark of the 5D Mark III. It's why Nikon has had to bring out their D750 as a "5D killer." They've lost a great deal of market share to Canon over the last 2 and a half years due to the 5D Mark III. Although I do think Canon needs to step up to the plate with a high MP camera, I don't think it will be the 5D Mark IV. I expect that to be a moderate increase on the resolution of the 5D Mark III, but with improvements in IQ, fps and buffer. The AF is already stellar, but they will incorporate the new metering from the 7D Mark II as well as a boost to the AF.

Only time will tell but I expect the high MP camera will be the fabled 3D.

 

[sanj]

From Industry Leaders to Industry follower.
But whatever works as long as I get to make better photos.

If this is indeed true, then members like jersta, dolna, dilbert, sella and many such were right.

 

[ewg963]

Ok I'll wait and see.

 

[Joe M]

A Sony sensor in my Canon and one in those Nikons. So what would separate the two then other than the lens lineup? Well, those endless threads on DR would be lost to the ether.
I know I'm being trite. I actually see nothing wrong in outsourcing if you get a better component than what you can make yourself be it the sensor or any other part of a product. As long as it's made to your requirements (e.g. I want "x" amount of DR, I want dual pixel and so forth) what's the big deal? Canon would then have to work harder at making the rest of the camera something special (along with lenses) to make people want to buy their stuff as opposed to the competition who has virtually the same sensor (read IQ).
Let's say company "y" could make a shutter box that could provide 500k actuations. Would you care that company "y" made it for Canon or would you rather your camera stay pure and have only Canon made components? People already buy third party lenses so how is this really much different.
Not that it's likely going to happen anyway. It is a CR1 after all.

 

[Don Haines]

To keep all this in perspective.... for decades Canon, Nikon, Olympus, Fuji, Pentax, Ricoh, and even (GASP!) Kodak cameras all used the same sensor (film) and somehow nobody came to the brilliant conclusion that since they were using Fuji film (or Kodak), they had to use the same brand camera.....

 

[Ryan85]

I think it would be a mistake for them to surrender chip design--both for Canon and for the users. There needs to be MORE sensor competition--not less.

+1, but Canon needs to do something in the high res department. But if they cannot compete themselves, limited competition is better than no competition at all.

I just talked to a well-off landscape photog still shooting mf film scans as he finds they are better than a 20mp dslr for what he does. When I told him about the upcoming Sony ~50mp cameras, he was thrilled and nearly ready to dump all his Canon gear right away. As a wildlife photog, this isn't my world, but there you are.

If they wanted too, they could produce one easily. Take a 7D2 sensor design, build the design FF size, and you have a 50Mpixel FF camera that shoots 4FPS and needs 40 shots to fill the frame buffer.

The way I figure it, Canon should have 4 FF cameras in it's lineup....
the 1D series for indestructability and speed
the 5 series aimed at weddings and "do it all"
the 6 series as a low end camera
a new series of high megapixel cameras for landscape.

Let's see what the new year brings.... I predict a massive fleet update.

That's pretty much the way I see it too. Lots of people are expecting the 5D Mark IV as also being the large MP camera, but I don't think that makes sense. If high MP was a panacea, then the D810 would stand alone in the higher mid-range FF lineup for Nikon--but they've discovered it isn't. It may be great for studio work and for landscapes, but it lacks a more moderate MP camera's "do anything, go anywhere." While the D800/D810 have been successful, they lack the flexibility that is the hallmark of the 5D Mark III. It's why Nikon has had to bring out their D750 as a "5D killer." They've lost a great deal of market share to Canon over the last 2 and a half years due to the 5D Mark III. Although I do think Canon needs to step up to the plate with a high MP camera, I don't think it will be the 5D Mark IV. I expect that to be a moderate increase on the resolution of the 5D Mark III, but with improvements in IQ, fps and buffer. The AF is already stellar, but they will incorporate the new metering from the 7D Mark II as well as a boost to the AF.

Only time will tell but I expect the high MP camera will be the fabled 3D.

+1 I'm thinking the same thing.

 

[RGF]

I think it would be a mistake for them to surrender chip design--both for Canon and for the users. There needs to be MORE sensor competition--not less.

+1, totally agree! Canon just needs to actually compete on the larger format sensor front. I really hope they do next year...

the sensor is only one part of the camera. The Nikon D800 and Sony A7R use the same sensor, but they are not the same camera.

If Canon can not add value to a Sony sensor, then perhaps they should stop making cameras.

 

[RGF]

I don´t care if it´s canon or sony sensors as longs as they are the best sensors i can buy.

unfortunately canon has not the best sensors for some time.

so i applaud if they would use sonys sensors until they get their act together again.
i do see a problem with DP. but who knows.

+1

 

[dolina]

Does not matter where the part is sourced from so long as equals or rivals 2015 full frame bodies from Nikon & Sony.

 

[dgatwood]

I have received this information a few times over the years, but nothing has never come to fruition, so I’ve never lent much credence to it. I would imagine joint ventures on something as expensive as sensor manufacturing would help lower costs for companies and perhaps customers as well. It’s definitely possible, but I wouldn’t write it in stone yet. If Canon does the manufacturing of the sensor can they put their own technology into a Sony sensor, such as Dual Pixel AF?

That would truly be a killer combination. It would also mean that Canon would get money from every Sony sensor sold, including to Nikon et al, so it isn't entirely out of the question.

 

[Monchoon]

Since Sony is selling and dissolving some (most) of their operations, plus posting a $2+ billion loss but obviously not their insurance in Japan. Could it be a possibility that Canon could acquire the Sony Sensor operation facility; Sony Sensors coming to Canon.

 

[David Hull]

I think it would be a mistake for them to surrender chip design--both for Canon and for the users. There needs to be MORE sensor competition--not less.

There are plenty of good sensor manufacturers out there -- even if Canon quit completely Sony would have plenty of good competition. I think that the real issue may be that Canon's architectural approach is no longer cost competitive with the fully integrated solutions. It may be that it doesn't scale well past 25 MP or so. Right now they are using an additional three chips in the 7DII that Sony doesn't have (two high speed Quad ADC chips and an FPGA to tie it all together). That stuff takes up space and costs money and battery power.

That all assumes that there is some fact to this rumor.

 

[Eldar]

To keep all this in perspective.... for decades Canon, Nikon, Olympus, Fuji, Pentax, Ricoh, and even (GASP!) Kodak cameras all used the same sensor (film) and somehow nobody came to the brilliant conclusion that since they were using Fuji film (or Kodak), they had to use the same brand camera.....

Good point!

As we have argued many times, a complete camera solution inlcudes build quality, HMI, AF system, processing quality and capacity, modes and functions and the available lens line up. In my view Canon is ahead on just about everything, except the sensor. So I would clearly welcome a 46MP/14stop DR Sony sensor in the next Canon camera.

If I got such a camera, with 1DX build quality and functionality, I would not need another camera until it broke and needed replacement (probably after I'm gone). But to trust Sony with a near monoply on sensors is a scary thought.

 

[noms78]

Here is how I see the 2015 lineup:

3d: 46mp sony sensor, 4k video? $4000+?
5d4: 22mp+ canon sensor? 7D2 autofocus and video? $3000-4000?
6d2: 22mp+ canon sensor?, multiple cross type AF and better center point? $2000+?

 

[RGF]

Here is how I see the 2015 lineup:

3d: 46mp sony sensor, 4k video? $4000+?
5d4: 22mp+ canon sensor? 7D2 autofocus and video? $3000-4000?
6d2: 22mp+ canon sensor?, multiple cross type AF and better center point? $2000+?

Possibly but IMO the 5D4 will move up to 28-30 MP and the 6D2 (in 2016) will be around 25-6 MP.

 

[Bennymiata]

To be frank, I just want a great camera for what I normally do, and I would like more dr etc with my 5D3, and if their next model uses a Sony sensor, so what?

As long as the camera is good to use, makes great images and I can use my L lenses on it, I'll buy it, when I'm ready for a change.

Even IF Sony goes bust, I'm sure that Canon or someone else will buy the sensor division and continue supply.
Buying some sensors from Sony could be a real advantage (Sony dr etc with Canon colours, lenses and ergonomics) and give Canon some breathing room to develop the next big thing in sensors.

 

[JohanCruyff]

I would imagine joint ventures on something as expensive as sensor manufacturing would help lower costs for companies and perhaps customers as well. It’s definitely possible, but I wouldn’t write it in stone yet. If Canon does the manufacturing of the sensor can they put their own technology into a Sony sensor, such as Dual Pixel AF?

In other industries (cars etc.) it is frequent to see exchanges of know-how.
Maybe it could be possible for Canon to supply DPAF technology and for Sony to supply DR in the same sensor.


BTW, 46 Mpx is exactly what I need to replace my 5d classic: shooting in S-RAW, I expect to get excellent noise-free 11.5 Mpx pictures. ;D