Still waiting for high MP canon while Nikon is coming out with new 800

[candyman]

The thing I wonder about your post and others like it is - how many people "need" 36+ MP?

The thing I wonder about your post and others like it is why do you care? I want a high MP body, I can pay for it, and I'm tired of people telling me I don't (why do people overquote?) "need" it. I want it, got it?

I think you were actually trying to quoting me (the over-quoter, LOL), and what I was really getting at is that I'm actually one of those people who want a high MP body and would make good use of it, but it seems like most of the people who complain about this on the forums are the same ones who never print their work and post 800x600 photos on the web (for fear of image theft, no doubt). They're also the same people who will someday slap their 50L on their new 40MP camera, shoot hand held at f/1.2 and then complain that their images are all soft.

Okay, maybe I'm being "silly", but so many "people" bitch and moan about "stuff" they don't have when they are "barely" using 20% of what today's "cameras" can do. I hope I didn't over-quote that last sentence

;D
+1

 

[lucuias]

I would prefer canon came out something with high dynamic range and high iso performance instead of high megapixel.I am very happy with 23MP from 5Dmark 3,I just need more high dynamic range for photo manipulation.

 

[Bruce Photography]

Yes, I bought a D800, and files that open to 125 - 150 MB are no fun to edit. Its hard to imagine what editing a 200 - 250 MB file would be like.

The files open so large due to the huge amount of noise in any image over about ISO 800. NEF is a compressed file, but they are uncompressed in order to edit them. I tried editing 1500 shots that I took at high ISO over a couple of nights. I had to use a ton of NR on them, and that took minutes per image to run.

I sold the D800 and bought a 5D MK III, it is much better for high ISO photography. The D800 is great at ISO 200, assuming that you buy lenses that can resolve the high MP, and that you use a tripod or very fast shutter speed. Its difficult to actually get the high resolution possible, many users do not and give up.

I have the 5DIII and both the D800 and D800E. If you have some Nikon glass that you would like to sell because you have sold your D800, please let me know. I use Photoshop CC and Bridge. The actual file sizes on disk (NEF) are less than 50MB and no where close to what you are quoting unless you are talking about the resulting photoshop saved PSD file with all the layers that are not flattened. Perhaps your computer is slow.

I have been very pleased with the resolution of Nikon glass and very much love the 14-24. Since I am a landscape guy I use ISO 100 mostly and here is where I find the D800 surpassing anything in the Canon line (most of which I still own). I find the raw files very easy to edit with Photoshop CC and have developed a very efficient workflow. It is true I am not a high ISO lover since my applications don't need it. Most of my prints that I do myself are 24 x 36 or larger.

Someday, if Canon comes out with a competitive camera, including the improved dynamic range of the D800 sensor over the Canon sensors, I really would like to shoot my Canon glass again because I really think the Canon tilt-shift lenses are a kick. Also Nikon supertels are heavier than Canon equivalents but then Canon is so much more money. I'm sure Nikon will catch up by decreasing weight and raising their prices just like Canon did.

 

[MLfan3]

I've waited a long time for Nikon to recapture the lead on Nikon and their 36 mp camera. And now I read that Nikon will introduce an upgrade to the 800e in June. Why am I not jumping ship? I do have a lot of canon glass and have been a local customer. I own the mk III and 6d and I love the images .BUTT, COME ON ALREADY cCanon. Get your stuff together!

if you want a high resolution FF , get the A7R , it is so simple and easy. the A7R has better sensor, better AF for stills, better video and it is much more portable. unless you need SLR shaped boy with dated mirror based AF, there is no contest but the A7R wins, and adding the Sony in addition to your Canon does not require any kind of lens selling or trading in for new set of crappy Nikon lenses. trust me , Nikon just go down and down from now on since Sony just announced using its best sensor for only its own cameras for certain period of time(6 months or so) this means Nikon will not be able to have any proper access to Sony's latest chips for at least 6 months after the announcement new chips. the D800E replacement will use the Sony A7R sensor and the new Sony A99Mk2 will get better improved version of it.. and in many markets Nikon is already no3 in camera sells, in HK , Australia , Brazil , China and South Korea Sony is already no1 or no2....the fall of Nikon is coming very soon.

 

[danski0224]

+1
I have 18Mp on FF don't want any more! One of the best LARGE prints I have seen was at a Photographers shop in Llangollen. It was a shot of Bantry Bay in Ireland and it covered a whole door - it was shot with a 6mp DSLR. I print to A3+ - I think 18mp will do!

+2

I recently picked up a 4.2mp Canon 1D and have been very impressed with the image quality.

If the rest of the camera was comparable to current production with respect to ISO performance, live view and the rear LCD... but it probably wouldn't sell well as many people would WTF the 4.2mp without trying it.

I usually don't crop too heavily either, so that makes a difference.

 

[FunPhotons]

The thing I wonder about your post and others like it is - how many people "need" 36+ MP?

The thing I wonder about your post and others like it is why do you care? I want a high MP body, I can pay for it, and I'm tired of people telling me I don't (why do people overquote?) "need" it. I want it, got it?

Because we are trying to help you get better images. ...

That's great, thanks for the unasked for and unwanted help! Maybe I/we want a high MP body because we like gadgets, maybe we just like lots of pixels, maybe we have too much disk space that needs filling, or maybe we feel it will help us get better pictures. Who cares? But stop dictating the same, tired trope that more pixels doesn't give better pictures. I suspect that people who push this idea are trying to convince themselves more than us, maybe they can't afford it? Or more likely, maybe they can't afford the infrastructure to handle the larger shots?

Anyhow I have cameras that span the gamut, from Google Glass on my head to a 5D with a ton of glass perched on it. Guess what? The more pixels with the better glass gives me better pictures! Technically they're better, and even more I take far more care with them, so get better shots. At the low end with my phone or Glass, I'll just snap away and hope for the best.

Sure some nabob will promptly say, for the thousandth time, that a cell phone camera can take a picture worthy of National Geographic. Yeah, whatever, we've heard that a few times, but I have yet to see a iPhone shot that made it on those pages with any regularity. Regardless you don't find us telling you guys that 24 isn't enough for you, so stop trying to tell us that 24 is enough for us.

 

[Jglaser757]

I've waited a long time for Nikon to recapture the lead on Nikon and their 36 mp camera. And now I read that Nikon will introduce an upgrade to the 800e in June. Why am I not jumping ship? I do have a lot of canon glass and have been a local customer. I own the mk III and 6d and I love the images .BUTT, COME ON ALREADY cCanon. Get your stuff together!

if you want a high resolution FF , get the A7R , it is so simple and easy. the A7R has better sensor, better AF for stills, better video and it is much more portable. unless you need SLR shaped boy with dated mirror based AF, there is no contest but the A7R wins, and adding the Sony in addition to your Canon does not require any kind of lens selling or trading in for new set of crappy Nikon lenses. trust me , Nikon just go down and down from now on since Sony just announced using its best sensor for only its own cameras for certain period of time(6 months or so) this means Nikon will not be able to have any proper access to Sony's latest chips for at least 6 months after the announcement new chips. the D800E replacement will use the Sony A7R sensor and the new Sony A99Mk2 will get better improved version of it.. and in many markets Nikon is already no3 in camera sells, in HK , Australia , Brazil , China and South Korea Sony is already no1 or no2....the fall of Nikon is coming very soon.

I have researched the A7r and am thinking of switching to that. I guess I needed to clarify some things. I print big usually and shoot lanscapes. So I no the sony makes sense, but I'm shocked that canon did not retake the lead.
I. Have also considered the Pentax 645 , but then I'm back to the issue of glass.

I do appreciate the discussion here. It helps a lot !

 

[Orangutan]

That's great, thanks for the unasked for and unwanted help!

<snip>

The more pixels with the better glass gives me better pictures! Technically they're better, and even more I take far more care with them, so get better shots. At the low end with my phone or Glass, I'll just snap away and hope for the best.

<snip>

Regardless you don't find us telling you guys that 24 isn't enough for you, so stop trying to tell us that 24 is enough for us.

For every one of you who has money to burn and a fetish for the newest/best, there are many more who simply need help using what they have. Forum readers can't always tell the difference from sketchy posts such as yours.

Forum readers are not mind readers, just like the rest of the human species. When someone answers with advice that's unwanted, maybe it's a clue that you didn't ask the question very clearly.

 

[mustafaakarsu]

[/quote]
in addition to your Canon does not require any kind of lens selling or trading in for new set of crappy Nikon lenses. trust me , Nikon just go down and down from now on since Sony just announced using its best sensor for only its own camera
[/quote]

Could you explain it a bit, how can Sony cameras use Canon lenses better than Nikon?

 

[Orangutan]

Could you explain it a bit, how can Sony cameras use Canon lenses better than Nikon?

Metabones adapter.

 

[atkinsr]

Even on the insanely expensive 70" 4K tvs, it's still only 4k. That leaves print: I'm just curious what print houses will print at these resolutions? Even the highly regarded mpixpro lab made me send them an 8 bit sRGB JPG for my 24x36 print, and much to my surprise, at 24MP, it turned out just fine. Could it have looked better? Sure, but after playing around a LOT with the images (including re-shooting the scene zoomed in and stitching images to get a much higher effective pixel count), I'm convinced that this is due to the JPG requirement, not pixel count.

People are going to buy what they want, and I'm not going to try to stop them. I just don't understand the need to go any higher. If you are consistently cropping for added zoom, you have the wrong lens or are standing in the wrong place.

If you shoot for large format prints, you have the wrong camera, you should be shooting medium format.

I keep hearing people talk about needing high frame rates (makes sense) and high MP (why?) for sports. Even using the lossless compression, those are roughly 50MB files.
50MB x 10FPS = 500MB/s. Good luck finding a card to keep up with that. You'd need a 1-2GB insanely fast buffer in the camera just to be able to shoot for 2 seconds.

 

[David Hull]

I've waited a long time for Nikon to recapture the lead on Nikon and their 36 mp camera. And now I read that Nikon will introduce an upgrade to the 800e in June. Why am I not jumping ship? I do have a lot of canon glass and have been a local customer. I own the mk III and 6d and I love the images .BUTT, COME ON ALREADY cCanon. Get your stuff together!

The thing I wonder about your post and others like it is - how many people "need" 36+ MP? Sure, it's always nice to have more than you need, but unless you have the very best lenses - Canon Mk II big whites, Zeiss Otus 55 & Zeiss 135 f/2, etc., there will be little increase in actual resolution. It would help a lot with cropping and would equalize the FF vs. crop war for wildlife...but again, only with the very best lenses and technique. I've printed many large prints at 40x60 or larger at 300dpi (that's around a 3x enlargement for 5DII files) and found little to complain about. Most people share photos at 1600x1200 or less online and rarely, if ever, print anything over 8x12"...but these are the people who often scream the loudest over their inadequate megapixel bodies!

While we wait for more MP, I'll keep shooting what I've got and won't lose any sleep over my 18 and 22 MP bodies 8)

They "need" it because Nikon has it and Canon doesn't.

 

[mackguyver]

Even the highly regarded mpixpro lab made me send them an 8 bit sRGB JPG for my 24x36 print, and much to my surprise, at 24MP, it turned out just fine.

Are you using the latest ROES version? I'm not sure about MPix, but the ROES that Bay Labs and others are now using support TIFF uploads and most labs that use ROES allow you to use AdobeRGB.

 

[sdsr]

in addition to your Canon does not require any kind of lens selling or trading in for new set of crappy Nikon lenses. trust me , Nikon just go down and down from now on since Sony just announced using its best sensor for only its own camera
[/quote]

Could you explain it a bit, how can Sony cameras use Canon lenses better than Nikon?
[/quote]

If you're asking whether Canon lenses work better on Sony A7/A7r bodies than Nikon lenses do, the latest metabones EF-Nex/e-mount adapter provides aperture control for most/many (all?) EF lenses and (if you're not in a hurry) AF for some. I don't think there's a Nikon-Nex equivalent yet. Provided you don't mind manual focusing and manual aperture control, manual Nikon lenses (you need the aperture ring) work just fine on the Sonys (as do a vast range of manual lenses - that's part of the appeal of mirrorless cameras). This has nothing in particular to do with FF, by the way - the metabones EF adapter works just the same on Sony's APS-C mirrorless bodies.

If you're asking whether Canon lenses work better on Sony mirrorless cameras than they do on Nikon cameras, I don't think it's physically possible to attach an EF Canon lens to a Nikon body; so the question doesn't really arise. (Or am I wrong about this?)

For whatever it's worth, in my experience Canon lenses work superbly on Sony mirrorless bodies - leaving aside AF issues (accuracy is dead-on; speed, on the other hand...). And that's true not just of L lenses but even such lowly old-timers as the 50mm 1.4 and 85mm 1.8. When I get caught up with processing photos I'll probably post a few on this forum - though by now that point has been made by others elsewhere.

 

[sdsr]

If you are consistently cropping for added zoom, you have the wrong lens or are standing in the wrong place.

Perhaps. But swap "sometimes" for "consistently" and bear in mind that a small mirrorless FF camera + Zeiss/Sony 35mm or 55mm (or one of the smaller Canon - or anyone else's for that matter - primes) weighs little and is really easy to carry around all day; and the higher the resolution the easier it is to forego carrying around a longer lens as well.

 

[sdsr]

Or they decided to do the hard thing (refreshing a large portion of their lens lineup) before doing the relatively easy thing (increasing pixel density in a single body). As has been noted numerous times, both the optics and the electronics net the effective system resolution, hence the 5D3 + lenses resolving better on average than the D800 + lenses.

Sure; but didn't Roger Cicala at lensrentals show that while the Canon 24-70 2.8 L II is a higher-resolution lens than the Tamron equivalent, the Tamron on a Nikon D800 outresolves the Canon on a 5DIII? Reports suggest that the Canon performs awfully well on a Sony A7r (I wonder if anyone has done a similar comparison with both lenses on an A7/A7r).

It may well be that most people don't "need" more resolution, and that many of those who think they want it would be disappointed when they got it, but would anyone here complain if Canon released a relatively affordable (i.e. comparable to Sony) FF camera with higher resolution and better low ISO performance (especially if it also had at least as good high ISO performance as the 6D/1Dx)? I wouldn't - especially if it were also mirrorless, so we could avoid the tiresome back/front-focus problems that seem to affect so many lenses.

 

[Halfrack]

Everyone itching to spend money get in line for the Pentax 645z, as it's 50mp is even more detail....

Otherwise, go take a photo and have fun.

 

[3kramd5]

Or they decided to do the hard thing (refreshing a large portion of their lens lineup) before doing the relatively easy thing (increasing pixel density in a single body). As has been noted numerous times, both the optics and the electronics net the effective system resolution, hence the 5D3 + lenses resolving better on average than the D800 + lenses.

Sure; but didn't Roger Cicala at lensrentals show that while the Canon 24-70 2.8 L II is a higher-resolution lens than the Tamron equivalent, the Tamron on a Nikon D800 outresolves the Canon on a 5DIII?

I don't know, but I don't doubt it. My point was that if and when canon decides to turn out a higher resolution sensor, their lens lineup will be ready.

 

[Harry Muff]

When you do heavy retouching of 10 hours or more, nice big images are very nice to have. A medium format is out of the question for most due to the silly prices, so it's a 5D3, an 800E.




Of course, the tide is turning somewhat with MF but, unless the Pentax 645z delivers, or the rumoured Fuji MF camera hits the right notes, then it'll have to be the 800E to get those big, juicy files to work on.




I use a 5D3 and love it, but it would be nice if the images had a good few more MPs to play with.

 

[LightandMotion]

I've waited a long time for Nikon to recapture the lead on Nikon and their 36 mp camera. And now I read that Nikon will introduce an upgrade to the 800e in June. Why am I not jumping ship? I do have a lot of canon glass and have been a local customer. I own the mk III and 6d and I love the images .BUTT, COME ON ALREADY cCanon. Get your stuff together!

if you want a high resolution FF , get the A7R , it is so simple and easy. the A7R has better sensor, better AF for stills, better video and it is much more portable. unless you need SLR shaped boy with dated mirror based AF, there is no contest but the A7R wins, and adding the Sony in addition to your Canon does not require any kind of lens selling or trading in for new set of crappy Nikon lenses. trust me , Nikon just go down and down from now on since Sony just announced using its best sensor for only its own cameras for certain period of time(6 months or so) this means Nikon will not be able to have any proper access to Sony's latest chips for at least 6 months after the announcement new chips. the D800E replacement will use the Sony A7R sensor and the new Sony A99Mk2 will get better improved version of it.. and in many markets Nikon is already no3 in camera sells, in HK , Australia , Brazil , China and South Korea Sony is already no1 or no2....the fall of Nikon is coming very soon.

This is exactly what I have done for landscapes. My Canon EF glass on the A7R. The dynamic range is better than my 1dx. Hopeless for sports and wildlife, but no one wants 36MP for that.