Teardown: The Canon EOS R5 gets an autopsy

[Richard CR]

This is actually totally sensible solution. Anything under 50C is not hot to touch. Is warm to hot but not burning. Attaching an L-plate with fins will further assist cooling down camera faster if heat was directed to the bottom plate.

50c would cause low temperature burns. 48C is the maximum if you only hold it for up to 10 minutes.

 

[SecureGSM]

50c would cause low temperature burns. 48C is the maximum if you only hold it for up to 10 minutes

Ok 48C. You do not hold camera by bottom plate for more then 10 minutes when you shooting. Of course. Furthermore, a battery grip with an active exhaust fan inbuilt can be utilised to cover the bottom plate ( hot plate) and vent the hot air out

 

[Richard CR]

Ok 48C. You do not hold camera by bottom plate for more then 10 minutes when you shooting. Of course. Furthermore, a battery grip with an active exhaust fan inbuilt can be utilised to cover the bottom plate ( hot plate) and vent the hot air out

the bottom plate is most likely not thermally isolated from the rest of the camera. the camera is not getting re-designed.
48C will cause burns if you hold the camera for more than 10 minutes. if you heat one part of the solid magnesium alloy shell, the rest of it will heat up as well.

which means you really can't go above around 40C .. and then there's this EU regulations that are taking effect in 2021 that apparently lower the operating temperature as well.

 

[pmjm]

If there was any venting, the camera would get eviscerated for its lack of weather-proofing...

My proposal is to put a vent on the bottom but have it sealed by attaching the battery grip.

 

[SecureGSM]

the bottom plate is most likely not thermally isolated from the rest of the camera. the camera is not getting re-designed.
48C will cause burns if you hold the camera for more than 10 minutes. if you heat one part of the solid magnesium alloy shell, the rest of it will heat up as well.

which means you really can't go above around 40C .. and then there's this EU regulations that are taking effect in 2021 that apparently lower the operating temperature as well.

It is partially correct but the larger the area that dissipate heat the faster the surface will cool down and it won’t be as hot. Let’s think about it from thermodynamics perspective. Camera radiates a certain amount of energy that used to hit a mass. The larger the mass and heat dissipation surface the cooler the camera is. Fins and active cooling (Via attached battery grip with active cooling fan) will reduce surface temperature. Fast. I am not an expert in thermodynamics but from what I know: it makes sense.

 

[pmjm]

And where would the thermal paste transfer the heat to??? It basically boils down to... if you don't or can't vent the camera, then you it doesn't matter how much or how good your thermal paste is.

If it could direct the heat to the chasse, it passively radiates into the air around the camera.

 

[Richard CR]

It is partially correct but the larger the area that dissipate heat the faster the surface will cool down and it won’t be as hot. Let’s think about it from thermodynamics perspective. Camera radiates a certain amount of energy that used to hit a mass. The larger the mass and heat dissipation surface the cooler the camera is. Fins and active cooling (Via attached battery grip with active cooling fan) will reduce surface temperature. Fast. I am not an expert in thermodynamics but from what I know: it makes sense.

Possibly. Another problem may be the assembly of such a unit and the fact that a heat pipe will radiate heat internally as well. and there's not enough room to put any sort of heat piping over the processor and memory because of the daughterboard.

it also doesn't get around the fact that the cards seem to be playing a huge issue in this as well. considering the camera can record for up to 4 hours without a card in it.

if this is the case, which it seems likely, then it really doesn't matter of the CPU,etc is cooled any better, because the problem is the cards.

So I don't know .. but it really doesn't matter what we think - the camera simply isn't designed in such a way.

however EOSHD's take was extremely unwarranted IMO.

 

[David - Sydney]

The Atomos Ninja cannot support 8K nor likely 4K120 - neither the Canon nor Ninja have HDMI 2.1, so that's internal or nothing. There is an 8K modules coming for their Neon range.

I read today that there are no certified HDMI 2.1 cables yet.. that they won't be available before the end of the year and so some current ones will work and others might not. PS5 etc will drive these requirements but they are bleeding edge. Can't imagine that Canon would include a HDMI2.1 port on this basis.

 

[jeliel]

What about some R4 and R7, for example ? I mean R5 & R6 without video stuff ? It would be cheaper for people like me who don't give a ... about video ...

 

[AaronT]

I'm calling Noctua.

Wrong, everyone knows that you need one of these. Noctua is too noisy and will screw up the sound during video recording!

 

[PerKr]

What about some R4 and R7, for example ? I mean R5 & R6 without video stuff ? It would be cheaper for people like me who don't give a ... about video ...

It has been explained time and time again that this would not yield a lower cost product. If anything, such a camera would be niche enough to warrant a higher price. If you don't want video, just don't use the video functions and be happy about not needing to consider whether a camera does 1080 or 4K.

 

[JTPhotography]

R5 is pure junk. I smoke and after shooting only 3 landscape images with shutter speeds of greater than a half second, I can light a cigarette by sticking it in the big card slot.

 

[Berowne]

I hope Roger will show us a teardown of the R5 (and of course the new Sony A7S III) soon. Wonder what he will tell us.

 

[DBounce]

Similar reason to why so many are sure of it, just the flip side.

If limiting it was the primary goal, it seems like quite the oversight to allow unlimited external recording. Not to mention even making 8K RAW available in the first place.

That’s the type of thing that probably slipped through the cracks. It was not immediately discovered even after release. As for allowing 8K... it was provided for marketing purposes. And crippled to ensure it would be useless in any practical application. Explain why it cannot be outputted via HDMI since the port allows up to 8K @30p? Because this feature was deliberately crippled. It’s just there to grab headlines.

 

[DBounce]

Admin: Can you please republish this PDF Canon USA Media Alert

It was a Canon Media Alert not from a manual. LOL. However the Canon USA site page is down. Here's the entire media alert in pdf form

CanonU.S.A.,Inc.MediaAlert

https://www.photoxels.com/photography/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/Canon-EOS-R5-and-R6-Overheating-Media-Alert.pdf

Conveniently, in the estimated recovery times section, they do not in fact list any recovery times... just partial recovery times. If they had listed the actual time (2 or more hours) needed for a full recovery everyone would realize these features are not really intended to be usable.

 

[Eclipsed]

And where would the heat sink vent to? If the camera is sealed, then the heat still stays in the camera. The heat sink can spread the heat around inside the camera body, but that only gets you so far before the entire of the inside reaches the same critical temperature. That the R5 is already so cramped, means that there is not a lot of space for the heat sink to work anyways.

Looking a bit further... you will notice that there isn't much space behind the sensor. There is that aluminum plate that is blocking (?) the heat to the sensor. If the heat were to be vented in front of the senor, then it would end up in the lens.Long story short; there isn't a lot of space to disperse the heat to, so really a fancy solution like thermal paste to conduct heat to a heat sink would be an expensive was of effort.

BTW, thermal paste is used to ensure heat connectivity between the CPU and the heat sink. Since a heat sink would be fairly useless, then thermal paste is moot. Some have mentioned seeing huge copper pads used a heat sinks which makes way more sense.

Thermal mass like copper pad is essentially useless unless it take the heat somewhere else. Same for conductive paste.
Granted if a chip has a hot spot a pasted plate can get the heat away from that spot but that’s different from getting heat out of a plastic box for more than 10 minutes of continuous operation.

 

[Quarkcharmed]

R5 is pure junk. I smoke and after shooting only 3 landscape images with shutter speeds of greater than a half second, I can light a cigarette by sticking it in the big card slot.

What do you smoke?..

 

[Stu_bert]

Because EOSHD never actually measured the device temperature. They are merely speculating. And have actually errored in their speculation. The device can get extremely hot. Period. And CFexpress cards and SD cards don't have sleep modes. They get hot still when not in use if merely sitting in a card slot. The cards have been pulled out and measured in several Youtube videos already. Reaching well over 104 F when not in use. Most all electronic devices get hot. That's why CPUs and ICs have cooling, fansinks, and FANS. Oh and yes smartphones too. They've been known to catch fire and banned from airlines at one time.

They (Delkin) support power modes and you can disconnect at the the PHY - physical layer, to further reduce power draw. The also have lower power states when writing if the OS supports. I couldn't find an equivalent spec for Sandisk, Sony, Prograde, WISE or Lexar, but I assume it is part of the CFExpress standard precisely because they know their devices get hot...

I equate disconnect or low power modes as a sleep mode.

 

[Richard CR]

R5 is pure junk. I smoke and after shooting only 3 landscape images with shutter speeds of greater than a half second, I can light a cigarette by sticking it in the big card slot.

you should pay extra for that.

 

[Richard CR]

They (Delkin) support power modes and you can disconnect at the the PHY - physical layer, to further reduce power draw. The also have lower power states when writing if the OS supports. I couldn't find an equivalent spec for Sandisk, Sony, Prograde, WISE or Lexar, but I assume it is part of the CFExpress standard precisely because they know their devices get hot...

I equate disconnect or low power modes as a sleep mode.

yeah, I'd be curious about a power sleep mode. There must be one in the specification.

that would be better than powering it off programmatically because then any maintenance the card controller is doing can finish gracefully before going to sleep.