4 More DSLRs Coming in 2012? [CR2]

[BXL]

If the mirrorless doesn’t count against the 4 purported camera bodies, I’m unsure what else Canon could have up their sleeves for the EOS line.

Maybe the 7D Mark II?

Regarding the entry level FF, what kind of AF can we expect: the old one of the 5D II with only one center cross-type AF point, one with 9 or maybe even 19 cross-type AF points?

 

[Astro]

i hope one is an answer to the rumored nikon D600.

 

[traveller]

I'm not sure about 'entry level' full frame. The first reason is a comment I read a Sony rep make in an interview, which appeared to suggest the A900/A850 were expensive to make and did not have high enough margins (although this could be Sony trying to justify SLT). The second reason is that I think a lot of this speculation is simply a reaction to the D600 rumours emanating from the NR website. Nikon certainly have more room to manoeuvre than Canon, especially with the existence of the 24MP Sony FF chip (and rumours of an updated version on the way). What would an 'entry level' full frame Canon look like? Realistically, there's only two choices of sensor -the 5D MkIII's 22MP and the 1D X's 18MP; not much of a product differentiation. I can't see them using the 18MP sensor, as I think this would devalue the 1D X psychologically by implying that it uses Canon's 'budget' FF sensor. So how else to differentiate from the 5D MkIII: less weather sealing, <100% viewfinder, slower frame rate, smaller image buffer? They're all a given (I would think), but Sony's experience with the A900/A850 would suggest that this isn't enough -a major product feature would have to be omitted. I'm guessing that would have to be the fancy AF system, which would leave the camera as little more than the 5D MkII with a slightly improved sensor. Unless Canon can knock them out at a very low price point, which might disrupt their APS-C line-up (refer also to my first point about the A900/A850 margins).

With regard to the 7D MkII / 70D - I don't think that there is room for both models and an 'entry level' full frame camera in the market; I feel that the 7D MkII and this '6D' (or whatever) would be a bit too close in price. I could be wrong -there may still be a market for a 'screaming beast' 7D MkII (which I basically see as a 5D MkIII with an APS-C sensor and probably a faster frame rate), at a similar price point to a basic full frame 6D.

Now the 'big if' -the high megapixel body... I know there's a lot of interest from 1Ds MkIII owners in a 1-series body that would truly be an upgrade. After all, it is these people that choose to pay (extra) for a slower, but higher resolution camera than the 1D series. Having said this, I think that it would be a mistake for Canon to choose to make their only high resolution body a 1-series camera. Nikon did this with the D3X and proved that whilst this approach gets you the kudos, it doesn't generate the sales.

Finally a quick word about mirrorless: I'm now convinced this will be a big part of Canon's Photokina plans. All the technology that Canon needs to make the perfect mirrorless camera is now in place and prototyped on other models (large sensor in a small body - G1X, on-chip phase detect AF -650D [/Rebel Kiss XXX, or whatever] , STM lenses). I call it the perfect mirrorless camera because all the models introduced so far have one flaw or other (though they are steadily improving). Let's hope that Canon can use their two years of observing the mistakes of others and produce the definitive mirrorless body accompanied by a strong lens line-up at launch (and a good roadmap).

 

[Astro]

How about a FF entry with no Video, you know to keep the price down, something for the purist photographers for a change…. 650D is good enough for those wanting to do video

Let the fire and brimstone begin ;D hehehe

well video R&D is already done.
the functions are in the digic 5 already ... so how will that work?
imo that would only work if they don´t invest in R&D for video at all (in the future).

and i would call that highly unlikely.

they can disable the features sure.. but that would not safe them a cent (*).
it would only make the video models more expensive but not the crippled ones cheaper.

(*) ok a few cents maybe, for the mics as an example.

 

[briansquibb]

Sooo...my 5DmkII is being considered 'entry level' now?

5DII has always been the entry level ff

 

[HurtinMinorKey]

It was a bit silly of me to mention the AF because AF doesn't matter to me at all but I thought that perhaps the whole full frame/automatic stance might be something that would sell really well for Canon. Thinking about it you're right about the undercutting the C300 and I'm most probably just being paranoid.

I think you are being paranoid. Have you looked at the Gh2 hacks? That seems to be the best bang for your buck video right now.

Also, the c300 will always have better DR over any 5D variant, presuming it uses the same 5D3 sensor.

 

[HeWhoShoots]

I'm just about to pull the trigger on a 5D MK3 and I mostly shoot video, can someone please throw me a 'you're doing the right thing' bone. I'm worried that what Canon might do is make a video orientated entry level full frame borrow the AF technology from the new 650D/T4i.

Can you see where I'm coming from?

Personally, I'm waiting. In the same boat as you.

Same boat as both of you. Thinking I will hold on to my 60D for now, invest in a 24-70 and other equipment (just got a Glidecam woohoo!) and wait til end of the year to make the Mark 3 jump.

Enjoy the Glidecam. I use a Merlin and love it quite a good bit. I'm waiting to see the entry levels specs, it looks like a better cam for me since any upgrade from a 550D will be great.

 

[pakosouthpark]

this news messes my mind a lot!! if was going to get a 5d mk II in the end of the month! im not travelling till end of august though so I guess I could wait! baaaah :-\ wish I could get more about this!

 

[preppyak]

What about a boring old replacement for the 1100D? Not very sexy, but certainly possible, especially if it's in Q4

Probably too soon for that, the T3 is only a little over a year old. The XS went for nearly 3 years before getting replaced.

 

[preppyak]

How about a FF entry with no Video, you know to keep the price down, something for the purist photographers for a change…. 650D is good enough for those wanting to do video

they can disable the features sure.. but that would not safe them a cent (*).
it would only make the video models more expensive but not the crippled ones cheaper.

(*) ok a few cents maybe, for the mics as an example.

As was mentioned, you wouldn't save money that way. Simple supply and demand really. If 25% of users want video, than the non-video DSLR either has to be 25% cheaper to make (its firmware already designed and a few hardware parts, so, not likely), or they have to charge 25% more for it to break even. And so on if the percentage is higher than 25%. Oh, and as an owner, it'd probably be harder to re-sell to upgrade since your market would be smaller as well.

If memory serves me, there was a poll on this forum, and it wasn't until about the 30% cheaper price point that people were willing to give up video functions in their DSLR's. So, I'd say they probably aren't going away.

 

[sleepnever]

I wish they'd hurry up and announce/release these! I want to upgrade from my T2i to something more mid to high end before all my trips to various places this summer and later in the year.

 

[lol]

For the 4 bodies, I'd go with a 70D, budget FF, and how about TWO mirrorless bodies? A lower model and a mid range model? The 650D showed us something a bit different, and I can see the new toys making their move into the 70D at least and it would be a good fit for mirrorless.

traveller, a budget full frame just wont kill the 7D. If you need crop, you need crop. They are too different. Even today, if you offered me a choice of 7D or 5D2 to use day to day, it would be the 7D no question. Use the right tool for the job. Full frame isn't the only tool.

 

[Daniel Flather]

When can we CR3 a ff mirror-less, or even the ef 20mm f2.8L?

 

[stipotle]

What would an 'entry level' full frame Canon look like? Realistically, there's only two choices of sensor -the 5D MkIII's 22MP and the 1D X's 18MP; not much of a product differentiation. I can't see them using the 18MP sensor, as I think this would devalue the 1D X psychologically by implying that it uses Canon's 'budget' FF sensor. So how else to differentiate from the 5D MkIII: less weather sealing, <100% viewfinder, slower frame rate, smaller image buffer? They're all a given (I would think), but Sony's experience with the A900/A850 would suggest that this isn't enough -a major product feature would have to be omitted. I'm guessing that would have to be the fancy AF system, which would leave the camera as little more than the 5D MkII with a slightly improved sensor. Unless Canon can knock them out at a very low price point, which might disrupt their APS-C line-up (refer also to my first point about the A900/A850 margins).

Is the 18MP sensor really only slightly better? I've seen some amazing sample images.
And think about the 5DC - it was revolutionary because it had an amazing sensor put into an affordable body. Couldn't the flip side of "devaluing" the 1DX sensor be more like they put the flagship sensor in an affordable body (if that sales pitch worked once...)
Also - the non-fancy AF these days is still better than the 5D mkII's. So it would be more like a 5D mkII with a better sensor (slightly or more) and a slightly better AF. Seems reasonable to me for a true MkII refresh.

I dunno, don't mind me. That's just what I want. And I'm only coming from a wish list point of view, not necessarily logical one.

 

[ed24]

It was a bit silly of me to mention the AF because AF doesn't matter to me at all but I thought that perhaps the whole full frame/automatic stance might be something that would sell really well for Canon. Thinking about it you're right about the undercutting the C300 and I'm most probably just being paranoid.

I think you are being paranoid. Have you looked at the Gh2 hacks? That seems to be the best bang for your buck video right now.

Also, the c300 will always have better DR over any 5D variant, presuming it uses the same 5D3 sensor.

Yeah I like the GH2 a lot but I'm not so sure I'd purchase one as I know the GH3 is just around the corner, I've got a pretty close relationship with Panasonic UK and I know the GH3 is in the wild. Hopefully I'll get my hands on one soon.

 

[justsomedude]

A mirrorless body isn't really a DSLR, so, technically speaking, only 3 more DLSRs are coming in 2012.

Just sayin'...

 

[alan_k]

I agree with the guess about an XXXXD upgrade. Adding a touch screen and Digic 5 without the fancy hybrid AF would be enough to warrant a new version. It all depends on what they do with their mirrorless offerings. If they really push mirrorless as a big new part of their line, they may want to avoid a low-end DSLR that might impact their mirrorless sales. However, those entry rebels are the perfect gateway drug for their higher end DSLRs, and they may not want to abandon that so quickly.

 

[Gcon]

There will be no point having an entry level FF unless Nikon comes out with one, otherwise they'll cannibalise 5D3 sales.

1100D
70D
3D - high MP FF

Sorry 7D users - your time is up.

 

[dlleno]

noteably absent from the CR2 speculation in the OP was any meaningful stab at how Canon will rationalize the 7D and 1D successors. If the prosumer APS-C body is the 70D, and there is no direct replacement for the 7D, this implies hope for an APS-H body

 

[Dylan777]

When can we CR3 a ff mirror-less, or even the ef 20mm f2.8L?

+1...works with current L lenses