A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement

[Canon Rumors]

I missed this a few weeks ago, but over at Northlight, they posted that there would be an EOS 5D C instead of a direct EOS-1D C replacement. This is said to be due to lack of sales for the $12,000 (at launch) cinema DSLR.</p>
<p><strong>From Northlight</strong></p>
<blockquote><p>we’re told that the ‘general purpose’ 5D4 will come along with 5D C specialist video DSLR. 1D C sales have not been good enough to get the return on development of a new version.</p></blockquote>
<p>That idea may shed some light on <a href="http://www.canonrumors.com/2015/02/possible-canon-eos-5d-mark-iv-spec-talk-cr2/" target="_blank">what we posted yesterday in regards to a test camera that shoots 4K in a 5D sized body</a>. I’ll say again, the source stressed that such a camera may not appear as a consumer product, just that it has been tested.</p>
<p>We will note that Canon has said themselves that they’re going to make more focused products in the DSLR space, and not worry about pleasing everyone with every camera.</p>
<p>Source: [<a href="http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/cameras/Canon_5d4.html" target="_blank">NL</a>]</p>
<p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;">c</span>r</strong></p>

 

[sanj]

Re: A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement [CR1]

Every passing day I feel I should sell off both my 1dc.

 

[AvTvM]

Re: A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement [CR1]

YES! Just LOVE the idea of such a model split. Canon should bring a stills optimized 5D IV for the conservative, stills-only mirrorslapper crowd. And all those yelling for 4k in every DLSR should be asked to put their wallet where their mouth is and shell out a couple 100 or 1000 more for a "video-optimized" 4k video 5D C.

And for me please a EOS M5 mirrorless FF camera with all the capabilities of the 5D IV in a smaller, lighter package without mirror and without video out. 8)

 

[AE-1Burnham]

Re: A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement [CR1]

This has made the most sense since hearing those rumoured specs.


Good way for canon to give 4K at a high-but-not-too-high price point.


Wonder what they will call it...

 

[ajfotofilmagem]

Re: A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement [CR1]

If we consider the rumor over a 18 megapixel camera, 12 frames per second, video 4K, double CFast card slot, it fits well in a hypothetical 5D Cinema.

Although I believe that Canon can limit it to 10 photos per second, not to eat the sales of 1D series. :

 

[Lee Jay]

Re: A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement [CR1]

This makes no sense to me.

If the development costs of the 1DC were prohibitive, despite the fact that it's basically just a 1DX, how would doing the exact same thing with a 5D4/5DC make any difference as far as development cost goes?

The problem with the 1DC wasn't the development cost, it was the body cost. Charging $5000+ to add a feature that's included in a $900 camera was insulting, and most people wouldn't pay it. Can't blame them!

 

[PureClassA]

Re: A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement [CR1]

Saw that at Northlight too. It would make sense, and it fits into the notion of a 4k 1DX2 and a 5D4 and/or 5DC. If they really DO make a 5 series Cinema body, then I would think we may not see 4k in a 5D4, or at least not to the extent in a dedicated 5DC body.

A true Cinema body could have about 12MP... and then when used to shoot video, it would mask down to 8-9MP. (Exactly what the Sony A7S is/does). So you can still get great low light stills but have a perfect pixel for pixel capture of true 4k with no bining. But if they do actually produce such a machine, they need to get it out sooner than later and make sure they allow it to have a TRUE clean HDMI output

 

[PureClassA]

Re: A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement [CR1]

This makes no sense to me.

If the development costs of the 1DC were prohibitive, despite the fact that it's basically just a 1DX, how would doing the exact same thing with a 5D4/5DC make any difference as far as development cost goes?

The probably with the 1DC wasn't the development cost, it was the body cost. Charging $5000+ to add a feature that's included in a $900 camera was insulting, and most people wouldn't pay it. Can't blame them!

Yup. That's why it dies with a 4k - 1DX2. That model was largely non-viable at its price when it came out and is even less so today, even with the big price drop.

 

[Lee Jay]

Re: A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement [CR1]

YES! Just LOVE the idea of such a model split. Canon should bring a stills optimized 5D IV for the conservative, stills-only mirrorslapper crowd. And all those yelling for 4k in every DLSR should be asked to put their wallet where their mouth is and shell out a couple 100 or 1000 more for a "video-optimized" 4k video 5D C.

You think a 5DC would only cost $100 or $1,000?

 

[adventureous]

Re: A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement [CR1]

This is great news !!!!!! I have about 80,000 clicks on my 5d2 and about 2 minutes of video.

 

[jebrady03]

Re: A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement [CR1]

I sincerely hope this is true! Why? So all the morons who type 5Dc instead of 5D realize they have no business changing the name of a camera for a company.

Wait... No... I just remembered... These are Internet idiots, they're unlikely to realize much of anything. In fact, at least one will probably try and be funny and say that Canon owes them for infringement with the name 5Dc.

I have no idea why I let Internet morons bother me...

 

[ajfotofilmagem]

Re: A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement [CR1]

YES! Just LOVE the idea of such a model split. Canon should bring a stills optimized 5D IV for the conservative, stills-only mirrorslapper crowd. And all those yelling for 4k in every DLSR should be asked to put their wallet where their mouth is and shell out a couple 100 or 1000 more for a "video-optimized" 4k video 5D C.

You think a 5DC would only cost $100 or $1,000?

I understand what he means $200 or $2000 more for the version that records 4K video.

 

[ajfotofilmagem]

Re: A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement [CR1]

I sincerely hope this is true! Why? So all the morons who type 5Dc instead of 5D realize they have no business changing the name of a camera for a company.

Hopefully Canon really launch a 5D Cinema. ??? So every time someone asks for advice on the next Rebel (or 70D), people will stop responding the old 5D Classic is the best inexpensive camera for all users of this planet. :-X

 

[Lee Jay]

Re: A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement [CR1]

YES! Just LOVE the idea of such a model split. Canon should bring a stills optimized 5D IV for the conservative, stills-only mirrorslapper crowd. And all those yelling for 4k in every DLSR should be asked to put their wallet where their mouth is and shell out a couple 100 or 1000 more for a "video-optimized" 4k video 5D C.

You think a 5DC would only cost $100 or $1,000?

I understand what he means $200 or $2000 more for the version that records 4K video.

Well, if I want an SLR that has 4k, with his approach, I'd need both a 5DIV and a 5DC. That's not $100 or $1000 extra, that's a whole new body extra.

 

[Tugela]

Re: A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement [CR1]

I guess Canon's logic was that because the 1DC sold poorly, no one was interested in high end video in DSLRs, and consequently they didn't bother with implementing that in consumer products.

 

[docsmith]

Re: A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement [CR1]

This makes no sense to me.

If the development costs of the 1DC were prohibitive, despite the fact that it's basically just a 1DX, how would doing the exact same thing with a 5D4/5DC make any difference as far as development cost goes?

The problem with the 1DC wasn't the development cost, it was the body cost. Charging $5000+ to add a feature that's included in a $900 camera was insulting, and most people wouldn't pay it. Can't blame them!

I think what you are saying is that the spin does not make sense.

The spin--development costs for a 1DC Mk II are too high so we'll make a 5DC.

Agreed, that doesn't make much sense for the reasons you mention.

The reality...a "cinema/video" oriented DSLR will provide more revenue/profit for Canon if they target the market segment/price point below their C100/300/500.

I can see that making sense and seems to reflect what I have read on this forum from people that would actually use a cinema DSLR.

 

[Lee Jay]

Re: A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement [CR1]

The reality...a "cinema/video" oriented DSLR will provide more revenue/profit for Canon if they target the market segment/price point below their C100/300/500.

I can see that making sense and seems to reflect what I have read on this forum from people that would actually use a cinema DSLR.

Sure...putting the 1DC's video functionality into the 5DIV makes complete sense to me. That would allow you to do what they did with the 5DII - sell it to both the stills crowd and the video crowd, and therefore increase volume and therefore reduce amortized development costs.

However, Canon seems to be trying to go the other way - segmentation. The idea being, apparently, to get people to buy multiple bodies for different purposes instead of buying one do-it-all body like they did with the 5DII.

I don't know if that will work or not, but it generally doesn't work with me. I've skipped 10 years of Canon bodies because of slow feature and performance additions, and this segmentation approach is likely to cause me to skip another 10 years, if not more, once I finish the next year's upgrade cycle (targeting a 7DII and a 5DIV, or maybe just two 7DII's).

 

[docsmith]

Re: A Suggestion on the EOS-1D C Replacement [CR1]

However, Canon seems to be trying to go the other way - segmentation. The idea being, apparently, to get people to buy multiple bodies for different purposes instead of buying one do-it-all body like they did with the 5DII.

Segmentation is fine as long as there is a real differentiator. For example, the 5Ds is clearly a differentiated camera--sacrificing high ISO for low ISO/high MP. Let's see what Canon does to differentiate the 5Dc and 5DIV, if that is in fact what they are doing.

I suspect your concern is that they will stupidly cripple one of the bodies or lose out on the "jack of all trades" body. We'll see.

But, say they release only moderately differentiated bodies, say a 5DIV with weaker video functions (no 4K), but optimized for stills (24-28 MP, AF, fps, etc) vs a 5Dc (rumored specs - 4K, 18 MP, etc). Both could be valuable bodies. I'd personally opt for the 5DIV specs. But those that do more video would likely opt for the camera with the 5Dc specs.

 

[AvTvM]

It is really easy:
Those who only want stills get a 5D IV without video at a very decent price.
Those who want both hi-end video capture and stills pay more for a 5D C.
No need for anybody to buy 2 bodirs just to cover stills and video.
But ni more free-riding for those clamoring for 4k video to record their cats and dogs farting in every DSLR. You want video in addition to atills in a camera zype that is ill-suited to capture an image stream since a flapping mirror needs to get out of the light path ... You pay extra. So fair, so good. Should have been like that all along.

Sony is quite successful with that approach in their A7 series. More or less resolution, more or less video capabilities. Take your choice and pay for it. a7s is more expensive than A7, A7 II and A7R.
The more multifunctional, the higher the price. Rightfully so.

 

[Tugela]

It is really easy:
Those who only want stills get a 5D IV without video at a very decent price.
Those who want both hi-end video capture and stills pay more for a 5D C.
No need for anybody to buy 2 bodirs just to cover stills and video.
But ni more free-riding for those clamoring for 4k video to record their cats and dogs farting in every DSLR. You want video in addition to atills in a camera zype that is ill-suited to capture an image stream since a flapping mirror needs to get out of the light path ... You pay extra. So fair, so good. Should have been like that all along.

Sony is quite successful with that approach in their A7 series. More or less resolution, more or less video capabilities. Take your choice and pay for it. a7s is more expensive than A7, A7 II and A7R.
The more multifunctional, the higher the price. Rightfully so.

The flapping mirror doesn't get in the way. It is lifted and the camera turns into a MILC when video is being shot. Granted, a OFV screws things up a bit relative to true MILCs, but since most users would probably be monitoring the LCD anyway, it should not be too big of a problem provided that video friendly tools are incorporated. It is not as though Canon don't know how to do that, since effective video tools are incorporated into their camcorders.