Canon officially announces the EOS 90D and EOS M6 Mark II

SlydeR

EOS M50
Mar 14, 2014
31
9
I think the main issue is at 4k 24...only 30 available...

Yes, this is interesting. But it is possible that those modes have been accidentally left there if the 80D spec sheet has been used as a starting point. Canon UK specs don't mention MOV, ALL-I, or 24p modes.
 

TPatS

I'm New Here
Aug 20, 2019
24
18
For me, it's more the worrying lack of ALL-I. We first saw this on the 6D2 and i'm confused why they would omit if the 80D had it.
 

amorse

EOS RP
Jan 26, 2017
721
915
www.instagram.com
I have to admit, the missing 24p is baffling. It simply cannot be to protect the cinema line. There are so many other features that distinguish and separate Canon's cinema cameras. What is Canon thinking when it comes to 24p? Are they thinking it will push people to the R?

These are nice cameras but missing 24p is going to drive some sales to other brands. It makes no sense to leave it out.
Yea, I'm not a video shooter, but I really don't get it either. I kind of wonder what sort of sensor architecture they needed to create to get 4K to run on their sensor with full width, and if it complicated to inclusion of more than one frame rate for max resolution.

I really can't see this as protectionism against the cinema line - they're just so very different. No-one considering an M6II or 90D will ever consider cross shopping a cinema camera (obviously), so maybe it will be more telling in where Canon puts 24p back in at max resolution. That may tell us whether or not it is intended to move people up market (i.e. more expensive cameras get it) or whether it is some sort of weird technical limitation (i.e. no new cameras get it).
 
Nov 3, 2014
698
507
Why is it that the less you know about video, the more sure you are what video features other people do/don't need? The fact that you don't understand the difference between 24, 25 and 30 FPS doesn't mean there isn't a difference. I guarantee that Canon knows the difference and removing 24 FPS 4K from their low cost offerings is not just an oversight.
 

amorse

EOS RP
Jan 26, 2017
721
915
www.instagram.com
And 25, just a menu setting away. Seriously, you people got to have pretty professional needs if that’s not close enough to 24, and in that case you should probably acquire a professional camera.
I'm not sure it is about being close and getting a similar look: 25p may flicker in North American lighting without the right shutter speed. 24/30/60 shouldn't flicker under north American lighting at any shutter speed, 25/50 shouldn't flicker at any shutter speed under European lighting. I'm no video pro, but that's what I've understood is the reason people care about the distinction between 24 and 25.
 

Woody

EOS R
Jul 20, 2010
1,155
70
I may consider the M6 MarkII if the sensor is a big improvement over the older APS-C 24MP generation
 

unfocused

EOS-1D X Mark III
Jul 20, 2010
5,726
2,720
67
Springfield, IL
www.mgordoncommunications.com
The rumors were saying for a while that Canon was merging the 7d and XXd lines; Canon does not seem to indicate this in what I saw. Has anyone seen anything else?
Nothing official that I've seen in their release or videos. But, companies rarely announce they are dropping a particular line. However, when Canon merged the 1D lines, they did announce that, but in that case they were creating something new (1Dx). Personally, I think they may be hedging their bets a bit, just in case they decide to revive it at some point, or if the rumors of an APS-C "R' camera are accurate they might pair that with an announcement about the 7D line.

I noticed that in the Rudy Winston video he emphasized that this is a step-up camera for advanced amateurs or upgrade for 80D users. Again, kind of hedging.
 

preppyak

EOS R
Oct 18, 2011
1,021
74
Screenshot from Official spec sheet on Canon website...I've attached the pdf
That spec sheet also seems incomplete, as it doesnt list 1080/24 video recording size later on the page. Seems like a weird oversight.

In any case, leaving out 4k24 is just nonsense. If you can do 4k30, you can do 4k24. Magic Lantern showed that software side, any frame rate is easily doable as long as the buffer can handle it. To leave it out is really quite laughable when competitors have been doing it for 5 years. And when their DSLR competitor Nikon has it in both of their equivalent models.
 

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koenkooi

EOS R
CR Pro
Feb 25, 2015
1,444
1,235
[..] Magic Lantern showed that software side, any frame rate is easily doable as long as the buffer can handle it.[..]
Magic Lantern also showed that the frame rates you can get depend heavily on the timers and dividers on the chip. While I don't think that's the reason for dropping 24p, it's not as simple as you make it out to be.
 
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amorse

EOS RP
Jan 26, 2017
721
915
www.instagram.com
Nothing official that I've seen in their release or videos. But, companies rarely announce they are dropping a particular line. However, when Canon merged the 1D lines, they did announce that, but in that case they were creating something new (1Dx). Personally, I think they may be hedging their bets a bit, just in case they decide to revive it at some point, or if the rumors of an APS-C "R' camera are accurate they might pair that with an announcement about the 7D line.

I noticed that in the Rudy Winston video he emphasized that this is a step-up camera for advanced amateurs or upgrade for 80D users. Again, kind of hedging.
I agree that most companies would be remiss to say "we're not going to continue x line into the future" without a suitable replacement, but they did suggest that the M6II will replace the M6 and the M5, at least in speaking to reviewers. No similar mention for 7D line to my knowledge.
 

privatebydesign

Garfield is back...
CR Pro
Jan 29, 2011
9,190
3,411
120
Magic Lantern also showed that the frame rates you can get depend heavily on the timers and dividers on the chip. While I don't think that's the reason for dropping 24p, it's not as simple as you make it out to be.
I saw a comment, I think it was from the DPReview preview, that any sensor that can sample at 30 can be modulated to sample at 24. The details are far beyond my comprehension so I wouldn't vouch for it

But it seems to me Canon opening themselves up to this hurt and negative publicity from reviewers and influencers, who aren't going to use yore cameras anyway, regardless of how many actual purchasers are turned off by it, seems to point to a technical reason rather than a simple marketing reason.

But I freely admit I don't hav a clue and unlike so many I don't care an iota.
 
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RayValdez360

Soon to be the greatest.
Jun 6, 2012
563
342
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Philadelphia
Well, assuming an R equivalent of 7D isn't coming.



There is a panning SCN mode; not sure yet if it's available in other modes.



I wouldn't be surprised if less than 1% of all 80D owners have ever used the 24p mode.
24 is the standard filming mode framerate. i wouldnt assume anything. it's pretty disgusting of Canon to remove it. No other company out here is removing 24p.
 
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RayValdez360

Soon to be the greatest.
Jun 6, 2012
563
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Philadelphia
How many people know the differenc between 24p and 30p?
How many people can tell the difference between 24 p and 30p?
How many people need 24P?
How many people care?
Canon will consider all of these before designing their cameras.

I have no idea how easy/complex it is to add 24p to the repertoire but I guess it is not as easy as some pretend.
You sound like someone that doesn't do video. Videographers want all the tools they can get to make their vision come alive. it is much harder or impossible for us to manipulate a video and get a certain look compared to editing photo. If all Canon cares about is saving pennies at the convenience of customers, they are out of touch. with them then. this definitely drives people to other brands for video.
 
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amorse

EOS RP
Jan 26, 2017
721
915
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I saw a comment, I think it was from the DPReview preview, that any sensor that can sample at 30 can be modulated to sample at 24. The details are far beyond my comprehension so I wouldn't vouch for it

But it seems to me Canon opening themselves up to this hurt and negative publicity from reviewers and influencers, who aren't going to use yore cameras anyway, regardless of how many actual purchasers are turned off by it, seems to point to a technical reason rather than a simple marketing reason.

But I freely admit I don't hav a clue and unlike so many I don't care an iota.
I very much had the same reaction. I can't see why they'd open themselves to the inevitable criticism that will follow that decision, despite the fact that probably the bulk of users wouldn't know or care about the difference, unless it was necessary.

I really can't see it as a tool to move people up-market either (I mean, if someone is considering an APS-C camera, where do you expect them to go up market to gain that feature at 4K - a cinema camera?), which leaves technical limitation. Maybe the new sensor structure is creating that 4K in a way which isn't compatible with more than one frame rate or has to be built with the specific frame rate in mind? I have no idea. It doesn't affect me at all, but the only reason I pay attention to the issue is in not understanding the decision. Most of Canon's decisions have been obvious and reasonable (in my opinion anyway), but I really don't understand this one unless it is technical.
 
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preppyak

EOS R
Oct 18, 2011
1,021
74
Magic Lantern also showed that the frame rates you can get depend heavily on the timers and dividers on the chip. While I don't think that's the reason for dropping 24p, it's not as simple as you make it out to be.
Sure...but the SL3 shoots 4k24 with Digic8. As does the EOSR, RP, and M50. Its just such an odd line to draw; and made doubly odd by the fact that the RP shoots 4k24, but not FHD/24.

Id just love to know why. It cant be to protect their Cine lines, because the cost of a C200 makes it much easier to just move to Panasonic/Sony/etc entirely. But its also such a weird technical limitation to introduce and leave in.
Most of Canon's decisions have been obvious and reasonable (in my opinion anyway), but I really don't understand this one unless it is technical.
This is where Im at too. I know Canon deliberately segments products...but dropping 1080/24 on the RP was a weird one. Not including 24 on these cameras doesnt really segment anything. Its just odd.
 
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