Gerald Undone completes exhaustive record time testing on the Canon EOS R5 and Canon EOS R6

SteveC

R5
Sep 3, 2019
1,122
887
One thing of context that I have only seen written once. Even when the camera stops recording in the limited modes, 8k, 4k120 etc, it will still work as a stills and video camera for any other mode, instantly. This is not the behavior all other hybrids exhibit, once they ‘overheat’ they are bricks. The Canon NEVER bricks even when it won’t record in the limited modes anymore.
Yes that's what someone who had a very detailed test procedure noted. You can record (for instance) 1080p all day...even after the camera has 'overheated' shooting 8K.

(That suggests to me that the heat limits the camera follows are very conservative.)
 

dak3

I'm New Here
Oct 9, 2018
12
21
So, I gather that Canon is going to realize that they made R&D mistakes with the R5 to meet their market deadlines and work to create the R4 for 2022 where the body (hopefully) has a better heat sink, chip design, and redesigned body ergonomics so that we can then spend another $4k on a non toy model? Something tells me that Nikon may come in for the steal with their Z8 and Z9 models. After all, in the mirrorless market, there is a competition against Sony now that Canon and Nikon are abandoning their DSLRs for EVF models.

Nikon's Z8/Z9 response to the Canon R5/R6:
 
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Darrell Cadieux

I'm New Here
May 8, 2019
19
36
Already seen couple of reports. Even Gerald mentions that only setting up camera for shoot and then pressing record...the times where already lower.
This is what worries me. I am a photographer and don't care about video. I've been a Canon shooter since 1969 and really wanted a Canon stills camera with face/eye AF, IBIS and high resolution. Was going to by an R5 as this would have answered my dreams...I shall now wait to see what comes out from actual documented testing from using it as a camera...not a video recorder.
 

Fast351

70D
Sep 12, 2014
38
52
Minnesota
www.fast351.com
I own a FullHD tv from 2012, it was a $2500 top of the line 55” from Samsung.
I last night finished my binge watching the Netflix series “DARK”, which is amazing btw, and I sat there through 3 seasons completely amazed by how ridiculously sharp and detailed the video quality is. It’s not “pretty decent for an old tv” or “fine for 1080”, it’s amazingly detailed and sharp.

I always drop by the stores to see what’s new in 4K and 8K and the only amazing new thing is how detailed the 8K is at a viewing distance of 10 cm. I can’t see the need for 4K and 8K. Yes cropping bla bla, but output? I rather have superb 1080 than iPhone 4K.
I always find this chart handy when people are "my 4K is so much better than full HD"

with a 55" you need to be closer than 6 feet. 65" closer than 8'. Historically most people watch TV at 10-12', regardless of screen size. You need an 80+" TV at those distances before 4K becomes a visible benefit.

I think most people think their 4K TVs look better because the technology has improved, not necessarily the resolution.

 

Starting out EOS R

EOS R5 - RF24-105mm F4L, RF70-200mm f2.8L
Feb 13, 2020
265
290
One thing of context that I have only seen written once. Even when the camera stops recording in the limited modes, 8k, 4k120 etc, it will still work as a stills and video camera for any other mode, instantly. This is not the behavior all other hybrids exhibit, once they ‘overheat’ they are bricks. The Canon NEVER bricks even when it won’t record in the limited modes anymore.
This is the confusing part of all this, if it has overheated then surely the internals including the cards, sensor etc etc will be dangerously hot, too hot to work at all?? This does make me wonder if the warnings and shut down are triggered by a timer and not an actual temperature sensor? As some reviews have said, the warning has come up but the card and battery are only warm, not hot. This wouldn't happen if the camera was actually overheating?
 

SteveC

R5
Sep 3, 2019
1,122
887
This is the confusing part of all this, if it has overheated then surely the internals including the cards, sensor etc etc will be dangerously hot, too hot to work at all?? This does make me wonder if the warnings and shut down are triggered by a timer and not an actual temperature sensor? As some reviews have said, the warning has come up but the card and battery are only warm, not hot. This wouldn't happen if the camera was actually overheating?
It could be that the warning kicks in just before they become too hot. Switch to some activity/mode that generates heat less quickly than it bleeds off, and you're still fine. The camera, "realizing" it's going to cool off in that mode, won't complain about it; things are tolerable, and going to get better, rather than tolerable, and about to get worse-than-tolerable.
 

privatebydesign

I don't preorder, I'm not a paid beta tester!
Jan 29, 2011
8,822
2,750
120
I always find this chart handy when people are "my 4K is so much better than full HD"

with a 55" you need to be closer than 6 feet. 65" closer than 8'. Historically most people watch TV at 10-12', regardless of screen size. You need an 80+" TV at those distances before 4K becomes a visible benefit.

I think most people think their 4K TVs look better because the technology has improved, not necessarily the resolution.

I hate charts like that especially when they give no context. I personally have very poor acuity but well above average color definition in my eyesight, but depending on the scene being played I can absolutely tell the difference between 1080 and 4K well outside that bottom purple line. My main home screen is a 70” and I have two seating positions, one puts my viewing distance at 8’ which is marginal benefit over 1080 in your chart the other at 15’ puts me on the limits between 720 and 1080, which is farcical. From both positions it is easy to notice an improved picture in 4K over 1080. I regularly stream content at both resolutions from a home server, basically if it isn’t 1080 I won’t play it but I’d much rather find a 4K copy of anything I’d be inclined to watch more than once.

But this is the same argument we have regularly about reducing higher resolution files down to retain more detail, and this is proven, even currently look at the downsampled 8k to 4K from the R5 and you will see that compared to other high quality native 4K it retains more detail, your argument is this can’t be true, but it is, just look at the video! And that is when viewed over the internet at even lower resolutions!
 
Jul 15, 2020
6
1
I always find this chart handy when people are "my 4K is so much better than full HD"

with a 55" you need to be closer than 6 feet. 65" closer than 8'. Historically most people watch TV at 10-12', regardless of screen size. You need an 80+" TV at those distances before 4K becomes a visible benefit.

I think most people think their 4K TVs look better because the technology has improved, not necessarily the resolution.

Thanks for the info.
Some people buy a new TV for console like Ps5/xbox or use it as a monitor. I agree, full HD is good enough for movies whereas if you chose 4K OLED there're still some gain, ie. pure black...modern TV also has an internal media player, which you can use to replay your 4K footage, that's handy. and energy efficiency...some sort of convincing myself, cause it will coming the day after tomorrow.. :p
viewingdistanceresolutioncomparison.jpg
 

BakaBokeh

EOS 90D
May 16, 2020
136
228
This is what worries me. I am a photographer and don't care about video. I've been a Canon shooter since 1969 and really wanted a Canon stills camera with face/eye AF, IBIS and high resolution. Was going to by an R5 as this would have answered my dreams...I shall now wait to see what comes out from actual documented testing from using it as a camera...not a video recorder.
For you I wouldn't worry. This seems to be the perfect mirrorless stills camera. As long as you have battery life and card space, it will still take photos. The overheat condition only throttles the camera in high quality/bitrate video modes.
 

Mt Spokane Photography

I post too Much on Here!!
Mar 25, 2011
16,091
1,182
One thing of context that I have only seen written once. Even when the camera stops recording in the limited modes, 8k, 4k120 etc, it will still work as a stills and video camera for any other mode, instantly. This is not the behavior all other hybrids exhibit, once they ‘overheat’ they are bricks. The Canon NEVER bricks even when it won’t record in the limited modes anymore.
I wasn't aware of that. But, when a sensor is hot, the IQ drops. Maybe its not the sensor but the internal video processing electronics that gets hot in overdrive, probably its everything that gets hot.

The life for 8K seems to be 19 minutes more than my requirements, so I don't see a worry.
 

Stig Nygaard

7DII & G5XII
Jul 10, 2013
54
85
Copenhagen
www.flickr.com
To me those numbers are pretty impressive. I mean, people didn't believe it was possible to do "real" 8K video in a consumer stills camera/body when first rumors emerged, saying it must be timelapse video, motion jpeg or upscaled video. And if it was really "true" 8K, it would overheat after 2 minuttes. The internet is just hysterical.
 
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Fast351

70D
Sep 12, 2014
38
52
Minnesota
www.fast351.com
I hate charts like that especially when they give no context. I personally have very poor acuity but well above average color definition in my eyesight, but depending on the scene being played I can absolutely tell the difference between 1080 and 4K well outside that bottom purple line. My main home screen is a 70” and I have two seating positions, one puts my viewing distance at 8’ which is marginal benefit over 1080 in your chart the other at 15’ puts me on the limits between 720 and 1080, which is farcical. From both positions it is easy to notice an improved picture in 4K over 1080. I regularly stream content at both resolutions from a home server, basically if it isn’t 1080 I won’t play it but I’d much rather find a 4K copy of anything I’d be inclined to watch more than once.

But this is the same argument we have regularly about reducing higher resolution files down to retain more detail, and this is proven, even currently look at the downsampled 8k to 4K from the R5 and you will see that compared to other high quality native 4K it retains more detail, your argument is this can’t be true, but it is, just look at the video! And that is when viewed over the internet at even lower resolutions!
I realize this chart is a generalization, but please remember it's purely resolution only. Most 4K source material takes advantage of more than resolution. It might have an HDR signal, which will definitely look better far beyond the resolution cutoff. 10 bit vs 8 bit is another huge delta.

That's why I added the caviat that 4K looks better because of the technology, not necessarily the resolution.
 

privatebydesign

I don't preorder, I'm not a paid beta tester!
Jan 29, 2011
8,822
2,750
120
I wasn't aware of that. But, when a sensor is hot, the IQ drops. Maybe its not the sensor but the internal video processing electronics that gets hot in overdrive, probably its everything that gets hot.

The life for 8K seems to be 19 minutes more than my requirements, so I don't see a worry.
I think Canon have taken their normal conservative path and 1, are doing it with some internal sensor or counter to protect something deep inside, 2, they set these limits knowing them and expecting most user case use to be within those limits.

What they didn’t anticipate is the feeding frenzy the ‘influencers’ had with their atypical case use, I suspect the PR departments will look very carefully at where they pitch demo units in future, there are several photographers I am interested in hearing feedback from that so far have only been able to get test R6 units.

Further to the first point, I believe a comparatively simple firmware upgrade that changed the temperature/timer/sensor value to the overheat trigger would yield longer run times for the limited modes but who knows if Canon would be comfortable doing that. That will be a beancounter calculation for how many units will fail if they lengthen the time as most owners won’t use it anyway over short term PR cost....
 

privatebydesign

I don't preorder, I'm not a paid beta tester!
Jan 29, 2011
8,822
2,750
120
I realize this chart is a generalization, but please remember it's purely resolution only. Most 4K source material takes advantage of more than resolution. It might have an HDR signal, which will definitely look better far beyond the resolution cutoff. 10 bit vs 8 bit is another huge delta.

That's why I added the caviat that 4K looks better because of the technology, not necessarily the resolution.
I understand that, and my particular TV doesn’t have HDR, my point was if you put up a chart with lines on it people are going to draw conclusions from it that can be completely inaccurate.

Given your chart how can the 4K downsampled from 8k video from the R5 have more detail than the one to one readout from the α7S III? Yet it very clearly does. It simply is not as simple as that and presenting charts with a cutoff line is just disingenuous. Same with diffraction limits, charts tell us we will get no more detail from higher resolutions above x aperture value, but it turns out in practice we do, not much, but it isn’t a straight cutoff line.
 

BakaBokeh

EOS 90D
May 16, 2020
136
228
I understand, YouTube is a great platform to be heard, which is why the overheating and cooldown issue is having a spotlight shone on it. But how many in the real world market would pony up for a video oriented mirrorless camera ala the A7SIII?

How many of you would buy a Canon EOSR5C?
  • It would compromise weather sealing
  • Have vents and a silent fan
  • Full Size HDMI 2.1
  • Delete 29 min 59 second time limit for essentially unlimited recording in all codecs, framerates & bitrates
  • Same photo capabilities as R5
  • Probably cost $4399
Maybe it could add a few extras like Built in ND filters, Shutter Angle Priority, Better Audio Preamps, but will not include them for now since the above seems doable for Canon. If it gets all these video extras it's probably a $5K camera at that point.

Would you buy this camera?
 
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Bob Howland

EOS RP
Mar 25, 2012
522
125
I understand, YouTube is a great platform to be heard, which is why the overheating and cooldown issue is having a spotlight shone on it. But how many in the real world market would pony up for a video oriented mirrorless camera ala the A7SIII?

How many of you would buy a Canon EOSR5C?
  • It would compromise weather sealing
  • Have vents and a silent fan
  • Full Size HDMI 2.1
  • Delete 29 min 59 second time limit for essentially unlimited recording in all codecs, framerates & bitrates
  • Same photo capabilities as R5
  • Probably cost $4399
Maybe it could add a few extras like Built in ND filters, Shutter Angle Priority, Better Audio Preamps, but will not include them for now since the above seems doable for Canon. If it gets all these video extras it's probably a $5K camera at that point.

Would you buy this camera?
Yes, and I take very few videos but own a closet full of EF lenses.
 

Viggo

EOS R5
Dec 13, 2010
4,543
1,225
I understand, YouTube is a great platform to be heard, which is why the overheating and cooldown issue is having a spotlight shone on it. But how many in the real world market would pony up for a video oriented mirrorless camera ala the A7SIII?

How many of you would buy a Canon EOSR5C?
  • It would compromise weather sealing
  • Have vents and a silent fan
  • Full Size HDMI 2.1
  • Delete 29 min 59 second time limit for essentially unlimited recording in all codecs, framerates & bitrates
  • Same photo capabilities as R5
  • Probably cost $4399
Maybe it could add a few extras like Built in ND filters, Shutter Angle Priority, Better Audio Preamps, but will not include them for now since the above seems doable for Canon. If it gets all these video extras it's probably a $5K camera at that point.

Would you buy this camera?
It would sell in the same numbers the 1dc did to the 1dx, so no wonder they don’t bother..