Here are a few Canon EOS R10 specifications [CR3]

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Michael Clark

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Putting them on an APS-C crop narrows the field of view by a factor of 1.6, but it doesn’t increase the reach 1.6x. The maximum extra resolution you could get on a 24 Mpx sensor vs a FF 45 Mpx is 1.17x, and that’s with a very wide aperture lens at very low iso. With a narrow f/11 lens at higher isos there would be very little extra resolution or reach because of diffraction and noise. What the R10 would give you would be a much cheaper way of getting similar resolution to an R5.

Wouldn't that be 1.37x? A 24MP APS-C sensor would have the same density as a 61.44MP FF sensor.
 
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Michael Clark

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So, 25% fewer megapixels than the M6 Mk ii? I don't get it.

I guess most people don't need more than 24, but most people don't need 15-23fps either. With this and the R7, and the R6 and R5, we're getting very high fps with either lower or higher resolution, but I'd rather have higher resolution without having to pay for crazy-high fps. It seems Canon are focused more towards sports and journalism. I guess that's where the money is on the professional side, but for this amateur I would rather have the higher resolution at a lower price (especially in FF, could crop to APS-C for distant wildlife and still have good resolution) than have 15+ fps.

With video also included, readout speeds needed for high res video make high fps stills mode vs. low fps stills mode practically free.
 
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Maximilian

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Wouldn’t be the first time Canon Rumors got the date wrong.
Sometimes more than a little…
I think, adding the pandemic, Chinese / Shanghai lockdown and 2022 Putin's war against Ukraine the delay is acceptable, isn't it?
 
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AlanF

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Wouldn't that be 1.37x? A 24MP APS-C sensor would have the same density as a 61.44MP FF sensor.
Resolution varies as the square root of number of pixels. The square root of 1.37 is 1.17. (There are 37% more pixels on target in terms of area, but resolution is measured in lp/mm, a length measurement, and so there is an increase in 17% in resolution.)
 
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gruhl28

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With video also included, readout speeds needed for high res video make high fps stills mode vs. low fps stills mode practically free.
Good point for electronic shutter, but 15 frames per second mechanical shutter must cost something. I guess with no mirror it’s easier to make high fps, but the RP does only 4 fps and the R does only 5 with servo AF and 8 without.
 
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Michael Clark

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Resolution varies as the square root of number of pixels. The square root of 1.37 is 1.17. (There are 37% more pixels on target in terms of area, but resolution is measured in lp/mm, a length measurement, and so there is an increase in 17% in resolution.)

Resolution can be measured in a variety of ways. But when we refer to resolution as 50MPs or 20MPs, we're talking about areal resolution, not linear.
 
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Michael Clark

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Good point for electronic shutter, but 15 frames per second mechanical shutter must cost something. I guess with no mirror it’s easier to make high fps, but the RP does only 4 fps and the R does only 5 with servo AF and 8 without.

That's probably due more to either a) the lower amount of processing power Canon was willing to put in those bodies or b) Canon's desire to maintain product segmentation by limiting some products to less than the hardware they use is capable of achieving. (See EOS 7D running firmware ver. 1.x compared to the same EOS 7D running firmware ver. 2.x - The buffer somehow miraculously became twice as deep with only a firmware update.)

The cost of flipping the mirror has always, it seems to me, been more significant than the cost of cycling the shutter curtain. Ensuring consistent alignment of the primary mirror, secondary mirror, and the PDAF array for shot after shot after shot is critical to proper AF operation.
 
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gruhl28

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That's probably due more to either a) the lower amount of processing power Canon was willing to put in those bodies or b) Canon's desire to maintain product segmentation by limiting some products to less than the hardware they use is capable of achieving. (See EOS 7D running firmware ver. 1.x compared to the same EOS 7D running firmware ver. 2.x - The buffer somehow miraculously became twice as deep with only a firmware update.)

The cost of flipping the mirror has always, it seems to me, been more significant than the cost of cycling the shutter curtain. Ensuring consistent alignment of the primary mirror, secondary mirror, and the PDAF array for shot after shot after shot is critical to proper AF operation.
Yeah, you may be right. I thought of some of those points after posting. I was thinking initially that since the RP uses almost the same sensor as the 6D Mk2 and the R uses almost the same senser as the 5D Mk4, and those two DSLRs can shoot faster than the mirrorless ones, that it wouldn't be the sensor or processing power that was slowing down the mirrorless ones, but maybe Canon did purposely slow them down. Wow, the buffer doubled with just a firmware update?
 
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AlanF

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Resolution can be measured in a variety of ways. But when we refer to resolution as 50MPs or 20MPs, we're talking about areal resolution, not linear.
You can have your very own measure of resolution but in optics it is linear, the ability to separate two images next to each other. That is what all the published MTF charts do.
 
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Michael Clark

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You can have your very own measure of resolution but in optics it is linear, the ability to separate two images next to each other. That is what all the published MTF charts do.

Yes, and all of those published resolution measurements use 'line-per-image-height' or 'lines-per-millimeter' at a specific percentage of contrast, not megapixels, to express linear resolution.

Lines/ih and lines/mm are linear measurements. MP is an areal measurement.
 
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Resolution can be measured in a variety of ways. But when we refer to resolution as 50MPs or 20MPs, we're talking about areal resolution, not linear.
50 MPs or 20 MPs is the number of pixels not the resolution. If people refer to the resolution of a sensor in MPs, they are making a mistake. Nice try, but AlanF is correct. Maybe you should stop trying to be smarter than everone else. It can be embarrassing.
 
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Michael Clark

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Yeah, you may be right. I thought of some of those points after posting. I was thinking initially that since the RP uses almost the same sensor as the 6D Mk2 and the R uses almost the same senser as the 5D Mk4, and those two DSLRs can shoot faster than the mirrorless ones, that it wouldn't be the sensor or processing power that was slowing down the mirrorless ones, but maybe Canon did purposely slow them down. Wow, the buffer doubled with just a firmware update?

Yes. Around three years after the camera was first released.

At the time 7D users and, more importantly, potential 7D buyers were getting anxious about when a 7D Mark II might be released. Replacement rumors had been flying for a while. Then rumors began to swirl that Canon was having serious development issues with the sensor. The usual grumbling began about "jumping to brand x" if Canon didn't come forth with a 7D replacement ASAP. At the same time, others were holding off on buying a 7D in fear that a 7D II announcement was imminent.

Canon claimed it increased from 14 to 25 raw images with UDMA-7 CF cards, but most independent testers said it increased to around 31-32 frames before the buffer bogged down with the fastest CF cards.

It also added:
  • Supports a new accessory, of the GPS Receiver GP-E2.
  • Adds a maximum ISO Auto setting function.
  • Adds an in-camera RAW processing function.
  • Adds a Quick Control function during playback.
  • Adds a rating function.
  • Adds a JPEG image resizing function.
  • Adds a sound recording level manual adjustment function.
  • Adds a file name setting function.
  • Adds a time zone setting function.
  • Faster scrolling of magnified images.
  • Fixes a phenomenon where a slow shutter speed may result when an external flash is used to fire intermittent, consecutive flashes.
  • Corrects the color space information in the Exif file for movies.

 
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Jul 21, 2010
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Lines/ih and lines/mm are linear measurements. MP is an areal measurement.
The 7D and 1D X have the same MP count, but not the same resolution. MP is a count, not a measurement. If you believe it is an areal measurement, please specify the SI unit it includes, directly or indirectly. Image height is in millimeters, as is lp/mm.

An areal measurement including pixels would be something like density in pixels per square millimeter.

50 MPs or 20 MPs is the number of pixels not the resolution. If people refer to the resolution of a sensor in MPs, they are making a mistake. Nice try, but AlanF is correct. Maybe you should stop trying to be smarter than everone else. It can be embarrassing.
Yes, @Michael Clark does like to sound smart. He’s often correct, but not always and not in this case. Many people do refer to ‘resolution’ as a pixel count, but then many people write ‘alot’ and think they’re using proper spelling.
 
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koenkooi

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Good point for electronic shutter, but 15 frames per second mechanical shutter must cost something. I guess with no mirror it’s easier to make high fps, but the RP does only 4 fps and the R does only 5 with servo AF and 8 without.
The shutter is smaller and has to travel less distance on a crop sensor compared to a FF sensor. That makes it easier to increase the FPS and flash sync speed.
 
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gruhl28

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Yes. Around three years after the camera was first released.

At the time 7D users and, more importantly, potential 7D buyers were getting anxious about when a 7D Mark II might be released. Replacement rumors had been flying for a while. Then rumors began to swirl that Canon was having serious development issues with the sensor. The usual grumbling began about "jumping to brand x" if Canon didn't come forth with a 7D replacement ASAP. At the same time, others were holding off on buying a 7D in fear that a 7D II announcement was imminent.

Canon claimed it increased from 14 to 25 raw images with UDMA-7 CF cards, but most independent testers said it increased to around 31-32 frames before the buffer bogged down with the fastest CF cards.

It also added:
  • Supports a new accessory, of the GPS Receiver GP-E2.
  • Adds a maximum ISO Auto setting function.
  • Adds an in-camera RAW processing function.
  • Adds a Quick Control function during playback.
  • Adds a rating function.
  • Adds a JPEG image resizing function.
  • Adds a sound recording level manual adjustment function.
  • Adds a file name setting function.
  • Adds a time zone setting function.
  • Faster scrolling of magnified images.
  • Fixes a phenomenon where a slow shutter speed may result when an external flash is used to fire intermittent, consecutive flashes.
  • Corrects the color space information in the Exif file for movies.
Wow, I had not realized that Canon had ever added so much in a firmware release. I wish they would do that more.
 
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Michael Clark

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Wow, I had not realized that Canon had ever added so much in a firmware release. I wish they would do that more.

It genuinely surprised a lot of folks when they announced it a few months before they actually released it.

Of course the Canon is D.O.O.M.E.D. crowd said that was just proof Canon was desperate because there were major problems with the development of the 7D Mark II sensor that would never be solved.
 
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