More features and specifications for the Canon EOS R3 have emerged

[Ozarker]

the 5div is 30mp, and the 1dxmkii is 20mp. So it is 66% of the megapixels of the 5d, exactly what I was saying. Not sure what you are talking about.

Really not sure what you and skyscraper are babbling about. Good lord.

 

[Michael Clark]

Compare apples with apples, compare the 1dxiii with the 5div, or the 1dxii with the 5diii. Compare a similar generation of cameras

The 5D S and 5D S R were released in mid-2015 and are still in the catalog.

The 1D X Mark II was released in early 2016 and replaced in 2020.

They are the same generation of camera.

First you say Canon has not historically marketed different cameras to different types of users.

Now you're saying we can't compare the 5Ds series to the 1D X series model that sold at the same time (1D X Mark II) because they were aimed at different users than the 5D Mark IV which also are the same generation?

 

[Michael Clark]

Compare apples with apples, compare the 1dxiii with the 5div, or the 1dxii with the 5diii. Compare a similar generation of cameras

The 1D X was introduced in 2012, the same year as the 5D Mark III. They're the same generation of camera.

The 5Ds and 5Ds R were introduced in 2015.
The 1D X Mark II and 5D Mark IV were introduced in 2016, but the 5D Mark IV was not a replacement for the 5Ds and 5Ds R. Both are still in Canon's current catalog. The 1D X Mark II, 5D Mark IV, and 5Ds/5Ds R are the same generation of camera.

The R5 and the 1D X Mark III were both introduced in 2020. They're the same generation offered at the same time.

"compare the 1dxiii with the 5div" - the 1D X Mark III was introduced in 2020, four years after the 5D Mark IV in 2016.

"or the 1dxii with the 5diii" - The 1D X Mark II was introduced in 2016, four years after the 5D Mark III in 2012.

As you can clearly see, the trend had been to increase the difference between the 5-Series and the 1-Series with every product cycle.

In 2012 the current 5-Series had 1.33X as many pixels as the 1-Series.
in 2016 the three current 5-Series models had 1.5X and 2.5X, respectively, as many pixels as the 1-Series.
In 2020 the current 5-Series model has 2.25X as many pixels as the current 1-Series camera, with rumors swirling of an impending high resolution R5s by the end of 2021.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Canon_EOS_digital_cameras

 

[rick1]

The 5D S and 5D S R were released in mid-2015 and are still in the catalog.

The 1D X Mark II was released in early 2016 and replaced in 2020.

They are the same generation of camera.

First you say Canon has not historically marketed different cameras to different types of users.

Now you're saying we can't compare the 5Ds series to the 1D X series model that sold at the same time (1D X Mark II) because they were aimed at different users than the 5D Mark IV which also are the same generation?

I mispoke, compare the 1dxii to 5dmiv. It has the exact ratio of pixels as I was referring to. The 1dx has 66% of the mp as the 5d

 

[rick1]

The 1D X was introduced in 2012, the same year as the 5D Mark III. They're the same generation of camera.

The 5Ds and 5Ds R were introduced in 2015.
The 1D X Mark II and 5D Mark IV were introduced in 2016, but the 5D Mark IV was not a replacement for the 5Ds and 5Ds R. Both are still in Canon's current catalog. The 1D X Mark II, 5D Mark IV, and 5Ds/5Ds R are the same generation of camera.

The R5 and the 1D X Mark III were both introduced in 2020. They're the same generation offered at the same time.

"compare the 1dxiii with the 5div" - the 1D X Mark III was introduced in 2020, four years after the 5D Mark IV in 2016.

"or the 1dxii with the 5diii" - The 1D X Mark II was introduced in 2016, four years after the 5D Mark III in 2012.

As you can clearly see, the trend had been to increase the difference between the 5-Series and the 1-Series with every product cycle.

In 2012 the current 5-Series had 1.33X as many pixels as the 1-Series.
in 2016 the three current 5-Series models had 1.5X and 2.5X, respectively, as many pixels as the 1-Series.
In 2020 the current 5-Series model has 2.25X as many pixels as the current 1-Series camera, with rumors swirling of an impending high resolution R5s by the end of 2021.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Canon_EOS_digital_cameras

You can't compare the R5 to the 1Dx, they are a completely different generation of camera. The R3 and R1 will be the same generation as the R5

 

[yeahright]

Because he doesn't understand that 100% magnification is not the same enlargement ratio for a high MP image as it is for a low MP image. When you enlarge a smaller image pixel to the size of a screen pixel, you're magnifying more than when you enlarge a larger image pixel to the same sized screen pixel.

Some folks apparently can't wrap their mind around the fact that they're looking at a 36x24 inch enlargement when viewing 8.2MP images on a 24" FHD monitor with a pixel pitch of 96 ppi, and they're looking at an 85x57 enlargement when they're viewing a 45MP image at 100% on the same monitor.

as per https://www.canonrumors.com/forum/t...e-canon-eos-r3-have-emerged.40492/post-895269 I believe that @Skyscraperfan does understand the difference but places higher emphasis on psychological aspects than on technological ones.

 

[Chig]

Here in the U.S., I'd think that amateur sports photographers outnumber amateur birders by at least 10:1, probably more like 20:1. There are handfuls of them on the sidelines at every high school football game, which is by far the biggest amateur sport in the U.S. (college sports are not "amateur", no matter what the NCAA claims). Baseball/softball and soccer have their share, too.

Interesting but these are amateurs too so the pro sports shooters are very out numbered.
These amateur sports shooters would probably buy a good crop sensor camera too as it gives more reach without having to buy crazy expensive big white lenses

 

[justaCanonuser]

You're not really recovering anything. You're just extending the white point all the way to 16,383 instead of cutting it off at around 4,095 like the camera's JPEG engine that generates the preview image is doing it.

You're right, I didn't mean that scientifically. I just meant the visual perception of the post-processed image. But that's already an accident for me, I still shoot sometimes positive (slide) film, which forces me back to the old rules of careful metering anyway.

 

[EOS 4 Life]

UHD 8K is 16:9. Extend that width to a 3:2 sensor and you have 44-45 MP.

I think you mean DCI 4K which is why R5 is 45 MP.
DCI is slightly larger than UHD.

 

[EOS 4 Life]

In 2020 Canon released the 45 MP R5 which they specifically market as the replacement for the 5D Mark IV. It's a 5-Series camera.
In 2020 Canon released the 20 MP 1D X Mark III, which is a 1-Series camera.

The 1D X Mark III has 44% as many pixels as the R5.

For that matter, the 2016 20 MP 1D X Mark II only has 40% as many pixels as the 2015 50 MP 5Ds and 5Ds R...

I do not think that is a fair comparison since the 1 DX Mark III was released before the R5.
However, that should have bearing on the R1, not the R3.

 

[EOS 4 Life]

30fps until the buffer is full. Then you're at ever how many frames clear the buffer per second. If the buffer is sending data to both the CFexpress bus and the SD card bus at the SD card speed, it will take significantly longer to clear the buffer of the same amount of data than when the CFexpress bus is operating at its higher speed.

Who says the buffer will get full?
This is not Sony we are talking about.
I get that this s not the R1 but Canon is going hard at 30 FPS.
If there is any kind of limit reached then even I will call BS on them.
The usual cabal of YouTube critics is just waiting for Canon to screw up.

 

[Chris.Chapterten]

I do not think that is a fair comparison since the 1 DX Mark III was released before the R5.
However, that should have bearing on the R1, not the R3.

Hmmm if they are released within the same year they are generally considered to be of the same generation. Further proof is that a camera released at the same time as the R5, the R6 also uses the 1DX iii sensor. In my opinion it is very reasonable to compare them…

 

[rick1]

Hmmm if they are released within the same year they are generally considered to be of the same generation. Further proof is that a camera released at the same time as the R5, the R6 also uses the 1DX iii sensor. In my opinion it is very reasonable to compare

the 1DX iii is basically just an enhanced version of the 1Dx2, the R5 is not just an enhanced version of the 5D, it is a completely different generation of camera. Hence the new naming convention for this generation of cameras.

 

[Skyscraperfan]

Because he doesn't understand that 100% magnification is not the same enlargement ratio for a high MP image as it is for a low MP image. When you enlarge a smaller image pixel to the size of a screen pixel, you're magnifying more than when you enlarge a larger image pixel to the same sized screen pixel.

Some folks apparently can't wrap their mind around the fact that they're looking at a 36x24 inch enlargement when viewing 8.2MP images on a 24" FHD monitor with a pixel pitch of 96 ppi, and they're looking at an 85x57 enlargement when they're viewing a 45MP image at 100% on the same monitor.

I understand what you mean. Of course a 45MP image is larger that an 8.2MP image at 100%, but a pixel still is a pixel. It only is larger because you have more of those pixels. Just look at the 108 megapixel photos that many smartphone cameras can now produce. Then you understand the problems I have with many pixels. The main advantage of a full frame camera for me are the larger pixels on the sensor. With a high resolution you bascically throw away that big advantage.

8K video has the same problems. 4K already is enough for quite a large screen. 8K just needs more drive space in most situations.

 

[Chris.Chapterten]

the 1DX iii is basically just an enhanced version of the 1Dx2, the R5 is not just an enhanced version of the 5D, it is a completely different generation of camera. Hence the new naming convention for this generation of cameras.

I get where you’re coming from. But of course the difference between 5D and R5 is more dramatic because it is the first 5 series mirrorless - they had to flex their muscles given the relative performance of other mirrorless cameras.

I do however disagree that the 1DX iii is just an enhanced 1DX ii - it has a completely new chip (digit x) and the sensor is also a new ground up design (just mega pixel count is the same). For me the 1DX iii has probably has just as many, if not more upgrades then when comparing 5D ii vs. 5D iii or 6D vs 6D ii.

My point: historically speaking It is actually not very common for a new generation of camera to be so dramatically different like the R5 is to 5D. So yes I would consider 1DX iii a completely new generation over a 1DX ii. Of course that is also how canon has marketed the newer camera.

Further reading on 1DX ii vs 1DX iii https://www.canon-europe.com/pro/stories/eos-1d-x-mark-iii-vs-mark-ii/

 

[Michael Clark]

You can't compare the R5 to the 1Dx, they are a completely different generation of camera. The R3 and R1 will be the same generation as the R5

The R5 is the current 5-Series camera and was released in 2020.
The 1D X Mark III is the current 1-Series and was released in 2020.

They are both current products that were released within four months of one another.

It's perfectly legitimate to compare them to each other. They're both the most current of the 1-Series and 5-Series cameras.

Besides that, the 5Ds R is still a 50 MP camera and has been in the catalog since 2015. It is also a 5-Series camera that was introduced in the same generation with the 5D Mark IV. If you're willing to compare the 1D X Mark III released in 2020 to the 5D Mark IV released in 2016, the same year as the 1D Mark II (the PREVIOUS generation of the 1-Series), then you must be willing to compare the 1D X Mark III to the 5Ds R as well as the 5D Mark IV.

The 1D X Mark III only has 40% as many pixels as the 5Ds R. Both are DSLRs.

 

[Michael Clark]

I mispoke, compare the 1dxii to 5dmiv. It has the exact ratio of pixels as I was referring to. The 1dx has 66% of the mp as the 5d

You mispoke (sic)?

You also conveniently ignore the 5Ds and 5Ds R that are 5-series cameras of the same generation as the 1D X Mark II and 5D Mark IV.

I don't know what a 1dx is. I've never seen one, and there's no model ever listed by Canon anywhere named the 1dx. Do you mean the 18 MP 1D X (2012)? Or perhaps the 20 MP 1D X Mark II (2016)? Or maybe the 20 MP 1D X Mark III (2020)?

The 1D X Mark II has 20 MP and was offered from 2016 until 2020.
The 5D S and 5Ds R have 50MP and were offered from 2015 until 2021.
The 5D S and 5Ds R were current 5-Series cameras the ENTIRE time the 1D X Mark II was in the catalog.
They're the same generation of camera.
The 5Ds and 5Ds R are 5-series cameras of the same generation as the 1D X Mark II.

Therefore, the 1D X Mark II DOES NOT have 66% of the megapixels of the highest resolution 5- series cameras of the same generation.
The 1D X Mark II has 40% of the megapixels that the highest resolution 5-Series camera of the same generation had.

 

[Michael Clark]

Who says the buffer will get full?
This is not Sony we are talking about.
I get that this s not the R1 but Canon is going hard at 30 FPS.
If there is any kind of limit reached then even I will call BS on them.
The usual cabal of YouTube critics is just waiting for Canon to screw up.

If the bus speed of the CFExpress card is reduced to the maximum speed of the SD card bus, you can bet your behind that the buffer will get full when trying to shoot at full resolution at 30 fps, even if the camera is only 20 MP.

Have you ever used a 7D Mark II or a 5D Mark IV? When the SD card is being written to, the CF card bus also slows down to the maximum speed of the SD card bus.

With the 5D Mark IV the fastest CF cards write at about 112 MB/s.
With the 5D Mark IV the fastest SD cards write at about 79 MB/s.
When both cards are being written to, the CF card bus also slows down to 79 MB/s.
I've personally tested this with my own 5D Mark IV.

With the 7D Mark II the fastest CF cards write at about 103 MB/s.
With the 7D Mark II the fastest SD cards write at about 74 MB/s.
When both cards are being written to, the CF cards bus also slows down to 74 MB/s.
I've personally tested this with my own 7D Mark II.

 

[Michael Clark]

the 1DX iii is basically just an enhanced version of the 1Dx2, the R5 is not just an enhanced version of the 5D, it is a completely different generation of camera. Hence the new naming convention for this generation of cameras.

The 1D X Mark III has many features that the 1D X Mark II lacks. When used in Live View mode it has many of the features of the R5, R6, and R.

Further, the PDAF sensor used when shooting via the OVF of the 1D X Mark III is unlike any dedicated PDAF sensor array that has come before in a Canon DSLR. Rather than having line sensors like all other Canon DSLR OVF based PDAF sensors have (or had), the 1D X Mark III has an AF sensor that is a miniature imaging sensor with a 3:2 aspect ratio. It's doing AF via the OVF that is equivalent to Live View that does AF like a mirrorless.

Have you ever even held a 5D Mark III, 5D Mark IV, 1D X Mark II, or 1D X Mark III? Much less an R5, R6, or even EOS R?

 

[Michael Clark]

I understand what you mean. Of course a 45MP image is larger that an 8.2MP image at 100%, but a pixel still is a pixel. It only is larger because you have more of those pixels. Just look at the 108 megapixel photos that many smartphone cameras can now produce. Then you understand the problems I have with many pixels. The main advantage of a full frame camera for me are the larger pixels on the sensor. With a high resolution you bascically throw away that big advantage.

8K video has the same problems. 4K already is enough for quite a large screen. 8K just needs more drive space in most situations.

No, a pixel is not still a pixel. The 45 MP sensor on the R5 collects the same total amount of light as the 20 MP sensors on the 1D X Mark III and R6. When displayed at the same enlargement ratio, they exhibit very similar signal to noise characteristics. The time when higher density sensors performed worse at the same enlargement ratios went away about a decade ago when gapless sensors were introduced.