Why has Canon omitted 24p 4K recording in their new cameras such as the EOS M6 Mark II, EOS 90D and EOS RP?

[Batman6794]

That depends upon who you are talking about. Not all of Hollywood still uses 24fps and 60fps is better suited for televisions. Many of them don't shoot film anymore. When they do, it is digitized afterwards. I can't remember the last time I sat through a wait for the reel to be changed or the switch between two different projectors. Grain, dust, and hair on film or lens can be added in post, if that's what people are worried about. That's what I think about when I think about film. People are worried it won't look like film when they take their home videos? Please. It won't look cinematic watching most anybody's home movies. Me? I won't buy until there is an 8mm mode.

Steven Spielberg: "The only thing that I caution all of us about is, it still doesn’t look like film unless you put the reels up in the booth.”

He's right. He knows more about that than any home video "filmmakers" around here.

People these days are growing up with fast television rates and video game rates. They don't give 2 craps about p24. They've already adjusted and most don't watch old movies.

LOL. You're aware that there is a frame rate weather you shoot film or video right? 60fps works better for old tube tvs, but not anything that was made in the last 10 years.

Where are people getting the idea that hollywood isn't shooting 24p. Yes, film projectors went out, even before film stopped being the dominant capture medium. But if you're sitting in a theater, you're watching at 24p, even from a digital projector.

 

[WillT]

Where does Canon state that it does that?

I don't see it stated anywhere if it is true it seems like shady marketing to me. Source: https://www.eoshd.com/2019/08/canon-and-sony-aps-c-flagships-disappoint-buy-the-fuji-x-t30-instead/

 

[unfocused]

All this talk about the Hobbit just illustrates to me that no frame rate, no matter what it is, can turn crap into gold.

 

[Photo Hack]

This is what happens when Canon execs are given iPhones to replace their Samsungs.

 

[Batman6794]

It’s hilarious how far these nimwits in this thread will go to say that 24p is a “useless, extra feature just for wannabe videographers” when it’s present in damn near every Canon camera that shoots video for the better part of almost a decade.

Exactly. If I'm shooting narrative, I'd take the T2i over the 90D, which is really sad. Not saying the 90D doesn't have some great features for video, but 4K and less compressed colors are really nice to have, 24p is a must.

 

[Batman6794]

All this talk about the Hobbit just illustrates to me that no frame rate, no matter what it is, can turn crap into gold.

That's the wrong question to ask. For my money, the question is can it turn gold into crap. I'd say not quite, but still too close for my money.

 

[neuroanatomist]

This is what happens when company execs are given iPhones to replace their Samsungs.

Doe that mean the iPhone doesn’t shoot p24 video? How will those company execs who are also amateur filmmakers capture video that looks like professionally shot cinematic footage if they can’t use their iPhones or their 90D/M6II/RP cameras?

 

[Photo Hack]

Doe that mean the iPhone doesn’t shoot p24 video? How will those company execs who are also amateur filmmakers capture video that looks like professionally shot cinematic footage if they can’t use their iPhones or their 90D/M6II/RP cameras?

The joke is that Apple purposely takes out features and options to simplify their products and tell its users what they need. They force their will on their users and the users love it and keep coming back for more. Myself included.

It seems Canon might be headed that direction. In the corporate world we were usually given an iPhone or Galaxy.....since Blackberry bit the dust haha.

You seriously spend too much time on here.

 

[neuroanatomist]

The joke is that Apple purposely takes out features and options to simplify their products and tell its users what they need. They force their will on their users and the users love it and keep coming back for more. Myself included.

It seems Canon might be headed that direction. In the corporate world we were usually given an iPhone or Galaxy.....since Blackberry bit the dust haha.

You seriously spend too much time on here.

Yeah, damn them for taking out floppy drives. Then optical drives. But Canon Rumors had a Dark Mode before iOS.

 

[PureClassA]

That new Panasonic S1H looks like a beast. I’d love to see Canon make a real competitor to that. A Full blown, full frame MILC built for film folks. 6k. $3999. That compact form factor is becoming more and more popular. Bigger bodies like the Cinema line cant always be as agile and versatile. It’s why Sony makes complimentary MILCS to their bigger FS models (the Sony Cinema line) I hope Canon eventually moves in this direction too. They are taking a few baby steps now. They still have the best color science and look.

I don't see it stated anywhere if it is true it seems like shady marketing to me. Source: https://www.eoshd.com/2019/08/canon-and-sony-aps-c-flagships-disappoint-buy-the-fuji-x-t30-instead/

Reid has been on a screed lately. I was told by him on facebook to “go F**k yourself”. Or maybe it was “go f**k off” after I and several others reacted as one would expect when demanded that “governments” should investigate and ban the practice of monthly fee software (like
adobe)

 

[slclick]

Ah, but this is where we agree! You're saying that filmmakers need different features in their cameras than photographers do. No argument from me, there. My issue is with those who are trying to tell filmmakers what they need and don't.

EDIT: Last point and I'm done in this thread - whatever Canon's reasons are for leaving 24p out of these cameras, there will be a flood of people on YouTube telling filmmakers to stay away from Canon's entry level cameras and buy a Sony, Nikon, or Fuji instead, and those people will be right.

I get that. However, this is a situation where video features are being added to a photography based camera. So we come full circle to the argument of how there are true video based bodies yet budgetary concerns keep them out of your hands and then the hybrids are being decried as basically criminal since they don't do video justice. This is why we get the Porsche/Hyundai analogy.

But hey, Blackmagic has your camera, takes your EF lenses and doesn't break the bank. Head on over there and Namaste.

 

[Ozarker]

LOL. You're aware that there is a frame rate weather you shoot film or video right? 60fps works better for old tube tvs, but not anything that was made in the last 10 years.

Where are people getting the idea that hollywood isn't shooting 24p. Yes, film projectors went out, even before film stopped being the dominant capture medium. But if you're sitting in a theater, you're watching at 24p, even from a digital projector.

Does it matter to you? Are you making films for the big screen? Holy Macaroni Batman! No.

BTW: Like I said, not everyone is shooting film. Not everyone is shooting at 24 frames per second. Not every movie is projected at 24p. Then when they shoot at HFR, it is not always 24 in the theaters. "It doesn't look like film unless projected on film in the theaters." (light paraphrase) That's Spielberg. LOL! I think he probably knows a little more about it than you and I.

Someone who does work in the industry made it very clear in an earlier post: 24 fps is what Hollywood used because it saved $, not because it gave a particular "look". Nobody said that some in Hollywood are not shooting in 24p. Just as nobody denies movies are now shot at 48p, 60p, and 120p (well, maybe you deny it). The idea that Hollywood doesn't shoot in anything other than 24p, and that we'd all get sick watching anything else, is an uninformed idea. Blanket statements are almost always wrong. You're welcome.

Regardless, Hollywood doesn't set the standard for home video of your hamster. Also, what people are complaining about is the shooting frame rate. There is no argument here about what speed it is watched in. Either way, you are wrong.

 

[Stereodude]

I knew that Magic Lantern would be covered in the first comments coming up here

Because there's a reasonably working Magic Lantern version for the 70D? Oh wait, no...

If they're still messing with getting a reasonably polished version for a 6 year old model, I wouldn't be banking on Magic Lantern to turn the 90D into the Video powerhouse Canon wouldn't anytime soon if at all.

 

[slclick]

Now I'm really mad that the M line isn't full frame. Crippled!

(nor does it have a built in Arca Swiss L plate, fine Corinthian leather handstrap or Hobbit 48p mode)


This thread is about as ricockulous as complaining about location of the strap lugs on a Pen F at Olympusrumors.

 

[KrisK]

And HERE is the final word on the random withholding of 24p from the M6 mkII and the 90D: https://www.eoshd.com/2019/08/nope-...d-and-eos-m6-ii-to-save-h-264-licensing-fees/

PS ... The M6 mk I has 24p frame rate. So all this talk about fees and costs is pure hogwash. As mentioned in the article, they are trying to push customers to higher priced products, but they may just push customers to a different brand in the long run.

But why wouldn't an aspiring filmmaker want those higher end products, anyway? The cost diff. between these crop cameras and something like a grey-market R aren't that great, and you get features that, IMHO, are a lot more important to a filmmaker (such as built-in C-Log.)

 

[Scenes]

Where does Canon state that it does that?

That’s an opinion on the eosHD site. We don’t know if it’s fact.

 

[Scenes]

I don't see it stated anywhere if it is true it seems like shady marketing to me. Source: https://www.eoshd.com/2019/08/canon-and-sony-aps-c-flagships-disappoint-buy-the-fuji-x-t30-instead/

That’s not the best source. Canon don’t send him review samples so anything from Canon he hates.

 

[Scenes]

Where does Canon state that it does that?

That’s an opinion on the

You might be right about the site in general, but this article seems plausible, and his four bullets of facts are verifiable.

He hates canon because they don’t send him review samples. It may well turn out to be right but I’d wait for peta pixels or fstoopers or literally any other website to confirm before taking his opinion as fact.

 

[Scenes]

I don't see it stated anywhere if it is true it seems like shady marketing to me. Source: https://www.eoshd.com/2019/08/canon-and-sony-aps-c-flagships-disappoint-buy-the-fuji-x-t30-instead/

If it’s true it’s still common practice. The Ari Alexa is a much more expense Hollywood camera and shoots 2.8k upscaling to 4K. The majority of 4K movies available today are upscaled from 2k. Also I believe 70D and 80D upscale to get to 1080 so it’s not unheard of. Not defending the practice of labelling things as 4K when they aren’t, I’m just saying it wouldn’t be surprising as seems to be an industry wide practice.

 

[Stereodude]

Not defending the practice of labelling things as 4K when they aren’t, I’m just saying it wouldn’t be surprising as seems to be an industry wide practice.

Except that Arri is very clear that's what you're buying. They clearly list in the specs that their 4K UHD mode uses 3200x1800 photosites.

Canon just puts a "*through image processing" in the fine print after their "4K" hoping people don't notice.