5D4 Sensor Defect Discovered

[TimoV]

lkunl, you got it!

I mentioned earlier that stripes are coming visible almost without shadow boosting... If you have night scene with bright lights and clear sky + no over exposure too much + you must have proper monitor (with normal cheap monitor you simple cannot see this stripes without boosting a lot).

 

[lkunl]

I can also confirm there is something wrong in my 5Dmk4 camera and it can see in real world photos…

I take some shot at night time in the city and outside shopping mall and later look photos from my PC, all parts of dark night sky was full of dark stripes, so near to black level there are visible horizontal stripes (if boosting shadows even little it’s coming more visible), other Canon cameras I own earlier don’t have this "phenomenon".

This stripes can be visible without boosting anything in the photo, stripes changes little photo by photo and some situation there is little color tint.

Shots was taken RAW and base ISO 100 and can see in newest Lightroom and DPP.

I return this camera already to Canon (Finland) and now waiting the results…

lkunl, you got it!

I mentioned earlier that stripes are coming visible almost without shadow boosting... If you have night scene with bright lights and clear sky + no over exposure too much + you must have proper monitor (with normal cheap monitor you simple cannot see this stripes without boosting a lot).

I just read your post. I can confirm that i have same problem. I try to shoot under exposure in daylight but did not find any problem. I will try astro shoot when i got clear sky. If i still see the strip when i expose correctly in complete dark sky It will be big problem for me. Congratulations to you that you can return it. I can send it to repair only (here).

 

[Mikehit]

lkunl, you got it!

I mentioned earlier that stripes are coming visible almost without shadow boosting... If you have night scene with bright lights and clear sky + no over exposure too much + you must have proper monitor (with normal cheap monitor you simple cannot see this stripes without boosting a lot).

I used to feel safe from natural disasters here in the UK. Then I bought a new-fangled ultra-sensitive super-dooper seismograph and now I realise that the whole town is about to be shaken to the ground.
I am worried.

 

[Donkey_Kong]

So, what I gather is this: the author of this thread is a total jackass. Am I right?

 

[Mikehit]

So, what I gather is this: the author of this thread is a total jackass. Am I right?

No, the author made an error (which he has admitted after nearly 20 pages) that his comments in his first post was poorly worded which set hackles rising on many respondents. If he had posted in the tone that he has done more recently this would have been more of a 'OK, but I don't know why you would do that'.

The question (still unresolved) is whether he has found a fault or whether he has found the technical limitations of the sensor which every keen photographer will do at some point.

 

[TimoV]

Mikehit, very actively shooting down all findings in this thread and seems that you don’t even own this camera? Canon troll?

 

[Mikehit]

Mikehit, very actively shooting down all findings in this thread and seems that you don’t even own this camera? Canon troll?

Have I shot down 'all findings'? Please show me where.
This idea of 'you can only see it if you have the very best monitor' is verging on facile and reminds me of the hifi wars and the self-proclaimed 'golden-eared' audio gods - you can't hear the differences because your hifi isn't good enough, and it doesn't matter to you because you can't hear it. So pooh to you.

This thread started with the OP demonstrating some pretty extreme circumstances to show an effect most people would not notice in a long time of shooting. In the good old days it used to be called 'finding the limitations of the gear'. Now everything is 'a fault' or 'a mistake' or 'the manufacturer don't know what they are doing'. It is becoming increasingly tedious to tell the difference between a genuine concern and someone who thinks they have found something worth discussing.

If, as later posts suggest, this also happens at a 2-stop push that is much more worthwhile of investigation and it will be interesting to hear what Canon say about it.
I saw these same complaints about the 5D3 (some even claimed 'problems' because they saw banding with a 7-stop push!!!) when it first came out but that did not stop it becoming one of the best selling DSLRs for amateurs and professionals - the latter being the category who rely on this gear to put food on their table and a roof over their heads.
So maybe a more interesting question is if Canon get it so wrong, why was the 5D3 so successful?

This not about being a fanboy or a Canon shill, but being bored with over-hyping issues (real or perceived) and people seeming less willing to discuss gear but phrasing things in a way that suggests the only thing that interests them is finding 'problems' with new gear.

 

[Alex_M]

Let them dig. You never know what will come out out of this.

I bag to differ. This has nothing to do with person's maritual, job status, gender, age or sexual preferences.
Some people like to push their boundaries quite a bit and we call them explorers. Thanks for your understanding

I'm wondering if whoever did this test first has a job and/or a family? The person must be bored to death to start doing this kind of stuff.

I'd reserve the word "explore" for projects that have a legitimate potential for useful results. This is no more "exploration' than trying to dig deep a hole in one's back yard is archaeology.

 

[JukkaS]

This is my last comment to this thread. This is not banding, this is an error. Just took a photo in a training with bright window behind. Pushed 1,5 stops (no shadows) and what do I see - stripes on the wall. 6D never did this! I sadly gave it in exchange to get money for this new 4200 euros machine. I am starting to really regret my purchase. This is truly unacceptable. I am sure each new 5D4 is suffering from this - it just doesn´t show in all scenarios.

I am not happy to find these things on a new body. So all these smart asses who makes fun out of this really don´t get the point here.

 

[Mikehit]

This is my last comment to this thread. This is not banding, this is an error. Just took a photo in a training with bright window behind. Pushed 1,5 stops (no shadows) and what do I see - stripes on the wall. 6D never did this! I sadly gave it in exchange to get money for this new 4200 euros machine. I am starting to really regret my purchase. This is truly unacceptable. I am sure each new 5D4 is suffering from this - it just doesn´t show in all scenarios.

I am not happy to find these things on a new body. So all these smart asses who makes fun out of this really don´t get the point here.

If you have a bright window behind, then the camera will push the shadows even deeper , the signal to noise ratio will be very low and make it even harder to get information from the shadows. Are you saying that the 6D would have produced a usable image from those conditions?
I guess as you have sold your 6D you cannot compare them side by side.

You say it doesn't produce it in all conditions - have you done enough testing to predict when it will happen? Because if not then it is hard to define what is a genuine problem and what is a limit of the camera.

For me, these questions are not about being a smart-ass but trying to understand when it happens and whether it is an issue for me. Because in-depth every review by people whose reviews I have come to trust over time (woften working professionals), say it is at least as equal to the 6D in shadow recovery and no-one has mentioned this banding problem.

 

[AnnWei]

This is my last comment to this thread. This is not banding, this is an error. Just took a photo in a training with bright window behind. Pushed 1,5 stops (no shadows) and what do I see - stripes on the wall. 6D never did this! I sadly gave it in exchange to get money for this new 4200 euros machine. I am starting to really regret my purchase. This is truly unacceptable. I am sure each new 5D4 is suffering from this - it just doesn´t show in all scenarios.

I am not happy to find these things on a new body. So all these smart asses who makes fun out of this really don´t get the point here.

It's my first post here.
Same here in the similar scene.
Underexposure 3ev then push up 3ev in LR, +100 shadow, and then the banding showed up.

I returned the new 5DIV back.

 

[tron]

The good news is that the seller emailed me that he got my 5D4 back and that he ordered a new one. The only issue is he told me that as soon as they get it they will ship it. I had asked him to make the specific tests that show if there is this issue but he didn't mention it in the mail. A test would help eliminate any issues with the second camera and avoid (my) disappointment We will see....

 

[ZachOly]

This is pretty nasty banding to be honest. And it seems like a lot of people are experiencing this "problem".

I won't be buying one now until after the new year.

 

[Loswr]

I am sure each new 5D4 is suffering from this - it just doesn´t show in all scenarios.

You are sure? I guess they're handing out omniscience from Pez dispensers these days. :

Consider the 70D... Someone in Germany posted a blog about a problem achieving sharp focus with the center AF point. Someone else 'replicated' that finding (with a completely inadequate test). Here on CR and elsewhere, people were 'sure all 70D cameras suffered from the problem' and claimed 'the 70D is defective'.

Meanwhile, the original guy in Germany had sent his 70D to Canon service, they found it to be defective and repaired it, and when the guy retested it, it was fine.

This issue could be normal behavior, it could be a few defective units, or it could be a major issue. In that last case, there will be a recall for affected units. But that's not going to happen just because some dude on the Internet is 'sure' the model is defective.

 

[ZachOly]

^ Seems to be several reports of this on the internet. The camera is only 2 months old.

With winter around the corner I'm better off waiting and seeing how to plays out of the next few months, rather than spending $5,200 Canadian on a camera that might be defective.

 

[Mikehit]

Underexposure 3ev then push up 3ev in LR, +100 shadow, and then the banding showed up.

So about a 6-stop push then?
How about you take a normal scene, not underexposed and then push the shadows 100%. Because that is what I would do in real life.
See how that works.

 

[Loswr]

^ Seems to be several reports of this on the internet. The camera is only 2 months old.

Several reports. Tens of thousands of cameras sold. 'Several reports on the Internet' is meaningless, except to those experiencing the issue. Those people need to tell Canon.

 

[tr573]

Underexposure 3ev then push up 3ev in LR, +100 shadow, and then the banding showed up.

So about a 6-stop push then?
How about you take a normal scene, not underexposed and then push the shadows 100%. Because that is what I would do in real life.
See how that works.

More than 6 with the +100 shadow actually.

 

[Orangutan]

^ Seems to be several reports of this on the internet. The camera is only 2 months old.

Several reports. Tens of thousands of cameras sold. 'Several reports on the Internet' is meaningless, except to those experiencing the issue. Those people need to tell Canon.

Let's be fair, though: if there are legitimate, replicable tests that demonstrate a legitimate problem within a sane exposure latitude then we can discuss it, and Canon should take action. However, you can't cite drownings as a reason to ban water as a dangerous substance; similarly, you can't push to extremes and infer problems at normal exposures.

 

[Loswr]

^ Seems to be several reports of this on the internet. The camera is only 2 months old.

Several reports. Tens of thousands of cameras sold. 'Several reports on the Internet' is meaningless, except to those experiencing the issue. Those people need to tell Canon.

Let's be fair, though: if there are legitimate, replicable tests that demonstrate a legitimate problem within a sane exposure latitude then we can discuss it, and Canon should take action. However, you can't cite drownings as a reason to ban water as a dangerous substance; similarly, you can't push to extremes and infer problems at normal exposures.

Certainly. As I stated:

This issue could be normal behavior, it could be a few defective units, or it could be a major issue. In that last case, there will be a recall for affected units.