Canon confirms September 24, 2020 announcement for the Canon Cinema EOS C70

MaxDiesel

EOS M6 Mark II
Sep 23, 2015
52
7
Any chance they’ll also be releasing the C50 at the same time? Sound like the perfect compagnion to my C200.
 

MaxDiesel

EOS M6 Mark II
Sep 23, 2015
52
7
But will the C70 beat the a7siii for the independent filmmaker ?

-Dynamic range will be similar
-Portability will go to Sony
-Cine body functionalities will go to Canon
-Low Light for Sony
-Reliability will be a tie
-Ibis for sony

what about image quality ? Im torn when I see the c300mkii footage vs the a7siii one...
LOL... really! We can’t judge anything till we see results on both.

Sony is far from reliable and their menu system is horrid. Can’t beat a button for everything on Canon’s side.
IBIS in Sony full frame is not reliable for video tho they have their APSC line done right.
No one can judge low light yet.. who has better noise, iso, sharpness, image cadence... we’ll have to see.
Canon offers proper audio, built in ND and the possibility of future in body CanonRaw Lite.

I could go on but I will say this... there is only one of these cameras that you can pickup and shot with immediately and thats the canon. I would rather compared the c70 to Sony’s new camera coming out like the FX6... if all you do is video, get a video camera. You’ll wonder why you ever used a hybrid to begin with.
 

PureClassA

Canon since age 5. The A1
CR Pro
Aug 15, 2014
2,113
805
Mandeville, LA
Shields-Photography.com
Few thoughts based on various earlier comments:

it’s the C300 Mk 3 sensor. CR established this a few weeks ago with the initial rumor. It almost 100% will NOT have IBIS. The C300-3 doesnt. Neither will this. This is a C300-3 sensor plug and play In a smaller HALF PRICE body.

Comparing usage of $6200 pro Cinema body to a consumer hybrid Is a bit folly. NDs and proper audio with pro mic preamps and other such functions are crucial. The Alpha has no such things.

and this is still a Super 35 sensor. Not a FF. Im looking forward to this thing and also what it’s going to do to the C200 price. It will probably hit $4500 retail.
 

HarryFilm

EOS RP
Jun 6, 2016
634
138
Ah okay, jeah on this level of quality its certainly true.Impressive stuff your company does btw :)
---

Technically, I should note that I am NOT an actual employee of the company.

I actually work for a video production/multimedia systems company at my day job.

I am a personal friend of the aerospace company owner (30+ years!) who gives me access to technical resources (i.e. supercomputing time) for my personal projects in exchange for my graphics programming expertise and grid-networking maintenance/setup/employee training expertise.

I DO NOT HAVE a S (ecret) or TS: SCI security clearance in his company, so I do not have access to "The Really Good Stuff" but I do have access to an AWESOME INVENTORY of Canon 1Dc's, 1Dx 2/3's, 7D2's, 5D 2/3's, Arri Alexas, Sony Venices, Sony A7s2's, Phase Ones, Phantom Visions, Hasselblad's and some R5's if I need them so long I have full Replacement Value Insurance and 3rd party liability insurance plan on them when I sign them out.

The satellite imagery stuff this company does is mostly proprietary commercial so they are quite high tech and I get to partake sometimes in those projects because of my graphics systems expertise. I also do CODEC (Video/Audio Compressor/Decompressor) development for them and you will see the results of that development in the public arena soon enough!

This company is WHY I know about the developments in full RGB nightvision quite surpassing the Sony A7 s2/s3 cameras. The X27 is a commercially available product while the 50 micron photosite sensor we make is internal-only. BOTH cameras look like daylight even at Midnight but the 50 microns per photosite sensor we make has much less thermal and electrical noise so the image looks much clearer than the X27. In fact, I would say is it very similar to what a Canon 1Dx2 has noise-wise at ISO-6400 at Sunset. (i.e. darn good noise floor!). It is DCI 4K resolution too at up to 60 fps!

V
 
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Darecinema

Addicted to lenses.
CR Pro
Sep 8, 2018
29
36
don't we already konw what the sensor is capable of, given its already been used? (and assuming CR is right, and it always is right). a7siii is the low light winner for any consumer/prosumer/professional camera in the world, and i dont' think its even a competition. (i swithced from E to RF recently w/ the R5 so i'm not biased to sony in any way, but realistic).
Have to agree on this. I’ve never seen another camera shoot in low light as well as the A7SII. Even a ton of the Netflix Earth at Night series was filmed with them and looks fantastic. I keep on in my bag for such scenarios as a complement to my C300ii and 5div. Color marching is a pain, but when the sun is gone, that A7SII can be a true shot saver.
 

Darecinema

Addicted to lenses.
CR Pro
Sep 8, 2018
29
36
---

Technically, I should note that I am NOT an actual employee of the company.

I actually work for a video production/multimedia systems company at my day job.

I am a personal friend of the aerospace company owner (30+ years!) who gives me access to technical resources (i.e. supercomputing time) for my personal projects in exchange for my graphics programming expertise and grid-networking maintenance/setup/employee training expertise.

I DO NOT HAVE a S (ecret) or TS: SCI security clearance in his company, so I do not have access to "The Really Good Stuff" but I do have access to an AWESOME INVENTORY of Canon 1Dc's, 1Dx 2/3's, 7D2's, 5D 2/3's, Arri Alexas, Sony Venices, Sony A7s2's, Phase Ones, Phantom Visions, Hasselblad's and some R5's if I need them so long I have full Replacement Value Insurance and 3rd party liability insurance plan on them when I sign them out.

The satellite imagery stuff this company does is mostly proprietary commercial so they are quite high tech and I get to partake sometimes in those projects because of my graphics systems expertise. I also do CODEC (Video/Audio Compressor/Decompressor) development for them and you will see the results of that development in the public arena soon enough!

This company is WHY I know about the developments in full RGB nightvision quite surpassing the Sony A7 s2/s3 cameras. The X27 is a commercially available product while the 50 micron photosite sensor we make is internal-only. BOTH cameras look like daylight even at Midnight but the 50 microns per photosite sensor we make has much less thermal and electrical noise so the image looks much clearer than the X27. In fact, I would say is it very similar to what a Canon 1Dx2 has noise-wise at ISO-6400 at Sunset. (i.e. darn good noise floor!). It is DCI 4K resolution too at up to 60 fps!

V
Sounds awesome. And for those with deep pockets definitely some great tools. I think the point was that for most of us having a relatively cheap tool with really decent low light filming capabilities is very convenient.
 

stevensteven

EOS M6 Mark II
Jun 24, 2020
81
57
Few thoughts based on various earlier comments:

it’s the C300 Mk 3 sensor. CR established this a few weeks ago with the initial rumor. It almost 100% will NOT have IBIS. The C300-3 doesnt. Neither will this. This is a C300-3 sensor plug and play In a smaller HALF PRICE body.

Comparing usage of $6200 pro Cinema body to a consumer hybrid Is a bit folly. NDs and proper audio with pro mic preamps and other such functions are crucial. The Alpha has no such things.

and this is still a Super 35 sensor. Not a FF. Im looking forward to this thing and also what it’s going to do to the C200 price. It will probably hit $4500 retail.
I’m not judging. I’m speculating. Based on history, and comparable existing products. Nothing wrong with that.

Also, like I explained ok my previous post, this question/debate is not about the butting on the side of the camera. It’s not about sound or anything like that either.
It’s PURELY about imagine quality. Not about the process of the producing the image, such as saying things like one has ND the other one you have to screw it on as an extra cost ..... just the IMAGE QUALITY.

TRying to be as objective as possible, which will have a nice image is most run and gun scenarios ? The a7siii, or the c70/c300iii?
As simple as that. The image quality only. Nothing else.
 

mariosk1gr

EOS M6 Mark II
Jan 4, 2019
75
51
Why are you bringing Arri into this ?
the C70 doesn’t compare to the ARRI. Far from it. It compares to the Komodo. Then to Sony, probably the fs6. But the truth is, it might even be beat by the a7siii. This is why we ask this question.
And being the most portable cine camera that canon will make, it does make sense to wonder if we should order the a7siii or wait for the c70...
How hard is it to understand that ?
A7S III and whatever cinema camera is not the same thing and you cannot compare them at all! As I said two different markets. A7S is a hybrid camera that does the job for ppl who are looking one system that takes stills and video at the same time and that's why there are compromises with these bodies. Built-in NDs, waveform, false color, ergonomics, no heat issues, XLRs and many other things separate completely a cinema camera from a hybrid camera. But ppl expect to get all this in one package! It cannot... how simple is that?
 

mariosk1gr

EOS M6 Mark II
Jan 4, 2019
75
51
Most people using Arri are controlling light. Not so much the case when shooting as a one man band with a mirrorless hybrid.
I hope you can understand that it's not the a7s's sensor that is superior in low light against cinema cameras BUT that there is huge noise reduction implementation that takes all that noise along with color information also. That's why when you expose a lot of under or over you see all this banding from hybrid cameras. That's not the case in cinema cameras. Of course you need lights when you do a professional shooting but if you assume that is the same against an a7s then Big productions would not using expensive cameras.
 

DBounce

EOS RP
May 3, 2016
203
253
Where is it written that “Pro” cinema cameras need to have built in ND and XLR? I’m seeing many quote these as the signature of a pro body. Does Komodo have these? Not at all... How about the top of the line Red Monstro 8K? Nope... Arri Alexa LF? No built in ND, but has an XLR.

I think that the C70 can and will be compared to hybrid bodies. The price is close enough. The small format is there. And for many hybrid shooters it’s more size that drives the decision.
 

Darecinema

Addicted to lenses.
CR Pro
Sep 8, 2018
29
36
I’m not judging. I’m speculating. Based on history, and comparable existing products. Nothing wrong with that.

Also, like I explained ok my previous post, this question/debate is not about the butting on the side of the camera. It’s not about sound or anything like that either.
It’s PURELY about imagine quality. Not about the process of the producing the image, such as saying things like one has ND the other one you have to screw it on as an extra cost ..... just the IMAGE QUALITY.

TRying to be as objective as possible, which will have a nice image is most run and gun scenarios ? The a7siii, or the c70/c300iii?
As simple as that. The image quality only. Nothing else.
Hi Stev. I haven’t shot with either camera yet, but I’m sure that by early next year I’ll most likely have all three incorporated into my shooting. But I’m almost positive based off my current experience shooting with the A7S2 and C300II regularly that I will prefer the look from the C3003 sensor over the A7S3 and it will have a better image quality with less banding/artifacts as the need for dynamic range increases in uncontrolled lighting situations. But In low light situations I’ll definitely choose the A7S3. This is speculation, but as soon as these cameras become available I’ll go ahead and rent them for a test shoot and post my results and share my thoughts on it.
 

PureClassA

Canon since age 5. The A1
CR Pro
Aug 15, 2014
2,113
805
Mandeville, LA
Shields-Photography.com
Where is it written that “Pro” cinema cameras need to have built in ND and XLR? I’m seeing many quote these as the signature of a pro body. Does Komodo have these? Not at all... How about the top of the line Red Monstro 8K? Nope... Arri Alexa LF? No built in ND, but has an XLR.

I think that the C70 can and will be compared to hybrid bodies. The price is close enough. The small format is there. And for many hybrid shooters it’s more size that drives the decision.
That's because RED makes separate audio modules they want you to drop an extra $3000 - $4500 on to attach to the brain. For example, To get what you have in a $16K Canon C-500-2, you have to drop about $45,000 into a full Red kit. Carlos Quintero did a GREAT youtube video on comparing the real cost of ownership of these cameras.
 
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DBounce

EOS RP
May 3, 2016
203
253
That's because RED makes separate audio modules they want you to drop an extra $3000 - $4500 on to attach to the brain. For example, To get what you have in a $16K Canon C-500-2, you have to drop about $45,000 into a full Red kit. Carlos Quintero did a GREAT youtube video on comparing the real cost of ownership of these cameras.
Sony also makes a separate audio module... as does Panasonic.
 

HarryFilm

EOS RP
Jun 6, 2016
634
138
Sounds awesome. And for those with deep pockets definitely some great tools. I think the point was that for most of us having a relatively cheap tool with really decent low light filming capabilities is very convenient.
---

Then, the Sony A7S3 is a perfectly fine camera for low-light situations. If it helps, Sigma is selling their
Sigma 35mm f/1.2 DG DN Art Lens for Sony E


for only $1500 USD, which i think is one of the FINEST, FASTEST and SHARPEST pro-level lenses ever made!

Only the Zeiss Otus series is better! and that one is 2.5x the price!

So if you want ASTOUNDING low-light photos, then the Sigma 35mm Art prime lens mated to a Sony A7s3 is IDEAL for your needs. Those two items make for a FANTASTIC Astrophotography and Deep Night Forest Creature image captures!

If you take out the IR filter (Infrared) on the Sony cameras, you use a BIG IR flashlight and bath your night field shoots in wide-field infrared light in order to better capture the nocturnal animals such as mountain lions, racoons, Sasquatch, Windigo, etc. I notice the Sigma series lenses seem to allow a lot more IR light pass-through than an equivalent Canon L-series lens. The glass on most FF lenses STILL stop a lot of infrared light BUT taking out any camera's IR filter lets you see much more at night when bathing your night time area of interest with a BIG wide-field IR flashlight.

--

As another suggestion, I have also used the Canon M5 mated with some older 1980's era cine-modded ZEISS Nocto glass (f/0.95) to ALSO get astounding night imagery at decent prices. At $999 USD, the Canon M5 camera is no slouch when it comes to night imagery. Even though it has an APS-C sensor, the older cine-modded f/0.95 Zeiss glass mated to a Canon M5 camera more than makes up by giving you a 1.5 stops advantage over the Nikon D850 or the Fuji XT-4 at 40% to 70% cheaper prices!

There's a tiny bit of crop with the Nocto lens (around 1.2) but who cares when I get to see some GREAT night time desert or prairie sky imagery!

if you can't find an old Nocto series (now pretty rare and gone up in price!), the older Zeiss Contax lenses are ALSO awesome and they are f/1.2 OR EVEN BETTER!


We have a few of the Contax in-house because our parent company's gear-wrangler is a vintage lens buff who likes to collect custom and/or vintage lenses for custom in-house projects.

V
 
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wanderer23

EOS M6 Mark II
CR Pro
Feb 8, 2020
55
69
You can't compare a7s3 with c300iii sensor. a7s3 low light winner in "pro" camera world? Then let's abandon ARRI and RED and go buy sonys from now on! "TWO" different markets... how hard is to understand that? Omg what else are we going to hear these days...
of course you can't compare the cameras. but someone simply asked about low light/ high iso performance. this isn't about how the camera is used, or professional or not, or cinema usage or not. its just comparing sensors. has little to do what what one can do with teh camera. i just responded to someone's question. you need to take a chill pill haha