Canon EOS 5Ds and EOS 5Ds R Preview

Canon Rumors Guy

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Jul 20, 2010
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<p>Bryan at The Digital Picture has compiled a pretty extensive preview of Canon’s latest professional DSLRs.</p>
<p><strong><a href="http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/Canon-EOS-5Ds.aspx" target="_blank">Canon EOS 5Ds &  EOS 5Ds R Preview</a></strong></p>
<p><strong><span style="color: #ff0000;">c</span>r</strong></p>
 

PureClassA

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Antono Refa said:
"Per Chuck Westfall, no HDMI out is provided."

Isn't an HDMI out a great aid in focusing stills, by displaying the image on a larger-than-camera's screen?

and he's wrong. Per the Canon USA spec page:
http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/consumer/products/cameras/slr_cameras/eos_5ds#Specifications

HDMI out IS on there
 
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Marsu42

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Destin said:
"The 5Ds has the same dynamic range as 5D III"

Meaning it has less dr than the 6d? And what about the cross banding that has been improved to much on the 6d in favor of the much weaker "line banding" only across one dimension? But of course they didn't review the camera, they're just "previewing" it by assembling information they found...

The 5Ds has the same dynamic range as 5D III. While some will complain that the closest Nikon-equivalent body has more dynamic range (and more is better), I haven't had an issue with the 5D II's DR. When I can't retain both shadows and highlights in an image, that scene generally needs very significantly more DR and exposure bracketing with HDR handles those instances nicely.

... but I agree here, other than other CR members: For landscape, another +2ev dynamic range would be nice, but for the very highest iq you'd still need to bracket most of the time. More dynamic range is essential for situations with movement when you only are able to take one frame - unfortunately, this includes moving leaves or grass.
 
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Canon Rumors said:
<p>Bryan at The Digital Picture has compiled a pretty extensive preview of Canon’s latest professional DSLRs.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/Canon-EOS-5Ds.aspx" target="_blank">Canon EOS 5Ds & EOS 5Ds R Preview</a></p>
<p><strong>cr</strong></p>

So is Bryan the new Canon PR guy or something?? He should complain if he's not getting paid like it.
 
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Jan 29, 2011
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PureClassA said:
Antono Refa said:
"Per Chuck Westfall, no HDMI out is provided."

Isn't an HDMI out a great aid in focusing stills, by displaying the image on a larger-than-camera's screen?

and he's wrong. Per the Canon USA spec page:
http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/consumer/products/cameras/slr_cameras/eos_5ds#Specifications

HDMI out IS on there

Nothing like a rumours feeding frenzy on announcement night.
 

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Marsu42

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JohanCruyff said:
Destin said:
"The 5Ds has the same dynamic range as 5D III"
but also
"This review page will be updated when my 5Ds bodies arrive, but for now, below are my expectations for this camera."

He states this information is straight from a Canon associated sources, so that should be reliable. Question is if its +0.5ev like on the 6d, but I doubt it - they probably really went for the max resolution they could get out of their current tech, never mind dr.
 
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Marsu42 said:
JohanCruyff said:
Destin said:
"The 5Ds has the same dynamic range as 5D III"
but also
"This review page will be updated when my 5Ds bodies arrive, but for now, below are my expectations for this camera."

He states this information is straight from a Canon associated sources, so that should be reliable. Question is if its +0.5ev like on the 6d, but I doubt it - they probably really went for the max resolution they could get out of their current tech, never mind dr.


Yes.
From DPReview:
"It's convenient to think of the new 50MP as essentially an upscaled version of the 20MP sensor inside the EOS 7D Mark II - minus the 7D II's Dual-pixel AF. The pixel pitch of 4.14 microns is certainly very similar across both sensors. Accordingly, Canon tells us that at a pixel level, noise levels should be very similar to the EOS 7D Mark II and slightly better than what we'd expect from a 5D Mark II (note: not a 5D Mark III). Oddly though, maximum ISO sensitivity is capped at ISO 6400, which extends only up to 12,800. Even more oddly, a Canon representative openly described this limitation as ‘arbitrary'. This is strange because the EOS 7D Mark II (remember the pixel pitch of its sensor is almost the same) can confidently shoot at ISO sensitivity settings up to 51,200.
Speaking of the EOS 7D Mark II, the new 5DS and 5DS R inherit its 150,000 pixel metering sensor, so although the cameras' 61-point phase-detection AF arrays are the same as the EOS 5D III, subject tracking should be (and seems to be, from our very brief first impressions) superior to the older model albeit, oddly, not up to the level of speed and accuracy offered by Canon's own 1D X, or Nikon's recent implementations of 3D tracking.
As far as dynamic range is concerned, we're told that the new 5DS and 5DS R should give the same performance as the current EOS 5D Mark III. If true, this means that the new cameras won't be able to offer the same industry-leading dynamic range of Sony's current APS-C and full-frame sensors, but at least it isn't a step backwards. And hey - 50MP!"
http://www.dpreview.com/previews/canon-eos-5ds-sr/5


No Sony sensor.
 
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So if Sony gives the world a 50mp sensor that has better IQ than the 5ds's sensor, I seem to recall a statement made by a certain Canon exec;

"We will use the best sensor available...." too bad he didn't have a Crystal ball.

It's what many thought; a probable 180nm fab used, but "Voldemort" remains the same.

Time to try Dual ISO on the 5d3, any pointers to one page that gives me all the info needed, it's a task to go over 100's of pages in the ML forums....


Marsu42... any idea?
 
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BIG DISSAPOINTMENT!

I really believed this would be a game changer. Instead it seems we are getting a 50MP FF 7DII.

I had, for all practical purposes, three major items on my motivation list, in order of priority: DR, Low ISO noise and resolution. I get resolution. I still don't know what to expect from noise, but it seems I can conclude that DR still lags at least 3 stops behind Sony/Nikon. BIG dissapointment.

Bryan is happy to use HDR/bracketing to solve this issue. Animals don't sit still! Insects don't sit still, wind moves trees, leaves, grass, hair etc. etc. The only way to get all information out of a high contrast image is to have sufficient DR. BIG dissapointment!

I was ready to push the preorder button as soon as it turned green. Now I'll spend the weekend going through my gear and figure out what I'll keep and what I'll sell. Unless I get magnificent noise performance, I think I'm done! :mad:
 
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Nov 16, 2010
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I don't think the DR thing is ignorance from Canon, I'm guessing Sony holds some pretty important patents and without them it's very hard to compete. Canon simply can't do it, if they could they would.

The noise quality will make a big difference though, if the noise is nicely random and lacks banding or any other pattern issues then it will appear to have much more DR than say my aging 5Dmk2 even if they measure similarly.
 
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Marsu42

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K-amps said:
Time to try Dual ISO on the 5d3, any pointers to one page that gives me all the info needed, it's a task to go over 100's of pages in the ML forums....

It's really easy, that's how I do it (obviously install ML for this):

1a. set Canon iso to 100, set ML's dual_iso to 800 or max. 1600 (it will show you how much dynamic range you gain, max is ~15ev).
1b. If you shoot Av/Tv, *underexpose* with ec to catch as many highlights as you want. Default is the amount if dual_iso, i.e. for 100/800 underexpose 2 stops. After the shot, look at the raw histogram to see if it's filled, clipped (increase dual_iso) or has space left (decrease dual_iso).

... the other way 'round is to set ML's dual_iso to 100 and Canon's iso to 800/1600 (or let it float), in this case you don't need to use ec. It's probably more intuitive this way as you simply get more shadow detail, but it's a bit more black box than an explicit underexposure.

3. After downloading the DUALxyz.cr2 files run ML's cr2hdr.exe on each of them, you'll get a 16bit raw dng. White balance will be broken even though cr2hdr tries to comput it, best option is to use ACR's "auto" wb.

Eldar said:
I really believed this would be a game changer. Instead it seems we are getting a 50MP FF 7DII.

I dunno, what did you expect? Obviously smaller pixels have some kind of tradeoff, but the 7d2 has very nice iq on low iso (actually, even the 18mp sensor was ok <iso400). I'd love to have a 5ds for some shots, but alas, not at $4k.

Of course the biggest downside is the lack of Magic Lantern, i.e. you're really stuck with Canon's dynamic range and have no way to extend it other than bracketing.
 
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Marsu42 said:
Eldar said:
I really believed this would be a game changer. Instead it seems we are getting a 50MP FF 7DII.

I dunno, what did you expect? Obviously smaller pixels have some kind of tradeoff, but the 7d2 has very nice iq on low iso (actually, even the 18mp sensor was ok <iso400). I'd love to have a 5ds for some shots, but alas, not at $4k.

Of course the biggest downside is the lack of Magic Lantern, i.e. you're really stuck with Canon's dynamic range and have no way to extend it other than bracketing.
I was expecting either a new Canon sensor solution, which could compete with Sony, or a Sony sensor to solve Canon's lack of internal technology/ability. Instead it seems to be a full frame 7DII.

I cannot see why I should swap my 5DIII for this, when all I actually get is higher resolution and less high ISO performance. I could have lived with DR, provided I got significant improvements in noise. But that does not seem to happen. BIG dissapointment!
 
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Marsu42 said:
It's really easy, that's how I do it (obviously install ML for this):

1a. set Canon iso to 100, set ML's dual_iso to 800 or max. 1600 (it will show you how much dynamic range you gain, max is ~15ev).
1b. If you shoot Av/Tv, *underexpose* with ec to catch as many highlights as you want. Default is the amount if dual_iso, i.e. for 100/800 underexpose 2 stops. After the shot, look at the raw histogram to see if it's filled, clipped (increase dual_iso) or has space left (decrease dual_iso).

... the other way 'round is to set ML's dual_iso to 100 and Canon's iso to 800/1600 (or let it float), in this case you don't need to use ec. It's probably more intuitive this way as you simply get more shadow detail, but it's a bit more black box than an explicit underexposure.

3. After downloading the DUALxyz.cr2 files run ML's cr2hdr.exe on each of them, you'll get a 16bit raw dng. White balance will be broken even though cr2hdr tries to comput it, best option is to use ACR's "auto" wb.

Excellent Thanks Marsu42:

Where do I download the files from? Is there a Dummies for ML page with files and steps on how to use. I have never used it before.
 
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