Announcing The Canon EOS-1D X Mark II

[jaayres20]

With the exception of all 61 autofocus sensors which work up to f/8 and 4K video recording up to 60 fps with AF and 9MP still frame grab, Canon EOS 1D X Mark II is a disapointment, both in comparison to the Nikon D5 and as a standalone professional DSLR camera. No auto AF lens micro adjustment as in Nikon D5 (very important especially with the advent of Full Frame Mirrorless cameras such as the Sony a7S Mk II & Sony a7R MkII), 20 linear AF sensors out of 61 in total meaning that the Canon EOS 7D Mark II with its all selectable 65 cross type AF sensors remains the best as far as the total number of selectable cross type AF sensors is concerned while Nikon D5 with its 99 cross type AF sensors is much better at tracking fast erratically moving subjects, at least in theory since neither of these two AF systems have been tested in practise. Thus, since both the Nikon D5 and the Canon EOS 1D X Mark II are specifically targeted towards sports photographers, I believe that the Nikon D5 has a superior AF system for tracking moving subjects as far as still photography is concerned, unless the use of teleconverters brings the maximum lens aperture up to f/8 and/or when even 12 fps aren't enough in order to capture the perfect moment and one is willing to drop resolution to 9MP in order to have 60 fps while has the luxury of spending plenty of time post capture in front of a computer in order to select the perfect moment, in which case the Canon EOS 1D X Mark II with the addition of a much better 4K video recording implementation (duration, AF) becomes the better buy. All in all though, I believe that Canon was way too conservative in its last EOS 1 series body, probably trying to avoid AF issues such as in the recent past by copying Nikon in this instance by keeping essentially the same AF module for another generation, as Nikon did for the last 8 years (D3, D3S, D4, D4S). Canon was just unfortunate that at the time they chose to do so, Nikon brought to the market a radical new AF system which on paper at least looks very impressive while for the last 8 years during which Nikon kept essentially the same AF system, Canon didn't have an equivalent breakthrough. Finally, I would like to say, that both cameras embody the best technology their manufacturers have commercially available at the moment, with each camera strengthening even further the strong points of its manufacturer, either that is the AF algorithm for calculating the future position of a moving subject, low light AF performance, high ISO image quality and battery life in the case of Nikon or AF responsiveness both in lens and in camera body and 4K video implementation in the case of Canon.

I would argue that on paper, Canon's system is still better (except for the -3EV vs -4EV, but I doubt that will hardly make a real world difference). Nikon's AF points are not all user selectable. They have less user selectable points and they are more clustered in the middle of the frame. Also, Canon has double cross type sensors, 5 of them while Nikon has how many?

 

[derrald]

What would the diffraction correction be and how would that work exactly? Sounds eerily like in-camera sharpening....

It's "DLO" (Digital Lens Optimizer). Check out Digital Photo Professional 4 to see what it can do. http://web.canon.jp/imaging/dlo/howto/index.html

FYI, using DLO in DPP 3 basically doubles the RAW file size. That's NOT the case in DPP 4 and I would assume that's the sort of implementation they've used in-camera for the 1DX Mark II. Earlier, I added DLO to a 6D image (same MP as the 1DX Mark II obviously) and the RAW file went from 22.9 MB to 23.0 MB.

Here is a pretty good explanantion of DLO: http://web.canon.jp/imaging/dlo/index.html

I am familiar with DLO. I have never seen it do much for diffraction so I am guessing this doesn't really change anything.

 

[neuroanatomist]

A bit disappointed that we have to use CF+CFAST cards, I think Nikon's interchangeable solution is better.

Agree that dual CFast would have been much better (for me, not that I'm planning on upgrading any time soon). I wonder what Nikon will charge for the CF to XQD change, it's not like you can DIY...

We don't actually know if its up-gradable or not, I mean they haven't even announced it yet.....have they???

From Nikon's D5 brochure:

Yeah, no I meant we dont know if Canons is upgrade-able

Given that the 1D X II has one CF and one CFast, I see no reason to even suspect it would be upgradable.

 

[kubelik]

waiting for the 5D Mk IV specs but I have to say, I really like what got announced today. If I had $6K to spend on a camera I'd be really happy purchasing the 1DX Mk II based on what was announced today. wider spread of AF points, all f/8, permanent red-dot AF, DPAF, touchscreen AF in liveview, 4K @ 60p and 1080p @ 120p, 2MP increase ... if this is what gets brought to the table for the 5D Mk IV over the 5D Mk III, I'd be super excited.

Can anyone confirm that $6K is the cheapest release price for any of the digital era 1D-series full frame cameras? I feel like they used to get announced closer to $8K? Does this mean the 5D Mk IV's release price will be closer to $2800 or $3K rather than $3.5K?

 

[neuroanatomist]

With the exception of all 61 autofocus sensors which work up to f/8 and 4K video recording up to 60 fps with AF and 9MP still frame grab, Canon EOS 1D X Mark II is a disapointment, both in comparison to the Nikon D5 and as a standalone professional DSLR camera. No auto AF lens micro adjustment as in Nikon D5 (very important especially with the advent of Full Frame Mirrorless cameras such as the Sony a7S Mk II & Sony a7R MkII), 20 linear AF sensors out of 61 in total meaning that the Canon EOS 7D Mark II with its all selectable 65 cross type AF sensors remains the best as far as the total number of selectable cross type AF sensors is concerned while Nikon D5 with its 99 cross type AF sensors is much better at tracking fast erratically moving subjects, at least in theory since neither of these two AF systems have been tested in practise. Thus, since both the Nikon D5 and the Canon EOS 1D X Mark II are specifically targeted towards sports photographers, I believe that the Nikon D5 has a superior AF system for tracking moving subjects as far as still photography is concerned, unless the use of teleconverters brings the maximum lens aperture up to f/8 and/or when even 12 fps aren't enough in order to capture the perfect moment and one is willing to drop resolution to 9MP in order to have 60 fps while has the luxury of spending plenty of time post capture in front of a computer in order to select the perfect moment, in which case the Canon EOS 1D X Mark II with the addition of a much better 4K video recording implementation (duration, AF) becomes the better buy. All in all though, I believe that Canon was way too conservative in its last EOS 1 series body, probably trying to avoid AF issues such as in the recent past by copying Nikon in this instance by keeping essentially the same AF module for another generation, as Nikon did for the last 8 years (D3, D3S, D4, D4S). Canon was just unfortunate that at the time they chose to do so, Nikon brought to the market a radical new AF system which on paper at least looks very impressive while for the last 8 years during which Nikon kept essentially the same AF system, Canon didn't have an equivalent breakthrough. Finally, I would like to say, that both cameras embody the best technology their manufacturers have commercially available at the moment, with each camera strengthening even further the strong points of its manufacturer, either that is the AF algorithm for calculating the future position of a moving subject, low light AF performance, high ISO image quality and battery life in the case of Nikon or AF responsiveness both in lens and in camera body and 4K video implementation in the case of Canon.

I would argue that on paper, Canon's system is still better (except for the -3EV vs -4EV, but I doubt that will hardly make a real world difference). Nikon's AF points are not all user selectable. They have less user selectable points and they are more clustered in the middle of the frame. Also, Canon has double cross type sensors, 5 of them while Nikon has how many?

Nonsense. Everyone knows the only thing that matters is how many AF points the manufacturer counts. Characteristics, quality and usability are irrelevant. More is better!!!!!

:

 

[robm001]

Has there been a preorder/ship date given anywhere?

 

[bseitz234]

Does it support interchangeable focusing screens?

Yes, but it seems still no firmware support for the Ec-S screen.

The full technical details on Northlight agree:

"Ec-C6 provided, can be changed to Ec-A, B or L"

 

[thepancakeman]

Nonsense. Everyone knows the only thing that matters is how many AF points the manufacturer counts. Characteristics, quality and usability are irrelevant. More is better!!!!!

:

So AF points is (are?) the new megapickles? ???

 

[Famateur]

Whatever happened to the recent rumor of Canon's claim 15 stops of DR? So far the presented materials do not seem to have any mentioning of this rumored achievement...

My hunch is that it was related to the 5DIV but got folded into the 1DXII talk...unless it was completely bogus wishful thinking.

 

[wockawocka]

Don't get too excited over Nikons -4 and-5 ev af, in practice it's more like -3 EV. I know my 5DSr focused quicker and more accurately in low light than the D750 with the 85 1.8's on.

Figures are being fudged.

 

[neuroanatomist]

Does it support interchangeable focusing screens?

Yes, but it seems still no firmware support for the Ec-S screen.

The full technical details on Northlight agree:

"Ec-C6 provided, can be changed to Ec-A, B or L"

Same for the 1D X. My point is that the Ec-S is physically compatible (and no doubt will be with the 1D X II), but not an option in firmware, which in practical terms means you need to 'wing it' a bit as far as metering.

 

[Famateur]

Having a touchscreen on all the time with an option to switch it off is non-starter. You would have to remember to disable it prior to shooting or your shots will get messed up.

Not true at all.

20151124_172417 by Jonathan Brady, on Flickr

Camera on the left is a 70D (has a touchscreen). This is the screen most of us see when shooting, no? If you press anywhere on that screen, NOTHING HAPPENS UNTIL you press the bottom left hand corner "Q" button on the screen. Notice how it looks different than the "Q" button on the screen on the 6D (camera on the right which doesn't have a touchscreen)? It's highlighted on the 70D to indicate that THIS is where you press to activate the touchscreen. Once you press that "Q", THEN you can press any of the other parameters on the screen to change them. Press the back button (replaces the "Q") to turn it off.

So, it's fast. You: press Q button, press parameter you want to change, change it, change anything else, press back button. Done. Just like "pinch to zoom" and "pan" within a zoomed picture when reviewing pics, it CAN be faster depending on your setup and the number of changes.

Personally, I don't use the screen to change parameters on my 70D. But I do use it to move through menus as well as pan through zoomed images. And obviously, also for touch-to-focus in video.

Thanks for this. I don't have the 70D so pardon my ignorance.

Doesn't using the Q button and then using fingers for the touchscreen experience slow you down? My typical use with the DSLRs is to grab the body with both hands, use the left thumb for menu/info buttons and the right thumb for operating the wheel and other buttons. I can't imagine what using my fingers for operating the touchscreen would feel like. Can you share your experience on this?

Hi,
I also use my DSLRs this way... all the menu setting I might use is in "My Menu", so touchscreen is not so useful when shooting stills via OVF, but touchscreen is very useful for live view shooting and video shooting.

Anyway, I think most people who had experience in using a DSLR will turn off the screen to save battery power when shooting stills via OVF, so I don't think touchscreen will cause any problem especially when you need to press the 'Q' button first to activate the touchscreen in Canon DSLR.

Have a nice day.

Anyone who has used a 70D would not be bothered by a fully-functional touch screen on the 1DXII. I, for one, would welcome it. It does not interfere with OVF shooting in the slightest.

While it's possible to change settings via touchscreen during OVF shooting, it's really not necessary with the dedicated buttons, top LCD and viewfinder. I think jebrady03 agrees and was just demonstrating that if you want to, you can.

Where the touchscreen shines is in Live View shooting, navigating the menus and reviewing images.

For example, I've been doing a series of on-locations shoots at a Kung Fu studio, capturing poses and actions for various forms and styles, shooting tethered in Live View from a tripod. Some poses are difficult to hold for a camera, and being able to tap the LCD to quickly change the point of focus has been a huge blessing.

I definitely miss the touch screen when shooting other bodies (and the articulating screen, for that matter).

 

[Famateur]

Just a note about touchscreen and all this D5 comparison fluff: According to a D5 preview from one outspoken photography personality on the web, the D5 touchscreen only functions for reviewing images or tapping focus points -- not for navigating menus or changing settings! D'oh!

 

[neuroanatomist]

Just a note about touchscreen and all this D5 comparison fluff: According to a D5 preview from one outspoken photography personality on the web, the D5 touchscreen only functions for reviewing images or tapping focus points -- not for navigating menus or changing settings! D'oh!

Well, with Nikon's byzantine UI, why would they want to make navigation easier?

 

[Famateur]

Just a note about touchscreen and all this D5 comparison fluff: According to a D5 preview from one outspoken photography personality on the web, the D5 touchscreen only functions for reviewing images or tapping focus points -- not for navigating menus or changing settings! D'oh!

Well, with Nikon's byzantine UI, why would they want to make navigation easier?

LOL! Yeah...

I do love the Canon menu system. Just another factor (among many) beyond low ISO dynamic range that make Canons a good fit for me...

 

[Jopa]

Very impressive specs. So where do we pre-order?

 

[jebrady03]

Having a touchscreen on all the time with an option to switch it off is non-starter. You would have to remember to disable it prior to shooting or your shots will get messed up.

Not true at all.

20151124_172417 by Jonathan Brady, on Flickr

Camera on the left is a 70D (has a touchscreen). This is the screen most of us see when shooting, no? If you press anywhere on that screen, NOTHING HAPPENS UNTIL you press the bottom left hand corner "Q" button on the screen. Notice how it looks different than the "Q" button on the screen on the 6D (camera on the right which doesn't have a touchscreen)? It's highlighted on the 70D to indicate that THIS is where you press to activate the touchscreen. Once you press that "Q", THEN you can press any of the other parameters on the screen to change them. Press the back button (replaces the "Q") to turn it off.

So, it's fast. You: press Q button, press parameter you want to change, change it, change anything else, press back button. Done. Just like "pinch to zoom" and "pan" within a zoomed picture when reviewing pics, it CAN be faster depending on your setup and the number of changes.

Personally, I don't use the screen to change parameters on my 70D. But I do use it to move through menus as well as pan through zoomed images. And obviously, also for touch-to-focus in video.

Thanks for this. I don't have the 70D so pardon my ignorance.

Doesn't using the Q button and then using fingers for the touchscreen experience slow you down? My typical use with the DSLRs is to grab the body with both hands, use the left thumb for menu/info buttons and the right thumb for operating the wheel and other buttons. I can't imagine what using my fingers for operating the touchscreen would feel like. Can you share your experience on this?

Hi,
I also use my DSLRs this way... all the menu setting I might use is in "My Menu", so touchscreen is not so useful when shooting stills via OVF, but touchscreen is very useful for live view shooting and video shooting.

Anyway, I think most people who had experience in using a DSLR will turn off the screen to save battery power when shooting stills via OVF, so I don't think touchscreen will cause any problem especially when you need to press the 'Q' button first to activate the touchscreen in Canon DSLR.

Have a nice day.

Anyone who has used a 70D would not be bothered by a fully-functional touch screen on the 1DXII. I, for one, would welcome it. It does not interfere with OVF shooting in the slightest.

While it's possible to change settings via touchscreen during OVF shooting, it's really not necessary with the dedicated buttons, top LCD and viewfinder. I think jebrady03 agrees and was just demonstrating that if you want to, you can.

Where the touchscreen shines is in Live View shooting, navigating the menus and reviewing images.

For example, I've been doing a series of on-locations shoots at a Kung Fu studio, capturing poses and actions for various forms and styles, shooting tethered in Live View from a tripod. Some poses are difficult to hold for a camera, and being able to tap the LCD to quickly change the point of focus has been a huge blessing.

I definitely miss the touch screen when shooting other bodies (and the articulating screen, for that matter).

Yes, Famateur, that is EXACTLY how I use it and I agree wholeheartedly. In other words, Canon's implementation of the touchscreen and their UI makes it impossible for the touchscreen to screw up the user experience and it can only leave it the same, or enhance it.

Rahul, it doesn't slow you down, it can't. I use a combination of buttons and the touchscreen for my tasks. It's important to remember that use of the touchscreen doesn't deactivate the on-camera buttons. A person can use whichever they prefer. That's why I say it CAN'T slow you down. Use whatever you think is faster.

For me, if I'm adjusting SS, Aperture, ISO, basically anything with a dedicated button/wheel, I use the button/wheel. If I'm navigating the menu, I'll press the menu button (I actually use the set button for quick access to the menu which is almost always on "My Menu" [thanks Canon for bringing me back to the last used screen - unlike some other manufacturers who start you back at the beginning!]). Since my right thumb is already hovering over the "Set" button (and thus, hovering over the directional pad), if I'm using something in the My Menu screen, I'll just use the directional pad to get to it and select it with the "Set" button. If I'm navigating within the menus and it's one or two clicks away, or I can't remember where it is, I'll use the directional pad, if I'm moving across multiple menu screens, I'll just touch the screen and select the menu, then touch the option. Sometimes I'll combine the two. Use the D-pad to move over one menu and then touch the screen to select the option I want and then dive in even further using the touchscreen.

When reviewing images, I still tend to use the D-pad and wheel around it to scroll through images because I simply can't swipe as fast with my finger as I can press a button or rotate a wheel (especially to get across multiple images). However, I do use un-pinch to zoom in and pinch to zoom out and then press the screen and hold it and move it around to scan the image. That's DEFINITELY faster with a touchscreen.

So honestly, I don't use it much. But it's there when I want it.

Again, for liveview shooting or video, the touchscreen is a no-brainer and I can't believe they omitted it from the 7D Mark II, especially given that it has DPAF. Talk about DUMB. I mean SERIOUSLY dumb. The only reason I can possibly imagine is to try and force SOME people into a 1DX Mark II but I can't imagine that would be many people. If they care about 4K, they won't buy the 7D Mark II for video anyway and if they don't care about 4K, they can just buy a 70D in addition to the 7D. *shrug* :-\

 

[ritholtz]

Just a note about touchscreen and all this D5 comparison fluff: According to a D5 preview from one outspoken photography personality on the web, the D5 touchscreen only functions for reviewing images or tapping focus points -- not for navigating menus or changing settings! D'oh!

Some one mentioned this in DPR in their D5 and D500 pushing the boundaries article. ;D
It has touch screen which doesn't work always.
It has lot of AF points most of them non selectable for users.
It has 4k video without proper Servo AF. Still doing CDAF no PDAF/DPAF.
I think all these cameras are amazing tools. I am going to wait for 6D2 with DPAF sensor.

 

[Rahul]

Having a touchscreen on all the time with an option to switch it off is non-starter. You would have to remember to disable it prior to shooting or your shots will get messed up.

Not true at all.

20151124_172417 by Jonathan Brady, on Flickr

Camera on the left is a 70D (has a touchscreen). This is the screen most of us see when shooting, no? If you press anywhere on that screen, NOTHING HAPPENS UNTIL you press the bottom left hand corner "Q" button on the screen. Notice how it looks different than the "Q" button on the screen on the 6D (camera on the right which doesn't have a touchscreen)? It's highlighted on the 70D to indicate that THIS is where you press to activate the touchscreen. Once you press that "Q", THEN you can press any of the other parameters on the screen to change them. Press the back button (replaces the "Q") to turn it off.

So, it's fast. You: press Q button, press parameter you want to change, change it, change anything else, press back button. Done. Just like "pinch to zoom" and "pan" within a zoomed picture when reviewing pics, it CAN be faster depending on your setup and the number of changes.

Personally, I don't use the screen to change parameters on my 70D. But I do use it to move through menus as well as pan through zoomed images. And obviously, also for touch-to-focus in video.

Thanks for this. I don't have the 70D so pardon my ignorance.

Doesn't using the Q button and then using fingers for the touchscreen experience slow you down? My typical use with the DSLRs is to grab the body with both hands, use the left thumb for menu/info buttons and the right thumb for operating the wheel and other buttons. I can't imagine what using my fingers for operating the touchscreen would feel like. Can you share your experience on this?

Hi,
I also use my DSLRs this way... all the menu setting I might use is in "My Menu", so touchscreen is not so useful when shooting stills via OVF, but touchscreen is very useful for live view shooting and video shooting.

Anyway, I think most people who had experience in using a DSLR will turn off the screen to save battery power when shooting stills via OVF, so I don't think touchscreen will cause any problem especially when you need to press the 'Q' button first to activate the touchscreen in Canon DSLR.

Have a nice day.

Anyone who has used a 70D would not be bothered by a fully-functional touch screen on the 1DXII. I, for one, would welcome it. It does not interfere with OVF shooting in the slightest.

While it's possible to change settings via touchscreen during OVF shooting, it's really not necessary with the dedicated buttons, top LCD and viewfinder. I think jebrady03 agrees and was just demonstrating that if you want to, you can.

Where the touchscreen shines is in Live View shooting, navigating the menus and reviewing images.

For example, I've been doing a series of on-locations shoots at a Kung Fu studio, capturing poses and actions for various forms and styles, shooting tethered in Live View from a tripod. Some poses are difficult to hold for a camera, and being able to tap the LCD to quickly change the point of focus has been a huge blessing.

I definitely miss the touch screen when shooting other bodies (and the articulating screen, for that matter).

Yes, Famateur, that is EXACTLY how I use it and I agree wholeheartedly. In other words, Canon's implementation of the touchscreen and their UI makes it impossible for the touchscreen to screw up the user experience and it can only leave it the same, or enhance it.

Rahul, it doesn't slow you down, it can't. I use a combination of buttons and the touchscreen for my tasks. It's important to remember that use of the touchscreen doesn't deactivate the on-camera buttons. A person can use whichever they prefer. That's why I say it CAN'T slow you down. Use whatever you think is faster.

For me, if I'm adjusting SS, Aperture, ISO, basically anything with a dedicated button/wheel, I use the button/wheel. If I'm navigating the menu, I'll press the menu button (I actually use the set button for quick access to the menu which is almost always on "My Menu" [thanks Canon for bringing me back to the last used screen - unlike some other manufacturers who start you back at the beginning!]). Since my right thumb is already hovering over the "Set" button (and thus, hovering over the directional pad), if I'm using something in the My Menu screen, I'll just use the directional pad to get to it and select it with the "Set" button. If I'm navigating within the menus and it's one or two clicks away, or I can't remember where it is, I'll use the directional pad, if I'm moving across multiple menu screens, I'll just touch the screen and select the menu, then touch the option. Sometimes I'll combine the two. Use the D-pad to move over one menu and then touch the screen to select the option I want and then dive in even further using the touchscreen.

When reviewing images, I still tend to use the D-pad and wheel around it to scroll through images because I simply can't swipe as fast with my finger as I can press a button or rotate a wheel (especially to get across multiple images). However, I do use un-pinch to zoom in and pinch to zoom out and then press the screen and hold it and move it around to scan the image. That's DEFINITELY faster with a touchscreen.

So honestly, I don't use it much. But it's there when I want it.

Again, for liveview shooting or video, the touchscreen is a no-brainer and I can't believe they omitted it from the 7D Mark II, especially given that it has DPAF. Talk about DUMB. I mean SERIOUSLY dumb. The only reason I can possibly imagine is to try and force SOME people into a 1DX Mark II but I can't imagine that would be many people. If they care about 4K, they won't buy the 7D Mark II for video anyway and if they don't care about 4K, they can just buy a 70D in addition to the 7D. *shrug* :-\

Thanks! I agree that touchscreen AF is always a big positive for LV shooting - and that's the way it seems to have been implemented in the 1dx2.

My original comment was in response to a member who wanted the touchscreen to be active and available for everything, ranting that the implementation in the 1dx2 fo LV shooting was a fail.

 

[[email protected]]

Diffraction Correction - huh?

The thing I'm surprised more people haven't been curious ever since it appeared on a rumor a couple weeks ago is "diffraction correction."

Firstly, Canon has never done it before (according to the release). Looking it up on the web, it appears a couple secondary camera companies have attempted this, and it gave them about one extra stop of ISO before things got fudgy. There was debate as to whether that was at all useful relative to simple sharpening.

Interestingly, Canon, in its recent release, says that it effectively cancels diffraction - and doesn't limit that statement to any number of stops. That is a wild, wild claim. If true, it is one of the more interesting technologies introduced to cameras in recent years.

It is not clear to me if this tech applies to RAW, or if its results appear only with in-camera processed JPGs.

I'm a bit at a loss as to how this can even physically be done, but obviously it's not science fiction if other companies have been toying with it already. Perhaps the microlenses are employed to calculate the wave patterns that light create in the small apertures and the processor uses math to adjust light values where it senses where the waves would build on top of each other, etc.

Then again, maybe I'm reading the release incorrectly, and Canon is not claiming to have effectively eliminated diffraction fully. Anyone have any technical insight or references to Canon's approach or effectiveness claims?