Disappointed with Canon?

[Ubi]

Hi, I'm a long time follower of this site and I want to use it to express my disappointment to Canon about their current range of DSLRs.

I've been using exclusively Canon digital SLRs for the past ten years and have a collection of L glass to use with my 5D. Recently I've been given some Nikon kit to play with by my college and I believe the D700 and D3s blow away anything that Canon has in the market place. Add to that Canon's absence from the mirrorless and pellicle markets and I wonder what's going on, or not, at big red. Getting rid of a mirror on a trapeze flapping about is a significant and logical development but Canon seems stuck in the past.

I'm not alone in my group in saying that if we don't hear of developments from Canon in new markets soon we're going to move to a combination of Nikon and Panasonic and hang the expense. If we're forced to do that it will take massive technological innovation to persuade us to sell up again and come back to Canon.

 

[Gothmoth]

oh please not another nikon user who pretend to be a canon user.

believe the D700 and D3s blow away anything that Canon has in the market place

yeah sure.. ;D then sell your L glas and switch to nikon.

honest when you are unable to produce great images with a 5D or 5D MK2 then you should think about switching your hobby/job not camera brands.

for me image quality is top priority.
nikon has nothing better then the 5D MK2 when it comes to image quality.

Getting rid of a mirror on a trapeze flapping about is a significant and logical development but Canon seems stuck in the past

for hobbyist maybe.... as a professionell photographer i wait until the electronic viewfinder is at least as good as the optical..... and that will need another few years.

canon is sure working on it.
but as long as it is not up to their standards you will not see such things.

honest... i don´t see people who make money with photography talking about such nonsense. only hobbists with to much time at their hands. go out and shot pictures.

 

[kubelik]

ubi ... you do understand nikon isn't using pellicle mirrors either? that's purely a sony thing right now. you're complaining in two opposite directions at the same time.

I haven't seen any EVF that makes me want to stop using the 5DII's huge pentaprism.

I agree that the AF on the D700 is vastly superior to the 5DII's, but beyond that, there's little else to seriously differentiate the two in terms of real shooting ... and to me, having the ability to record HD video on the 5DII totally outweighs the AF concessions (I grant that's a very personal decision and your mileage may vary)

 

[leGreve]

I gotta stick with Gothmoth... with the posibility of being ridiculed, I worked professionally full time with commercial photography and when we're not shooting Hasselblad or Sinar with Phase One backs, we are using Canons. A las we have not yet upgraded the 1ds mkii but my private 5d ii is just dandy. Fine image quality and so on and I even managed to pull off 3 serious music videos with it (hat off to the editor hehe)

I can see what people mean about the AF in the 5d ii, but frankly I couldn't care less. I'd rather stick to manual focus for those in between model jobs.

There's nothing more to this that Canon being thorough and once they whip out the next generation Nikon fanbois will be quiet for a while. One side is always ahead for a brief periode, nothing new in that.

And stating that you are directly disappointed with Canon bewilders me... and I gotta give Gothmoth right, you do sound a bit like a hobbyist, but I'd look past that since its probably you guys who are the bread and butter of Canon, I just don't agree with you... at all.

 

[realmike15]

Hah. OP is trying to create a buzz around his opinion.

Truth is, I've tried to be a Nikon shooter on more than one occasion... but honestly I find their Controls poorly designed and laid out, their Viewfinders dull and dark, their image quality to be below Canon's, and their overall design to be clunky and odd. I have no problem if you like Nikon, my dad is a Nikon shooter. But in my (and many) people's minds, the slight benefits of Nikons AF Performance or slightly less ISO noise are not enough to out weight the fact that Canon trumps them two-folder in almost every other area.

Please don't make vague posts about how you think Canon is making less innovative cameras than Nikon and just switch if you feel that way. I can assure you though, your opinion is a that of a very small minority.

 

[nk414]

...Add to that Canon's absence from the mirrorless and pellicle markets and I wonder what's going on, or not, at big red.

Any smart company will not announce any new technology that might hurt their sales.

 

[gio91ber]

well I admit I have only used cheap cameras (I own a Canon 1000D) but I also have to admit that I don't really like current eos lineup. Their bodies are poorly designed (both in terms of aestethics and in ergonomics) and I think that the first eos cameras released (eos 650, which I own too) were much better designed (also testing high-level current eos cameras in shops).
I've also tried shooting with nikon and, although i hate their commands and buttons (totally unusable if you're shootin'), I found them much more ergonomic and less plasticky, also they're much more snappy. I'm sad to admit this as I'm engaged in a sort of war against a nikon fanboy who lent me his d90 in order to "convert me" (i've not tried the d90 only but also a d40 a d60 and a d300).
Also in terms of image quality I found nikon's much better as it tends to remove the noise leaving a sort of "film grain" which is better but this is only an opinion.
what do you think about nikon cameras, in general (leaving at home your canon fanboys attitude)?

 

[JRSJ]

My girlfriend is a Nikon shooter. I get to play around with her D300s, and her 60mm Macro. What I've found is:

Nikon CLS is awesome.
iTTL produces more neutral exposures w/ flash.
Ergonomics are more intuitive.
Analog controls for basic camera functions are easier to adjust. (Verus diving into submenus via LCD.)
The high ISO grain is more film like. (on FullFrame Nikons, 1.5 crop is pretty noisy after 400 iso)
Nikon pro lens construction is pretty sweet.
Love the shutter/mirror slap. Less snappy and more "crunchy".
Rubber grips are more grippy.

If I was looking to get into photography right now -- and I did my research -- I would go for a Nikon system. That could change in a few months. Both companies like to leapfrog each other, but it seems Nikon is doing extra hurdles.

Not to say Canon hasn't been amazing -- its just that Nikon has had more time to consolidate their camera line up. Canon is in a transitionary phase, and are faced with pressure on multiple fronts.

If I were to write Canon, I would say:

1) If EVIL cameras do become the new consumer market, I propose moving the Rebel line to it. The Rebel brand carries enormous weight, and could be enough to sway consumers from buying other brands EVIL cameras.
2) Allow the xxD line to become Consumer DSLR line (Similar to the D90/D7000)
3) Let the XD line grow, eventually the 1Ds will have so many MP that they could mask off the sensor to 1.3 crop (thus consolidating the 1D / 1Ds line into one.)
4) Develop HD video to 4K video. Its would be a major selling feature, and not to be overlooked.
5) Standardize AF/Metering systems in the xD line. It would be nice for professionals to have consistent operation of their gear.


I'm sure there is more...

JRSJ

 

[gio91ber]

totally agree with jrsj... if canon won't make cheap models a bit more consistent I'll probably move to nikon (the only disappointing thing about nikon is the price of their lenses: always expensive)

 

[ariffoto]

Between doing my photography and selling cameras i think people give canon a bad rap. Both brands, nikon and canon, are great camera companies. They both have their strong points. However saying that i love canon. I was thinking of switching to nikon but when i started to play with the nikons i found canon easier to work with.
People complain about the noise but lets take a look at lets say the canon 7D vs nikon d300s. The compaint is about the noise but lets look at whats really amaizing with the 7d. it has 18mp vs 12mp. canon manages to bring down the noise to comparable levels. Personally i think thats an amaizing feet. Another thing people tend to complain about is the lack of autofocusing points. Well i don't know about you but i find they can cause problems with accuracy when you have too many. I preffer using one point even when shooting widlife or action. I have even heard by nikon users that they don't use all the points on the d300s. To top it off we can tweak our cameras to make them work to the way we want them to.
As for the mirroless cameras why complain, nikon doesn't have one so why care if canon doesn't have one.
At the end of the day its what you feel comfortable with and what your eye prefers.

 

[Rocky]

Between doing my photography and selling cameras i think people give canon a bad rap. Both brands, nikon and canon, are great camera companies. They both have their strong points. However saying that i love canon. I was thinking of switching to nikon but when i started to play with the nikons i found canon easier to work with.
People complain about the noise but lets take a look at lets say the canon 7D vs nikon d300s. The compaint is about the noise but lets look at whats really amaizing with the 7d. it has 18mp vs 12mp. canon manages to bring down the noise to comparable levels. Personally i think thats an amaizing feet. Another thing people tend to complain about is the lack of autofocusing points. Well i don't know about you but i find they can cause problems with accuracy when you have too many. I preffer using one point even when shooting widlife or action. I have even heard by nikon users that they don't use all the points on the d300s. To top it off we can tweak our cameras to make them work to the way we want them to.
As for the mirroless cameras why complain, nikon doesn't have one so why care if canon doesn't have one.
At the end of the day its what you feel comfortable with and what your eye prefers.

Well said. Camera is a personal choice. It is always a take or ive. We can always sinle out one aprticular feature and says "A" is better than "B". But when we look at 'A" and "B" as a complete package (including price), It is a tough call to say which is better than which.
As for mirrorless, Even the excutives in Canon admitted that the technology is not here yet. So why should Canon make a inferior product just to claim a "ME Too".

 

[justicend]

why one with get disappointed by whole company, if he/she is using certain model. It's matter of complaining about particular product. If you are not satisfied with the product then why you bought it without doing some research. I got my first DSLR canon 60D. Whatever review says on the internet, I decided to go with 60D because 550D was little small and has no LCD on the top. And talking about 7D,it's expensive. So 60D is the choice for me. Sometimes picture I take is better than sample picture on the internet. I use kit lens and 50mm 1.8 It's perfect for me for taking family pictures and shooting around. Nikon is like alien to me, I never used one.
The tool I am familiar with is what I love.

I bet only pro and serious photographer use 1Ds and 5D, but who shouts on the internet forums only talks about the tool which they never use. It's different when you hear from others and use yourself, It really makes difference.

 

[JagCanonist]

I'm a owner of a Eos 5D Mkll .
And i have been happy with my Camera IF:

It have been a bit faster(6fps or more).
Have been better quality on the house
(My back to Canon with bad grip,hard to get it right,but now okay,not perfect)
If AF have been better in low light,and abit more safe.(Always hard to thrust)
If Flash have work as on 550D,60D & 7D
If JPEG's have been good as Nikon's (Now i need RAW and much time ,sadly)
If "Auto Lighting Optimizer"have work.
If movie also have 50fps and 60fps .

I had some Canon Eos lenses from before,thats the main reason to why i buy this camera and not Nikon's D700 ("Only"12Mpix) or Sony A900 (Much noise from Iso 400 AND ugly as hell,Sorry!).
This was late 2008,and now 5 lenses later i still wonder if it will be anoying to use 2 diffrent system?
I'm still a fan of Canon,but how long?
If my next Camera still will be a Canon? ,.....thats not sure,but i will never order a Canon camera again before several test have been done,and most important,i have feel it in my hands.
I dont thrust the quality of Canon products ,after my sad 5D Mark II.
But i will probebly not change my camera until 2012-13 ,and than maybe Canon is back on the top??
(Now it's hard to belive that Canon ever will be the "Dream" again,but how knows)


Sorry for my bad English.
/JK

 

[Macadameane]

It have been a bit faster(6fps or more).
Have been better quality on the house
(My back to Canon with bad grip,hard to get it right,but now okay,not perfect)
If AF have been better in low light,and abit more safe.(Always hard to thrust)
If Flash have work as on 550D,60D & 7D
If JPEG's have been good as Nikon's (Now i need RAW and much time ,sadly)
If "Auto Lighting Optimizer"have work.
If movie also have 50fps and 60fps .

Its a little noisier (not much), but it sounds like you should just sell your 5D mk ii and get a 7D. Seems like you would be happier with it.

 

[richy]

erm canon made pellicle cameras years ago, long before sony!

There are several big players in the market, theyre all doing things their own way. This way we get a choice. If you don't like canon go buy nikon or sony or olympus. All make great products with a different approach. For me canon pays my bills along with mamiya. YMMV but plenty of people are happy with canon and their cameras. The d700 is a great camera, very responsive, but around half the MP of a 5d2. You pays your money and makes your choice. As a wedding tog you can (for about the same price) take 2x d700 or a 5d2 & 7d. I don't think there is one clear choice there, but both make very compelling options.

Mirrorless is fine for carrying around for a giggle but it isn't for pro work yet. Fuji have made an interesting sensor with phase detect built in which has to be the way forward for mirrorless. Pellicles, well lets see how that pans out, the sony's look interesting and might be worth a try but canon wouldn't be where they are if they made junk. They just chose to take a different route. Just because a camera isn't right for you doesn't make it bad, just means it was meant for someone else.

 

[DoesNotFollow]

I can't help if you feel like switching to Nikon, but I'd be more than happy to help you with all of your L glass that you won't be needing anymore.

 

[RuneL]

As Richy says, Canon made pellicle cameras over 40 years ago. Tried again in the 90'es, but somehow they failed. There are numerous reasons why, and those who don't know their history are bound to repeat it etc. It's a sales gimmick for now, IMO.

Canon, no, I'm not dissapointed. I was very disappointed in the 1D MK III, it gave me little or no reason to upgrade, so i stuck with the 1D II. The IV is a different story, lives up to my every expactation
I'm not much for companies putting more and more mindless gadgets into their cameras, I need it to work and to take pictures in a reliable manner.
Who has the edge over the other varies (canon/Nikon), but I'm not selling all my stuff because of some sort of weird disappointment in what exactley? Bad image quality in the 5DII? Compared to the D700? Really? I think not.
I love the D700, I'm blown away by it, and would, was I getting a full frame that isn't a 1Ds, get that over the 5D because of it's speed and AF- the 5DII is awful and slow in more than one way.

I use my camera at ISO's that were, to me, a few years ago unimaginable. Shooting usable indoor corporate stuff at ISO 3000 and above is just amazing

But I agrree on the noise, the luma of the Nijon looks nicer than Canons chroma.

 

[zsolex]

Hi,

could someone give positive and negative feelings with the following cameras?
Canon 7D(EF-S 15-85 IS USM) - Nikon D300s(AF-S 16-85mm G ED VR)
The Canon has more noise in low ISO rates but in higher ISO rates is better than the d300s.
The Canon USM lens are faster than the Nikon AF-S series.
The D300s colors are closer to the reality, the Canon is a little bit reddish.
Which AF system is better? I mean speed and accurency, low light performence? The Canon AF sensor sensitivity in the center are from F2.8 and the others F5.6. In the nikon system are all from F2.8?
OK, the Nikon has more AF points.. and the Nikon can make 3D tracking. Canon?
As I heard if you use auto AF you can also use the manual focus ring. Is it true? In the Nikon system is it possible to manualy corrigate the AF in auto mode or it kills the AF motor?
The Nikon TTL produces more neutral exposures w/ flash?

thnx,

Zs

 

[S P]

I think I must be like the only person that's switched FROM Nikon TO Canon this year, and even more crazy that I've been completely happy with the switch! lol Nikon and I just weren't getting along. I'm much much happier with the Canon system and have no regrets whatsoever, even in light of all of the great new kit that Nikon has come out with this year. If anything, it's only reinforced my decision.

I got a 5D2 and have the 17-40L, 24-105L, a 70-200/4L non-IS, and a few other tidbits. I like the controls a lot better since I can get to everything with one hand, Nikon still doesn't have a lightweight and low-cost 70-200mm lens with an f/4 aperture. They force you to decide between too slow f/5.6 lenses and too big and heavy f/2.8 monsters and I just couldn't live with that. I sold my Nikon 70-200mm f/2.8 VR lens and picked up the Canon 70-200mm f/4L non-IS (I never used VR/IS on that lens anyways), like the Canon f/4 a whole lot better, and the difference in price paid for half of the 5D2 body!

I can't go anywhere on the Internet without hearing about how horrible and lousy Canon's AF system is, *especially* in the 5D2, and yet I've had absolutely no issues keeping things in focus even with fast moving subjects in less than favorable lighting conditions. My only complaint is that the AF does quit a bit before the Nikons in low light, but I've only run into that situation once in 6 months.

The high-res is great when I need it. 21MP resolves things that 12MP just won't, and Nikon forces you all the way up to a $7500 D3x to get that resolution at this point. The extra res also means I can just get by with only a 200mm lens and crop a little when needed. Nikon's JPEG processing probably is a little bit better and their cameras don't seem to have the low ISO noise issues that I occasionally get on Canons, but there's workarounds for that or just shoot RAW. Canon's included software also works a LOT better than Nikon's does, and it's free. Can't beat that.

Anyways, completely happy with Canon and glad I made the switch.

 

[Haydn1971]

Don't get hung up on the details - go to the best camera shop in your town in the week, look for someone that looks knowledgable, then pester them to play with both for a while... I suspect you will fall into one or the other within a few minutes...

I say go in the week, because the shop will be less busy with weekend camera gift buyers... Do you have a DSLR now ? Are you tied into a brand yet because of your existing lenses, flash etc ?