Canon EOS 7D Mark II in 2014 [CR2]

kaihp

I'm not new here
Mar 19, 2012
854
6
schill said:
If you actually read my post, my example was dropping down from 14 to 12 fps - not increasing it. And if you think it "might" be possible to add "more high ISO" why "might" it not be possible to reduce fps from 14 to 12?

The whole point of my post, which I think is completely lost by now, was that if anything can be done at "the last minute" - and I did not define when that was - it is to remove or reduce features that are enabled/controlled in the firmware as opposed to in hardware. It is typically (although not always) easier to remove functionality rather than add it. In fact, you can leave functionality in place and just remove the menu option that turns it on and off in some cases.
Please see Don's point about printing manuals. Menu spelling errors (like in the Info boxes) could be changed without having to change manuals. Depending on how paranoid you are, you could/could not do without V&V on the changed firmware.
 

garyknrd

Birding
Nov 16, 2012
168
0
67
Thailand, Texas
www.birdsthatfart.com
Looks like a few different company's are going to market pretty soon. Pentax is suppose to have a new one, Nikon I am sure will. Sony might. I am looking forward to the coming year. I will be in crop heaven. I will probably never have a FF camera. Not in the plans what so ever.
 

Krob78

When in Doubt, Press the Shutter...
Aug 8, 2012
1,455
9
The Florida Peninsula
I like the specs. I just pre ordered my EOS 7D Mk II. Can't wait to get it out in the field with my 5D Mk III and get back to enjoying the good life, 5d in one hand, 7d in the other... Should be a great combination and the Fastest canon in the west... ;)

I like the September/October announcement and Spring 2014 release date... 8)
 

Marsu42

Canon Pride.
Feb 7, 2012
6,316
0
Berlin
der-tierfotograf.de
expatinasia said:
Is the 5D pro? Canon officially classifies it as prosumer, and while a lot of pros do use it, I am not sure if it fits into that category.
You can see what's pro and what's not by looking at the European CPS program that qualifies products into 3
categories. 1d/5d2/5d3 = platinum (pro), 6d = silver (consumer): https://cps.canon-europe.com/Public/QualifyingProducts

unfocused said:
While it is unrealistic to suggest that Canon (or Nikon) can completely and quickly revise a product based on what their competitor does, it is also unrealistic to suggest that the companies don't react and respond to each others' releases.
It would be really interesting to have more insight into their development process:

My guess that Canon has lots of patents (see all the lens [cr] here] and semi-finished products, but all w/o final optimization stages and production streamlining. If so, they can react fairly quickly, they just take parts from other products or open the drawer, pull out the blueprints and take some month to produce them. Proof seems to be the 6d, they conjured that up out of thin air just to sidestep Nikon's d600 while not endangering the 5d3.
 

pedro

EOS 6D MK II
Jul 21, 2010
1,015
0
dilbert said:
About the only thing that I could see them adding "late" would be "more high ISO" that is really noisy.
As I am not involved in software programming, how does that work, if a camera manufacturer sees the necestiy to crank up the ISO? Sorry for my ignorance in so many tech related things...
 

jrista

EOL
Dec 3, 2011
5,341
24
jonrista.com
pedro said:
dilbert said:
About the only thing that I could see them adding "late" would be "more high ISO" that is really noisy.
As I am not involved in software programming, how does that work, if a camera manufacturer sees the necestiy to crank up the ISO? Sorry for my ignorance in so many tech related things...
I am not sure that is just purely a software thing. There is firmware involved, but that firmware is really instructing the hardware to do something, and if the hardware is incapable, then I don't think just a firmware update will do it. When it comes to ISO, the firmware is really instructing the hardware to use a different gain. I don't really know enough about electronics at that scale to know definitively if the hardware explicitly needs to support a specific analog gain, but I am willing to bet that it is more complicated than a "simple" firmware update to, say, add a native ISO 25600 to a camera that previously only supported ISO 12800. I bet the hardware needs to support it first.

I am not sure if a digital sensor would be the same. Exmor, which does pretty much everything except the initial pixel read digitally (bits, rather than charge)...so it might be easier to simply add a higher ISO setting with Exmor via just a firmware update than it would be for any other sensor.
 
H

hmmm

Guest
Cory said:
Do you think that there might be a Rebel to follow that'll have the 7DII sensor? If so I wonder if that might be my upgrade from a T1i.
My guess is that the next Rebel will have the sensor from the 70D. Sometime in mid-2014.

If the 7D mkII has a next-gen sensor architecture, it would not make it to the Rebels until two generations from now, is my guess. That would make it 2015. That would give Canon time to deploy next-gen sensor architecture to pro models and perhaps even the 80D before it trickles down to the Rebel level.
 

schill

EOS T7i
Dec 7, 2012
90
0
kaihp said:
schill said:
If you actually read my post, my example was dropping down from 14 to 12 fps - not increasing it. And if you think it "might" be possible to add "more high ISO" why "might" it not be possible to reduce fps from 14 to 12?

The whole point of my post, which I think is completely lost by now, was that if anything can be done at "the last minute" - and I did not define when that was - it is to remove or reduce features that are enabled/controlled in the firmware as opposed to in hardware. It is typically (although not always) easier to remove functionality rather than add it. In fact, you can leave functionality in place and just remove the menu option that turns it on and off in some cases.
Please see Don's point about printing manuals. Menu spelling errors (like in the Info boxes) could be changed without having to change manuals. Depending on how paranoid you are, you could/could not do without V&V on the changed firmware.
I have read and understood Don's post. I even replied to it and agreed with him:

I agree. I never said it could be done in a month.

Anyway, I was thinking "last minute before they commit to the final design/configuration [1]" and not "last minute before I walk into B&H and pick one up."

[1] after which they would print manuals/boxes, etc.
I don't expect Canon to change the specs right before I can buy the camera, but I believe that there are some things (like the changes in firmware I have mentioned) that they can do right up to the point where they print manuals or make an official announcement of the specs or something else of that nature (whatever comes first). Until then, they can do whatever they want and I believe that some things are relatively easy to change.
 

ddashti

EOS 80D
Mar 27, 2012
144
0
This is good news, but it's just a downer to have to wait that long.
The bigger the improvements, the better it'll be, though.
 

kevl

EOS 80D
Sep 12, 2011
105
0
Don Haines said:
kevl said:
Don Haines said:
It is about time 40 megapixels became the new normal for DSLR's..... Progress marches on....
I don't know any pros who want a 40MP camera as their primary body. It may be nice for specific jobs but it will simply cost me money in harddrive space, and backup costs, for my Wedding and Portrait business model. The largest prints I normally sell are 24x36. My 5D3 eats up enough space as it is. A friend of mine shoots sports professionally with a 1D MkIIn with 8.2MP and he has no issues.

If I need to make large prints I enlarge the image in Photoshop, and this just got even better with Photoshop CC. For most businesses we don't need, or even want, a large MP camera.

I'd like to have it for play time, but I'm a long way away from ever paying the price of a pro body to get large MP to play with.

Anyway, I'd LIKE to have 40MP for cropping freedom... I just wouldn't want to have to pay for the harddrive space.
Hard drives..... Time marches on there too....

First hard drive I bought for work was $10,000 for a 10 megabyte drive.... Last week I bought 24 4terrabyte drives at $250 each.... That's 100 terabytes for $6000..... Quite a drop in price per byte.... This is 7 orders of magnitude... That's like buying a mansion in 1980 for $1,000,000.00 and in 2013 buying a better mansion for $0.06

LOL this is going to be rude... and your point is?

If you're spending that much on harddrives for your photography business and you want a large megapixel camera you're dealing with the wrong company here. You should visit http://www.hasselbladusa.com/
 

RVB

1DX
Oct 18, 2012
84
0
Sabaki said:
I got a question please guys.

Most photographers I know don't put much stock into the number of megapixels, often citing printing size as the sole benefit.

Is this true? Is there really nothing else to megapixels other than printing size?
Not true,higher res files look sharper,you can crop them and also down sample for a cleaner superior file..,only real downside is large file's and high res sensor's are more demanding on the glass...
 

Don Haines

Beware of cats with laser eyes!
Jun 4, 2012
8,252
1,878
Canada
kevl said:
Don Haines said:
kevl said:
Don Haines said:
It is about time 40 megapixels became the new normal for DSLR's..... Progress marches on....
I don't know any pros who want a 40MP camera as their primary body. It may be nice for specific jobs but it will simply cost me money in harddrive space, and backup costs, for my Wedding and Portrait business model. The largest prints I normally sell are 24x36. My 5D3 eats up enough space as it is. A friend of mine shoots sports professionally with a 1D MkIIn with 8.2MP and he has no issues.

If I need to make large prints I enlarge the image in Photoshop, and this just got even better with Photoshop CC. For most businesses we don't need, or even want, a large MP camera.

I'd like to have it for play time, but I'm a long way away from ever paying the price of a pro body to get large MP to play with.

Anyway, I'd LIKE to have 40MP for cropping freedom... I just wouldn't want to have to pay for the harddrive space.
Hard drives..... Time marches on there too....

First hard drive I bought for work was $10,000 for a 10 megabyte drive.... Last week I bought 24 4terrabyte drives at $250 each.... That's 100 terabytes for $6000..... Quite a drop in price per byte.... This is 7 orders of magnitude... That's like buying a mansion in 1980 for $1,000,000.00 and in 2013 buying a better mansion for $0.06

LOL this is going to be rude... and your point is?

If you're spending that much on harddrives for your photography business and you want a large megapixel camera you're dealing with the wrong company here. You should visit http://www.hasselbladusa.com/
Last year I bought about 600 hard drives for work.... Data logging, not photography. That would be a LOT of photos :)

My work (that keeps the food on the table) is in a research lab.

My point about hard drive capacity and price is that storage capacities have skyrocketed and prices have plummeted. Cost of storage is so low now that it is almost free.
 

jrista

EOL
Dec 3, 2011
5,341
24
jonrista.com
Don Haines said:
kevl said:
Don Haines said:
kevl said:
Don Haines said:
It is about time 40 megapixels became the new normal for DSLR's..... Progress marches on....
I don't know any pros who want a 40MP camera as their primary body. It may be nice for specific jobs but it will simply cost me money in harddrive space, and backup costs, for my Wedding and Portrait business model. The largest prints I normally sell are 24x36. My 5D3 eats up enough space as it is. A friend of mine shoots sports professionally with a 1D MkIIn with 8.2MP and he has no issues.

If I need to make large prints I enlarge the image in Photoshop, and this just got even better with Photoshop CC. For most businesses we don't need, or even want, a large MP camera.

I'd like to have it for play time, but I'm a long way away from ever paying the price of a pro body to get large MP to play with.

Anyway, I'd LIKE to have 40MP for cropping freedom... I just wouldn't want to have to pay for the harddrive space.
Hard drives..... Time marches on there too....

First hard drive I bought for work was $10,000 for a 10 megabyte drive.... Last week I bought 24 4terrabyte drives at $250 each.... That's 100 terabytes for $6000..... Quite a drop in price per byte.... This is 7 orders of magnitude... That's like buying a mansion in 1980 for $1,000,000.00 and in 2013 buying a better mansion for $0.06

LOL this is going to be rude... and your point is?

If you're spending that much on harddrives for your photography business and you want a large megapixel camera you're dealing with the wrong company here. You should visit http://www.hasselbladusa.com/
Last year I bought about 600 hard drives for work.... Data logging, not photography. That would be a LOT of photos :)

My work (that keeps the food on the table) is in a research lab.

My point about hard drive capacity and price is that storage capacities have skyrocketed and prices have plummeted. Cost of storage is so low now that it is almost free.
Agreed...storage is ridiculously cheap these days, more than cheap enough to support extremely high resolution RAW images from 40, 50, 60, 80mp sensors and beyond. I personally have four 2TB drives in a ReadyNAS NVX (8TB network storage device), as well as several more 1TB and 2TB drives for work storage, scratch and swap space, etc. in my workstation. All of that only costs a few hundred bucks these days. It is also ridiculously cheap to buy whole 25 disc spindles of LTH type Verbatim BluRay recordable discs for periodic permabackups and off-site storage of huge RAW files.

Storage space is probably the cheapest commodity in the photographic world, by a long shot.
 

pj1974

80D, M5, 7D, & lots of glass and accessories!
Oct 18, 2011
619
94
Adelaide, Australia
JohanCruyff said:
pj1974 said:
3. As I've said for YEARS: APS-H is dead. Please don't keep resurrecting it. ::) APS-H is now an unnecessary 'half way house' between APS-C and FF. The 6D particularly demonstrates that. Leave it to RIP, please!
- APS-C for budget sensor, on camera flash, 'reach' (ie pixel density for certain applications - eg birding, some sports), and to make use of the wonderful array of EF-S lenses (many of which are L class in terms of image quality.
- FF for more depth of field (DOF) control and per pixel sharpness, lower noise, and possibly in the (near) future, an overall much higher resolution photo - already competing with Medium Format.
Maybe you're right, APS-H is an unnecessary compromise between FF and APS-C.
If you're right, we can consider G15 is an unnecessary compromise between standard point&shoot cameras and EOS M.
And maybe APS-C sensor is an unnecessary compromise between P&Ss and FF.
And maybe P&Ss are unnecessary compromises between smartphones and FF.
And ...


Well, I think that a few compromises deserve to survive.
The comparison you're drawing between target marketing and product lines within the DSLR realm and the non-DSLR (let's call them 'P&S') realm is flawed, based on both market dynamics as well as the business / technology spectrum.

Canon produces a whole lot more P&S cameras than DSLR bodies. Many more models, and sell more P&S than DSLRs (though DSLRs have increased as a proportion of P&S in the past 10 years in particular).

There is a lot more market latitude for models like the G15 and even the EOS-M (above the standard small P&S) than for an APS-H between APS-C and FF. Also, if one looks carefully at DSLR lenses, most are best suited to either an APS-C (EF-S) OR FF (EF). EF lenses on APS-H can of course 'work' - but often they are better on either a FF or APS-C depending on the required application.

Similarly, a comparison of P&S between smart phone and DSLR isn't quite justified... though certainly the market will segment with an increasing number of smart phone cameras, as some of them have decent cameras included in recent times.

I do appreciate that there are some compromises between A and Z which do deserve to survive. That's where I see APS-C sitting (though even that I concede in the future may disappear... not in the near future, but possibly who knows what will happen in 20 years?!) 20 years ago the thought of a (FF) digital DSLR was a very 'futuristic' idea, let alone one with Live-View that could record movies. :)

Cheers

Paul
 

kaihp

I'm not new here
Mar 19, 2012
854
6
Don Haines said:
My point about hard drive capacity and price is that storage capacities have skyrocketed and prices have plummeted. Cost of storage is so low now that it is almost free.
Drives are very cheap. Doing backup of the drives continues to be a stone in the shoe, though ;)
 

schill

EOS T7i
Dec 7, 2012
90
0
kaihp said:
Don Haines said:
My point about hard drive capacity and price is that storage capacities have skyrocketed and prices have plummeted. Cost of storage is so low now that it is almost free.
Drives are very cheap. Doing backup of the drives continues to be a stone in the shoe, though ;)
That's what more drives are for. :)
 

kaihp

I'm not new here
Mar 19, 2012
854
6
schill said:
kaihp said:
Don Haines said:
My point about hard drive capacity and price is that storage capacities have skyrocketed and prices have plummeted. Cost of storage is so low now that it is almost free.
Drives are very cheap. Doing backup of the drives continues to be a stone in the shoe, though ;)
That's what more drives are for. :)
You're missing the point.