Bought a 7D, considering exchanging for a 60D. What would you do?

[nolken]

I understand my needs may be different than yours. I'm curious as to what YOU would do. Not necessarilly what I should do, but what you would do. Background:

I consider myself an advanced amateur. I originally had a 60D, but sold it at the beginning of last semester to focus more on school (and knowing that the body would inevitably experience a price drop soon. Glad I sold it when I did!). I thought I could live without for a year, but I couldn't take it anymore and I bought the 7D a couple of weeks ago for $1030. Now I can get the 60D for $560. That makes the 7D an extra $470, or 84% more. I don't do sports photography or BIF. The closes thing to fast moving is my kids playing, so I don't really need the 7D AF. Before I sold the 60D, I was doing some smaller paid video gigs. I would like to take that to the next level. I would like to do TV commercials for local companies and product advertising videos as well as what I was previously doing. I live in a small(er) town, and the ONLY competition is the local cable company who makes horrendous commercials. One concern of mine, Is it unprofessional to take a 60D to a shoot? Like I said, I only did smaller paid gigs, and nobody really knew anything about my gear. I was still a bit self conscious bringing my 60D, even on the smaller gigs. I did keep all my other video equipment when I sold the body since all the other items don't lose value so fast.

Why I would keep the 7D:

• 1080 HDMI output durring recording. This is pretty important to me, but alone doesn't quite justify the extra $470. Almost though because the screen going black on the 60D upon pressing record is incredibly annoying.
• Magnesium alloy body. For obvious reasons over the 60D's polycarbonate. This, however, isn't as big of a deal, as the 60D's body is still good.
• The 7D will have a better resale value. Again, though, this isn't as important as I can't really see myself selling it in the near future. Upon purchase of my next body, the 7D/60D will become my back-up.
• The AFMA and better AF of the 7D will be invaluable IF I end up actually needing that in the future. IF.
• It looks good in my hands

Why I would exchange the 7D for the 60D?
$$$$

So, what would you do personally if you were trying to decide between the 60D and the 7D? And, I suppose, what would you do in my situation?

 

[tapanit]

There's nothing unprofessional about using a 60D, if it fits the need. Rather the contrary, it'd be unprofessional to use a more expensive tool than is needed. And the resale value of the 7D is likely to go down when 70D and/or 7D mark II are introduced, which seems likely to happen this year.

 

[CarlTN]

If you don't do sports photography, you really don't need a 7D. That said, the 60D is not intended to be used by professionals. It has no auto focus micro adjustment. It has a mostly plastic body.

Unless you mostly shoot in RAW, and print pictures larger than 8x10, the 60D would probably suffice.

Since you seem concerned about losing money to depreciation...and you already bought a 60D, then sold it, then bought a new 7D for a relatively low price, I would just cool it on buying anything else. You're already seeing a lot more depreciation than if you had just bought the one camera and kept it, or else waited and bought a 70D or a 7D II.

As for what looks good in your hands...frankly you're being silly and shallow a bit. Nobody is going to be looking that closely at a crop camera body while it is in your hands, or be able to tell the difference...they are similar in size (maybe between a rebel and a 7D, yes...but not a 60D). People who know, are looking more at what lens you're using anyway.

If you're mostly doing video, anyone who is familiar with that, would be looking more at your sound rig and tripod, or otherwise your cinema grip.

 

[Niterider]

I would be happy to explain which route I would go and why, but I would like to know a little more about your gear before I throw out my opinion. What are the lenses you currently own or are planning on obtaining in the near future. Also, you mentioned video so what audio/tripod/lighting/post processing do you have?

 

[Don Haines]

Sound! A decent microphone, particularly a remote mic, will make you look more professional than whatever dslr you happen to be shooting with and will vastly improve the sound.

 

[BrandonKing96]

If you don't really need the 7D, and you feel as if you want that extra cash, just go for the 60D.
When I only had the 60D, my main reason I'd like to upgrade to a 7D is because of that nice build. But I don't really care now because of my 5d 3.
But really it depends on what you find more practical and comfortable. If you're used to the 7D now, it might be weird holding the plastic 60D (I definitely find it strange holding mine now)

 

[trygved]

If video is really what you're about, I would strongly suggest you first get a handful of paid gigs, sell your 7D, and pony up for a 5DIII + 24-105 and a couple fast primes.
While the swivel screen and ~$400 make the 60D an enticing option, you will be unable to shoot in low light adequately with either APS-C offering.
If you improve the IQ of your videos, you can entice larger clients with deeper pockets.

If you haven't already, start a killer portfolio showcasing what you can really do with the setup you have.
Your clients will hardly be concerned with your equipment if you can assure them the final product will meet a professional-ish standard.

And yeah, if you don't have sound worked out, you'll need to sort that out, pronto.

 

[eyeland]

I have been in a very similar situation for a while now, trying to decide between a 7Dc vs another 60D. I am leaning strongly towards the 7D myself. Due to personal matters, I have been very inactive for half a year which coincided with the wait for the much anticipated 6D.
Seeing as you are considering a downgrade I assume that going FF is out of the question atm?

If you don't do sports photography, you really don't need a 7D.

I don't agree with this at all.
There are many advantages on the 7D imo, and the improved AF and burst are plenty useful for me for other things than sports.
IMO, for stills the advantages of the 7D are obvious.
For video, less so:
The clear advantage of the 60D is of course the swivel LCD and the price.
On the 7D the improved HDMI out is nice and I think the C1,C2 and C3 modes can be very useful as well. (on the 60D, video mode is activated on the mode selector dial, and thus, the Custom mode can NOT be used for video - a much overlooked difference IMO)

In terms of "looking like a pro", this of course does come of as shallow, but on the other hand, if a gripped 7D makes you feel more confident, maybe that will help you business wise. As mentioned, no-one is likely to judge you based on whether you shoot 60D or 7D, but your confidence can make a difference.

I guess the choice is easier for me since the price difference here is smaller (750$ vs 1100$) but the only reason I can see to go with the 60D is money being REALLY tight or the importance of Swivel-LCD.

Personally, I hope to follow the route that trygved suggested, namely to gather the funds to go FF as fast as possible + a Tamron 24-70VC and a canon 35/2 IS to begin with
Also, consider picking up some old MF primes from ebay. You can get Primes for the m42 mount for next to nothing (paid 40$ for my last 50mm and shipping was half the cost.)

 

[RLPhoto]

It's better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it. Keep the 7D.

 

[RC]

...I'm curious as to what YOU would do. Not necessarilly what I should do, but what you would do....

One of my two bodies is a 7D so I am bias. I would choose a 7D for:
- AFMA
- Ergonomics / button layout / build
- and of course AF

Those are my quick reasons

Only you will know if the price difference between selling your now used 7D is big enough over a new 60D. I'm guessing the gain would be $200 or $300 if you are lucky.

I don't do sports photography or BIF. The closes thing to fast moving is my kids playing, so I don't really need the 7D AF.

Today the 7D's AF may not be important but tomorrow you might get a call for a gig where it will be.

...The 7D will have a better resale value. Again, though, this isn't as important as I can't really see myself selling it in the near future. Upon purchase of my next body, the 7D/60D will become my back-up.
[*]The AFMA and better AF of the 7D will be invaluable IF I end up actually needing that in the future.....

I wouldn't worry about the resale of either. Both resales will stink in the long run. Just know you have a great camera and enjoy it.

No doubt, AFMA is and will be invaluable especially if you have or add fast glass in the future...I think you might have just answered your own question here. Good luck

 

[nolken]

Well money isn't really tight per say, but I'm not loaded either.

I do feel i'm pretty set for the time being as far as glass goes. I actually have exactly what trygved suggested minus the 5D mark iii. A 24-105L and some fast primes. I do not own any EF-S glass because I do anticipate going to FF. Just not now. I want to have gotten a couple of paid gigs before I go for the 5D mark iii. Right now the investment is not a wise one because of the uncertainty. Low-Light performance is relatively a non-issue for me. I pretty much never shoot anything in a non-staged scene, even with photography. And with photography when I do shoot non-staged I don't really mind using a flash or cranking up the ISO a bit. I'm not a wedding photographer.

for lighting I mainly have a pair of Arri 650w fresnels for key lighting and I have several extra cheaper lights for fill lighting. I'm considering a 3rd Arri, but that is not necessary at the moment.

For audio i have countryman wired lavalier mics and an AT897. Since I rarely shoot run and gun, I usually run it into a usb recording interface connected to my Macbook Pro. I believe audio is the biggest place I'm lacking, but what I have sounds nice and if I need a wireless G3 I will rent one. I've never yet found I've needed something else, but of course that will change as I broaden my clientele. I will be picking up some more mics as I need them for a gig.

I do all my PP on my Macbook pro quad core i7 with 16GB of ram. I haven't yet, but I do plan to remove the CD drive and replace it with a with a second HD in a RAID 0 configuration with the other. I use Premiere Pro & After Effects CS5 Premiere pro runs great, After effects runs good but not great due to my 512mb video card that is non-CUDA.

I have a Manfrotto 502HD head with 546b Legs. I do also have a jib that I like to use mounted directly to the legs.

I'm not one to buy on anticipation. If I need a mic or light for a shoot I'm doing I'll either rent or buy based on my predicted need for the future. I'm actually not really concerned with depreciation, as they will both depreciate even more when the 70D/7D come out. I do think the 60D will depreciate more.

I'm confident rather I use a 5D/7D/60D/T4i. Those are just tools. I can hammer a nail with a sledge hammer or with a hammer, it doesn't matter to me.

 

[nolken]

as far as price difference after selling the 7D, I wouldn't be selling the 7D. I would be returning it. I've only had it a couple of weeks.

 

[nolken]

No doubt, AFMA is and will be invaluable especially if you have or add fast glass in the future...I think you might have just answered your own question here. Good luck

the ONLY reason I may consider not worrying about the AFMA is because it is a crop with a wider DoF and The body I choose now will eventually be my backup body to one that will surely have AFMA, most likely the 5Dmiii. If I didn't plan on upgrading to FF eventually I wouldn't even consider the 60D.

 

[sagittariansrock]

You have stated plenty of reasons to go for the 60D yourself (points 1 through 5 in favor of 7D are in reality reasons in favor of 60D due to the counter-arguments in each, and point 6 is silly ).
I can think of only one reason to keep the 7D in your case (in my case there are plenty, like ergonomics, fps, AF, ruggedness)- and that is, you already have it- won't have to bother with selling it and getting something else. Time and effort is often worth more money than we can appreciate.

 

[PoulStaugaard]

Keep the 7D. You wouldn't order a meal in a restaurant and send it back if it turns out to be exactly what you expected, would you?

 

[nolken]

Keep the 7D. You wouldn't order a meal in a restaurant and send it back if it turns out to be exactly what you expected, would you?

That is different. The restaurant will lose money on that, and the meal that was sent back can't be re-sold. The camera, on the other hand, will get shipped back to Canon and sold as a refurbished camera. The store I purchased it from will not be loosing money. Neither will Canon. I'll still be buying the 60D from them, not the mention the thousands of dollars I spend at the retailer every year. Also the money I saved will more than likely be re-spent at that retailer.

Needless to say I don't think they will care that much.

 

[picturesbyme]

I had a 7D. Sold it, got a 60D and a better glass 24-70, 200 etc...
Now I shot w/FF but I still have the 60D. It's only a backup and I use it for macro w/the EFS60, and for wide with the Sigma 8-16, both are awesome lenses. It's an awesome little cam and apart from the lack of AF adjustment I see nothing wrong with it for most uses. Actually I never even needed the AFMA, but maybe I was just lucky. (used that a lot on the 7D, barely use it on 5D2)
It would be great if the ISOs would be cleaner above 800 but the 7D won't make a diff. there anyway..
After all it all depends on your style, your subjects, knowledge...etc.

Just one more thing. If you visit my site and go to portraits, or even if you just sit back and see the main slide I doubt that you could tell which photo was taken with what... think about that for a sec..

 

[Marsu42]

I do feel i'm pretty set for the time being as far as glass goes. I actually have exactly what trygved suggested minus the 5D mark iii. A 24-105L and some fast primes. I do not own any EF-S glass because I do anticipate going to FF. Just not now. I want to have gotten a couple of paid gigs before I go for the 5D mark iii. Right now the investment is not a wise one because of the uncertainty. Low-Light performance is relatively a non-issue for me. I pretty much never shoot anything in a non-staged scene, even with photography. And with photography when I do shoot non-staged I don't really mind using a flash or cranking up the ISO a bit. I'm not a wedding photographer.

+1 for the 60d (though I'm a bit biased as a 60d owner ) - as for the differences 7d/60d there are tons of threads about it, but I agree that they won't matter for what you do - except for the swivel screen which is a plus for video and might make you look more pro than cowering next to your camera or standing on your toes.

The one reason for the 7d that hasn't been mentioned is that it makes a better combo with the 5d3 due to the similar button layout, while 60d+6d integrate without re-thinking where the buttons are. Just remember that the 7d uses cf cards, on 5d3 cf is also best because of the broken sd slot, but you will need sd cards for the 60d (again).

Imho concerning camera bodies, just get what you really require, they drop in price too fast - once the 70d/7d2 are out with an improved sensors most people won't want to use the current 18mp generation as a door stopper.

 

[PoulStaugaard]

Keep the 7D. You wouldn't order a meal in a restaurant and send it back if it turns out to be exactly what you expected, would you?

That is different. The restaurant will lose money on that, and the meal that was sent back can't be re-sold. The camera, on the other hand, will get shipped back to Canon and sold as a refurbished camera. The store I purchased it from will not be loosing money. Neither will Canon. I'll still be buying the 60D from them, not the mention the thousands of dollars I spend at the retailer every year. Also the money I saved will more than likely be re-spent at that retailer.

Needless to say I don't think they will care that much.

Assuming you get all your money back, there is still a cost and someone is gonna have to pay for it. Ultimately, I would argue, it is going to be the other customers.

 

[DanielW]

I had a 7D. Sold it, got a 60D and a better glass 24-70, 200 etc...
Now I shot w/FF but I still have the 60D. It's only a backup and I use it for macro w/the EFS60, and for wide with the Sigma 8-16, both are awesome lenses. It's an awesome little cam and apart from the lack of AF adjustment I see nothing wrong with it for most uses. Actually I never even needed the AFMA, but maybe I was just lucky. (used that a lot on the 7D, barely use it on 5D2)
It would be great if the ISOs would be cleaner above 800 but the 7D won't make a diff. there anyway..
After all it all depends on your style, your subjects, knowledge...etc.

Just one more thing. If you visit my site and go to portraits, or even if you just sit back and see the main slide I doubt that you could tell which photo was taken with what... think about that for a sec..

Wow, terrific photos! Congratulations! I myself felt like buying quite a few...
(On the other hand, I wish I hadn't seen your work; now I can't blame my 60D anymore...)