Here are the Canon EOS R7 and Canon EOS R10

[neuroanatomist]

For those interested, here's the full spec sheet:

https://downloads.canon.com/notthistime/cameras/better/EOSR7_specifications-5-22.pdf

 

[AlanF]

Yes, that was my point. It wasn't an upgrade, and neither is the R7. The latter is a mirrorless 90D. There is no mirrorless 7-series, just a camera that happens to be called an R7.

What is important here is the AF. The 90D wasn't the 7DII successor, but it is actually pretty good on IQ although its AF isn't. If the R7 has AF as good as the R5 or R6, then it is a huge leap forward because they are spectacular, maybe not as good as the R3, but still superb.

 

[Michael Clark]

Yes, that was my point. It wasn't an upgrade, and neither is the R7. The latter is a mirrorless 90D. There is no mirrorless 7-series, just a camera that happens to be called an R7.

We'll see what the AF performance looks like compared to the R5/R7. And at least it does have two memory card slots and a 200,000 shutter durability rating rather than the 90D's abysmal 120K. So it seems to be a mixed bag between the 90D and the continuation of the 7D line.

 

[Michael Clark]

What is important here is the AF. The 90D wasn't the 7DII successor, but it is actually pretty good on IQ although its AF isn't. If the R7 has AF as good as the R5 or R6, then it is a huge leap forward because they are spectacular, maybe not as good as the R3, but still superb.

I'm hoping increased market pressure from the competition has finally convinced Canon to stop intentionally downgrading AF systems via software in lower level models using the same basic hardware components as higher tier bodies. That seems to be the case vis a vis the R5 and R6. (Contrast that with the difference in AF performance between the 5D Mark III and 1D X, which had the same PDAF array part number, and the 5D Mark IV and 1D X Mark II, which also shared the next generation PDAF array.)

We'll see if it continues into the R7 tier.

 

[Sporgon]

The proof is never in the pudding. The proof of the pudding is in the taste. Please get your metaphors right.

I thought it was “the proof of the pudding is in the eating”

 

[Michael Clark]

That’s exactly right. I have an RP and my wife has an M6II. The control ring on the RP is mapped to exposure comp as is the quick menu dial on the M6II.

If you’re using primarily EF glass, then this is lost off course.

Unless one uses the EF-RF adapter with the control ring built into it. For those who want three dials, the extra $100 is probably worth it.

 

[Michael Clark]

I thought it was “the proof of the pudding is in the eating”

Taste or eating are both historical usages. But saying "the proof is in the pudding" doesn't even tell you what the proof that is in the pudding is supposed to prove? That it will rain tomorrow? That Angelina is going to divorce Kanye? That Jerry Springer is the REAL father?

 

[Michael Clark]

I always enjoy new releases from Canon and the reaction on CR. I'm anxious to see the hype from Canon and the reviews once the R7 is released. The 90D would have been a great camera if Canon had given it better autofocus. If they give this the autofocus of the R5/R6 this could be a nice option.

My initial reaction is that this is at best a refurbished purchase in 18 months or so. Certainly not a preorder purchase.

Better AF and a shutter durability rating twice as high as the 120,000 actuations they gave it.

 

[Michael Clark]

I don't think that aperture ring + joystick looks enjoyable to use, and I'm sure this will cost $2099, or somewhere in that ballpark. That said, it's nice just to see more cameras announced.

Does the introductory price of $1,499 USD change your impression at all?

 

[Michael Clark]

I guess if the viewfinder image is smaller (less magnified), like it traditionally is in APS-C optical VFs, then the apparent resolution is higher, of course at the expense of a more "tunnel-like" VF image. But I don’t know if that’s the case.

The 7D Mark II had a 1.0X VF magnification of 100% of the frame. That equates to the same size viewfinder as a FF body with 0.62X VF magnification.
The 5D Mark IV has 0.71X and the 1D X Mark III has 0.76X, so they are larger than the 7D Mark II VF, but nowhere near a factor of 1.6X larger.

For the mirrorless bodies, The R3, R5, and R6 all have 0.76X "equivalent" VF magnification.
The R7 is 1.15X, which translates to 0.72X "equivalent" FF magnification.
So the R7 EVF is even closer to the same size as the R3, R5, and R6 EVFs than the 7D Mark II OVF was to the 5D Mark III/IV OVFs.

 

[Blue Zurich]

For me this thread ends with Micheal Clark laughing at me yet perhaps it's me laughing at Canon for putting a physical AF/MF switch on those bodies thinking if the thousands of folks wondering why their camera won't focus, lol. Fat fingering has GOT to be a consideration in ergonomics and button layout.

 

[navastronia]

Does the introductory price of $1,499 USD change your impression at all?

I already said I was wrong about the price in my post half an hour ago - no need to laugh react my message.

 

[Michael Clark]

And if canon really thought it was a necessity why not put the thumb wheel around that instead of the joystick

Not enough room next to the flippy-tilty screen and the memory card bay underneath the right side of the back of the camera?

 

[navastronia]

For me this thread ends with Micheal Clark laughing at me yet perhaps it's me laughing at Canon for putting a physical AF/MF switch on those bodies thinking if the thousands of folks wondering why their camera won't focus, lol. Fat fingering has GOT to be a consideration in ergonomics and button layout.

Yeah, he did it to me, too. Michael Clark is kind of a tool.

 

[Michael Clark]

I already said I was wrong about the price in my post half an hour ago - no need to laugh react my message.

So I'm supposed to instantly know the content of every post before I can react to anything as I read through 19 pages of comments? And keep straight in my memory who said what in what post number on which page... ?

 

[navastronia]

So I'm supposed to instantly know the content of every post before I can react to anything as I read through 19 pages of comments? And keep straight in my memory who said what in what post number on which page... ?

You're just rude. You waited for the price announcement and then went through the thread to call attention to anyone who guessed wrong about something. It's antisocial behavior.

 

[Michael Clark]

Assuming these pictures are legit...seems to me there were folk(s) who had a "preview look" (or knew enough) and were thus able to create a more accurate representation of the final product...

I initially found it odd that the mockup somehow had a AF/MF switch in that spot (no R cameras I know of have that switch, just the DOF button), but it all makes sense now.

Anyway, I expected that this "R7" would have been much closer to the R5 in size, features and appearance, especially considering the 7D series' strong resemblance to the 5D series. Perhaps even borrowing certain features from the R3 (like eye control and vehicle tracking) to set it apart and justify its price point with an APS-C sensor. Seems to be closer to the R6 in features, but even then, there are major ergonomic differences. Not sure what they're going for here? Looks similar in size to the RP (and I notice the viewfinder sensor is on the right instead of the bottom - as an RP user, this is an inferior position). Strange design choice if it's true. Or perhaps this is meant to be the APS-C version of the R and RP release where Canon is testing the waters before they come out with the "real" ML legacy camera lines?

The "R10" appears to perhaps be, to some degree, the mirrorless successor of the 90D.

As an M-series user, neither of these bodies interest me, they are larger/heavier than I'm willing to tolerate for an APS-C sensor camera.

The R10 has always appeared to me to be the RF version of the Rebel series. Nothing about this news changes that.

The R7 appears to fall somewhere between a mirrorless 90D and a mirrorless 7D Mark II (or 7D Mark III if there had been one), just as many of us have been saying for quite a while.

The biggest surprises for me today were the prices.
I expected the R10 to be about $200 less than listed, and I expected the R7 to come in at over $2K USD.

 

[Blue Zurich]

Yeah he's has proven tool status long ago. Also those multiple replies, it's ricockulous. Moving on.

 

[Michael Clark]

Honestly, if this is what they kill the M line off for, than it was a pretty shit deal IMO.

Why do so many folks think the introduction of APS-C RF mount cameras mean the EOS M system is dead?

Canon has not introduced much of anything new to the EOS M line in more than a while because they've already got the products they need in the EOS M line to continue to sell them competitively against their competition for that market segment.

 

[Michael Clark]

Yeah he's has proven tool status long ago. Also those multiple replies, it's ricockulous. Moving on.

Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

If someone responding to your comment with a "laugh" emoticon is enough to trigger you, maybe you should stay in the nursery and let the adults there protect you from mean people like me.