No EOS-1D X Replacement in 2014 [CR2]

[Lee Jay]

I hope they pull a big surprise. 7D2 will have no measurable effect on a 5D3, let alone a 5D4. I don't understand why people keep trying to compare the two as competing bodies. They are not, nor will ever be. Not in price and not in use.

I think Canon needs to make a statement before 2015. We have the sensors out there. Even if from Sony. I'd love to see a Sony sensor in a Canon system. Talk about the best of everything!

Does Sony make a dual-pixel sensor?

 

[9VIII]

Just curious – why would Canon need to replace the 1D-X? It looks to me that the Nikon D4-S has similar or lesser specs. No other camera competes in this market segment, so why do people think it will be replaced anytime soon?

And, for that matter, why would the 5DIII need to be replaced?

If it's a high MP body then they're not (unless it still does 12fps), this is a replacement for the 1DsMkIII, which is long, long overdue.

Also stating that the next bodies will get "upgraded" to the AF sensor on the 7DMkII has got to be wrong, that thing has just one f2.8 sensitive point and the rest are f5.6. That would be a serious downgrade.
If they mean the same pattern, all f4 sensitive cross type and with a dozen double cross type points, ok then, but not the exact same thing.

 

[Lee Jay]

Also stating that the next bodies will get "upgraded" to the AF sensor on the 7DMkII has got to be wrong, that thing has just one f2.8 sensitive point and the rest are f5.6. That would be a serious downgrade.

All the f/5.6 points are also sensitive at f/2.8. It's a question of precision. Have they made the all-new AF sensor with small enough pixels that even the f/5.6 sensitive points are just as precise at f/2.8 as the old f/2.8 points were at f/2.8, and the new f/2.8 points much more precise with f/1.4 lenses than the old f/2.8 points were?

The specs for the new sensor as for DOF precision don't seem to have been released yet. Or, at least I haven't seen them.

 

[wockawocka]

I believe the 5D4 will be the camera that stops me getting another 1 series body.

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

"12-18 months."

Farther out than I'd have expected for a 5D4.

Of course new type sensors take a long time. That's why some were trying to prod them so strongly earlier on.

The one positive is that maybe, maybe they are holding back for truly new sensors for the 5D4 and 4k?

It does sound like it's time to get some Sony now to at least tie-over though.

 

[canonistic]

Just curious – why would Canon need to replace the 1D-X? It looks to me that the Nikon D4-S has similar or lesser specs. No other camera competes in this market segment, so why do people think it will be replaced anytime soon?

And, for that matter, why would the 5DIII need to be replaced?

I blame Apple. They found that releasing a new (or slightly updated) model every year created excitement and lines around the block and people who just HAD to get the new model. We as consumers now want that "buzz" every year even if the improvement is minor.
In my opinion, digital cameras are pretty awesome now, improvements are evolutionary and NOT revolutionary and a given design will produce useful images for a long time. Still we want that upgrade excitement don't we?

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

What I find funny is if you go over to sonyalpharumors many people compare the new Exmor to the 5DMKIII and admit it is a better camera system all round.

These are all comments by sonyalpharumors members on the latest sensor threads.

"dynamic range at higher ISO's where the 5DIII's lurch ahead of their nikon/sony counterparts"

The best at high ISO DR are the 6D/1DX/D4/D4s/D3s not the 5D3, although the 5D3 isn't bad.
Anyway the 5D3 absolutely does not lurch ahead of all Nikon for high ISO DR.

Funny how even they think DXO is dodgy "If you leave DxOMark planet and land back to earth, you'll see that in real life the difference is very very little, and after ISO400 Canon 6D and 5DMarkIII are as good as or better than Sony sensors"

Dodgy? So a 2-3 stops difference at low ISO DR is too small to even notice but anywhere from 1 stop ahead to 1 stop BEHIND for high ISO DR is incredible?

Also most are in the same camp bout the mega pixel war and know that sony needs to create more native faster lenses 'I'd rather have faster autofocus, in body stabilization, quieter shutter and more native lenses (and faster ones) than more megapixels.'

Well of course their mirrorless cams have issues as full on general purpose cameras. But the sensors are good. And you can get their sensors in a Nikon body.

I think thats what we are forgetting and a lot of people on here are the other way round ATM DR and resolution is all the rage and aggressively contested, forget about all that Canon has over its competition and that the 5DMKIII is far from being thrown to the parts bin.

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

And, for that matter, why would the 5DIII need to be replaced?

To get 3 stops more low ISO DR and get rid of low ISO banding?
To get a nice 4k?
To get crisp 1080p without RAW?
To get more MP?

 

[Lee Jay]

And, for that matter, why would the 5DIII need to be replaced?

Dual pixel, new RGB+IR metering.

 

[privatebydesign]

Just curious – why would Canon need to replace the 1D-X? It looks to me that the Nikon D4-S has similar or lesser specs. No other camera competes in this market segment, so why do people think it will be replaced anytime soon?

Because long time Canon 1 series users have been forced into a choice that doesn't sit well. When the 1Ds MkIII came out it was the sensor king, the resolution has proven to be good enough for many but the bodies are old and in need of replacement. There is a market for a high MP 1 series, but there is also a market for a true 1Ds MkIII replacement, a 24MP 1 series with a now attainable high frame rate with all the modern touches like metering, AF, full RT flash integration, iso capabilities, etc etc.

I believe those after a high MP 1 series wouldn't care too much for the form factor, they would take a regular body design and additional grip option, whereas the core 1 series market has now gotten used to the battery power and rugged functionality of the all in one design.

To be sure, a 1Dx MkII if it were 21-24 MP and 12 fps would be a true 1D MkIV and 1Ds MkIII replacement, the 1DX was not, that there are many out there that would buy into a high mp body, they will do that whatever the form factor.

I also believe the days of the $8,000 DSLR are over though the ten years it worked were pretty cool, it makes much more sense, which means it won't happen, to have a high MP D810 competitor with a similar form factor around $3,500 heck just stick the sensor in a 5D MkIII and change the top plate, and a single 1 series with 24MP and 12fp for $6,000.

 

[Viggo]

I was actually doubting if it were to replaced at all in 2015 even. Always fun and exciting to see a new 1-series, so bring it on 8)

 

[DominoDude]

I have no clue on the reliability of things I've heard, but they fit with this. If anything there's a gap to fill that includes more pixels, and then after that the follow up to 1D X. All with next year as the target.
It can be wishful thinking by the one who said it, but it can also be based on vague facts.

For my sake: It better be good, than rushed.

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

Just curious – why would Canon need to replace the 1D-X? It looks to me that the Nikon D4-S has similar or lesser specs. No other camera competes in this market segment, so why do people think it will be replaced anytime soon?

And, for that matter, why would the 5DIII need to be replaced?

I blame Apple. They found that releasing a new (or slightly updated) model every year created excitement and lines around the block and people who just HAD to get the new model. We as consumers now want that "buzz" every year even if the improvement is minor.
In my opinion, digital cameras are pretty awesome now, improvements are evolutionary and NOT revolutionary and a given design will produce useful images for a long time. Still we want that upgrade excitement don't we?

3 stops more DR and 4k and such are not minor little nothings
not everyone cares about those things at all, but for those who do they are more along the lines of revolutionary
it's not like going from ipad3 to 4 to Air (I'm still on the ipad3 myself)

 

[unfocused]

And, for that matter, why would the 5DIII need to be replaced?

To get 3 stops more low ISO DR and get rid of low ISO banding?
To get a nice 4k?
To get crisp 1080p without RAW?
To get more MP?

And, for that matter, why would the 5DIII need to be replaced?

Dual pixel, new RGB+IR metering.

These might be nice, but as someone who actually owns a 5DIII, I don't find any of these to be compelling reasons to upgrade. Judging by some of the comments and recent polls on this site, I'm not sure many other 5DIII owners are feeling a need to upgrade either. Waiting another year or two for more significant technological improvements might make more sense.

Just curious – why would Canon need to replace the 1D-X? It looks to me that the Nikon D4-S has similar or lesser specs. No other camera competes in this market segment, so why do people think it will be replaced anytime soon?

Because long time Canon 1 series users have been forced into a choice that doesn't sit well. When the 1Ds MkIII came out it was the sensor king, the resolution has proven to be good enough for many but the bodies are old and in need of replacement. There is a market for a high MP 1 series, but there is also a market for a true 1Ds MkIII replacement, a 24MP 1 series with a now attainable high frame rate with all the modern touches like metering, AF, full RT flash integration, iso capabilities, etc etc...

...To be sure, a 1Dx MkII if it were 21-24 MP and 12 fps would be a true 1D MkIV and 1Ds MkIII replacement, the 1DX was not, that there are many out there that would buy into a high mp body, they will do that whatever the form factor.

Okay, I guess I understand. You certainly know more about what 1D users want and need than I do. I am just looking at it from a competitive standpoint, and I'm not seeing anything in the D4-S that the 1D-X doesn't do as well or better. So, was thinking that there was nothing that would make Canon feel they have to upgrade to keep 1D body users from switching brands.

 

[Lee Jay]

These might be nice, but as someone who actually owns a 5DIII, I don't find any of these to be compelling reasons to upgrade.

I'm a 5D (not II or III) owner and haven't upgraded, but these things might well encourage me to finally do so.

 

[brad-man]

I am curious about future pricing. I think one of the reasons many 5Dlll owners aren't in such a hurry to upgrade is because of the (what I consider to be) high price. If the 5 series were still selling in the upper 2000s I think upgrading would be more attractive than at $3600. That was quite a hike from the 5Dll to the 5Dlll. I am hoping the greater competition in bodies and lenses from other manufacturers are forcing Canon to take a step back from their great price hikes. I bought a 6D rather than a 5Dlll because I didn't feel the focus system was worth an additional $1700. But more recently comes the very reasonably priced EF16-35 f/4IS and the also reasonably priced 7Dll. So will Canon continue this pricing trend with the 5DlV and introduce it for a more reasonable $2900-3200 to avoid more folks from migrating to a Sony or Nikon body? Or am I just dreaming?

 

[keithcooper]

No idea about what this may mean for the 5 series (it'll get replaced eventually and it will be 'better), but as a few others have mentioned, it would be nice to see a true successor to the 1Ds3 at last (for the not insignificant number of 1Ds3 users, who don't just didn't see the 1D X as much of an 'improvement' ;-)

Around £5000 should be enough to annoy lots of people... ;-)

 

[LetTheRightLensIn]

And, for that matter, why would the 5DIII need to be replaced?

To get 3 stops more low ISO DR and get rid of low ISO banding?
To get a nice 4k?
To get crisp 1080p without RAW?
To get more MP?

And, for that matter, why would the 5DIII need to be replaced?

Dual pixel, new RGB+IR metering.

These might be nice, but as someone who actually owns a 5DIII, I don't find any of these to be compelling reasons to upgrade. Judging by some of the comments and recent polls on this site, I'm not sure many other 5DIII owners are feeling a need to upgrade either. Waiting another year or two for more significant technological improvements might make more sense.

What more significant improvements? If 4k isn't anything, nor crisp 1080p, nor firmware with aids that actually let you focus video and see blown highlights, nor better metering, nor dual pixel AF, nor 3 stops DR at low ISO, nor 1+ stops DR at high ISO, nor 46-46MP, etc. what are you expecting?

 

[Besisika]

Just curious – why would Canon need to replace the 1D-X? It looks to me that the Nikon D4-S has similar or lesser specs. No other camera competes in this market segment, so why do people think it will be replaced anytime soon?

And, for that matter, why would the 5DIII need to be replaced?

I understand your point of view, it is market-based and makes totally sense.
From my user stand point though, since they did not "upgrade" it with the dual-pixel technology, it makes me feel left aside, as "lower" camera like 70D and 7D II has the functionality, as well as the cinema C series and only 1DX didn't get it.
I know, it depends on the user and many don't need it.
Now that I know how powerful that feature is for what I do, the more I discover more of its potential the more I regret that 1DX didn't get it. I did panning yesterday and I really really missed it with live view stills, not to mention video.
Don't get me wrong, I won't replace my 1DX for anything on the market, I just regret that it didn't get it. The next version most certainly will have it. If I could upgrade for $500 I wouldn't think of a new version.

 

[unfocused]

And, for that matter, why would the 5DIII need to be replaced?

To get 3 stops more low ISO DR and get rid of low ISO banding?
To get a nice 4k?
To get crisp 1080p without RAW?
To get more MP?

And, for that matter, why would the 5DIII need to be replaced?

Dual pixel, new RGB+IR metering.

These might be nice, but as someone who actually owns a 5DIII, I don't find any of these to be compelling reasons to upgrade. Judging by some of the comments and recent polls on this site, I'm not sure many other 5DIII owners are feeling a need to upgrade either. Waiting another year or two for more significant technological improvements might make more sense.

What more significant improvements? If 4k isn't anything, nor crisp 1080p, nor firmware with aids that actually let you focus video and see blown highlights, nor better metering, nor dual pixel AF, nor 3 stops DR at low ISO, nor 1+ stops DR at high ISO, nor 46-46MP, etc. what are you expecting?

First, I'm not sure your wish list is realistic.

Second, I'm not a video person, so neither 4K nor 1080 p has any interest for me personally. (Although I recognize that it might interest video people) but not convinced it is such a necessity that some people think, given that now and for the foreseeable future most video is going to live on the internet.

I can see blown highlights without the camera telling me.

I'm regularly amazed at how good the existing Canon metering is already. Even when I bracket to compensate, the camera's chosen exposure is almost always spot on.

I don't use live view, so dual pixel has never been a big interest.

You should know by now that low ISO dynamic range isn't a big deal to me. (I'll take it if given to me, but I'm not interested in paying for it.)

I'm always interested in high ISO improvements, but pretty pleased with the 5DIII's performance as it is.

And, for me, 46 mp is not a plus, it's a negative.

Now, I know that's just me. But, reading a lot of comments on this site from a lot of 5DIII owners, I think I may be more typical than you suspect.

So, what would interest me?

In-camera AFMA;
Lightfield technology, offering post-exposure focusing;

Throw in user friendly wi-fi and touchscreen, higher frame rate, an in-camera photo editing program (especially one that can be linked to an iPad) so you can edit images, convert them to jpeg and post to the internet all without having to first transfer the files to a computer, better weather sealing, and a few other improvements we haven't thought of yet.

Aside from the Lightfield technology, which may be a few more years away from making autofocus systems obsolete, the rest of this stuff should be either available now or available in the near future.

In the meantime, my main point is simply that I'm content with the current 5DIII and don't see much that would make me upgrade.