Canon EOS R5 Mark II sensor resolution likely to stick at 45mp but with new AI features [CR2]

[David - Sydney]

That's not happening. Register the camera's serial number to the website, connect the camera to the computer and download your paid software upgrade.
My take on this is going forward the free upgrades will only include bug fixes. If you want all new FEATURES you'll have to pay for them.

I don't have an issue to pay for additional features but they will all need to be maintained as separate SW licenses to the main firmware... every firmware release/update would need to be checked for the different permutations of features that others may or may not have purchased.

A subscription on the other hand (like PS) includes all bug fixes plus features as they come out (if at all). It would force Canon to provide more features over time to justify the ongoing cost but balances this by recurring revenue for the R&D headcount. The main difference is hardware updates ie harder to justify new hardware if the current features are okay eg Apple iPhone with free SW feature updates.... it comes back to whether Canon is a hardware provider (ie Apple) or a SW provider (Adobe). Tricky to be both.

 

[scyrene]

all these delays on Mark II

???

 

[tron]

Careful, there are some who might not realise you are joking.

Canon being among them

 

[David - Sydney]

I suspect it would be something along the lines of a built-in SIM with a subscription cellular plan providing connectivity and cloud upload, not some photographic feature it needs to check for a license before use.

That is not going to happen on a global basis though. AT&T has a "global Sim" product that would handle this for instance but it isn't cheap. Battery life for the connectivity also would take a hit if left on in the menus but it could be just a ping every day if connectivity does exist and if so, is there a new update to download.

 

[David - Sydney]

Im not in favor of subscriptions too, but if i can get a better product because of that, then im willing to pay.

If you have all the lenses and cameras you want, then more money wont give you better photos (exluding travel etc.). This could be a way where investing more money could help me take more/better pictures. Id rather get the better product then, for a hobby that im spending a lot of time with anyway.

what my recent astro workshop has taught me is that I need to spend some money on better SW (besides LR/PS). PTgui, Starry Landscape Stacker, StarXterminator are really needed for any level of efficiency when processing milky way shots on a Mac. I was fixed on hardware costs but the SW benefits were illuminating

 

[David - Sydney]

I feel the same way but Adobe is proof that not everyone feels that way.
I would prefer the Microsoft Office approach where there is a choice between a subscription and a lifetime license.

Adobe has shown that subscriptions were initially painful but kept a better revenue stream for them. The subscription cost for LR/PS is the same as a new LR license every 2 years without PS at all so a bargain for photographers.
Note that Adobe's competitors are now looking at subscriptions or at least making it optional.

 

[David - Sydney]

I try to avoid and hardly use the subscriptions models because the ongoing costs really get to you. We cut down on streaming (only Netflix). We don't use Spotify or anything similar. If you invest the money you put in Spotify you'll save a lot of money in the long run...We have like 30 GB of music accumulated and so we only spent like 30-50 €/ year (combined) for new music purchases. At the moment, I still use Lightroom but I am working on switching to Affinity. I already bought it, but it is kind of hard getting used to it...

how do you know what is new music though? Radio (ads/talking) or free spotify (ads/limited skipping)?
Spotify individual is AUD13/month or GBP78/year. couple or family is more though.

 

[David - Sydney]

Yes, please, make AI features subscription-only. So I can ignore them utterly.

AI is a superset of options and machine learning is a one of those underlying parts of AI.... so your animal tracking features are already AI!
If you are referring to generative AI then that is different and I don't think that it would be welcome for most people on this forum but easy enough to ignore (like green mode) if you don't want it (and haven't specifically bought it separately).

 

[David - Sydney]

I'm absolutely devastated.
- No higher resolution
- AI bullshitting
- Subscription rip-off

I made the EF -> RF switch last summer temporarily using an R7 and a serious value of RF lenses and planning to buy the R5m2 latest Q1 2024 as was hoped...even now I might need to reconsider switching brands. I'm furious.

This isn't an airport... you don't need to announce your departure

 

[David - Sydney]

An AI feature id love to see (if its possible) is that the camera automatically detects the best shutterspeed for a sharp image with a moving subject.

Imagine you are photographing a flying bird and the camera automatically selects the slowest possible shutter speed that still gives you a tack sharp image.

This could revolutionize action photography by giving us potentially lower iso numbers and more sharp shots, because it would also correct too slow shutterspeeds.

Or the lowest speed that would keep the eye sharp and blur the wings etc

 

[David - Sydney]

That's true for a book or a LP/CD as well. The difference is they don't stop working as soon as you stop paying - or the subscription itself becomes unavailable, and you can pass them along to others. The difference is it's the customer who decides if and when buying again, not the seller.

Anyway I believe Canon thinks to make some features subscription-only, not the whole camera. Just like some cars manufactures tried to make some features subscription-only, just to find people weren't going to pay monthly to have seats heating active. Now if it is some niche feature maybe most customers won't complain, if you have to pay monthly to get M, Av and Tv modes, or TTL flash support, it will backfire.

Subscription licensing in business makes a lot of sense as keeping track of perpetual licenses and upgrade paths (if at all) is a pain. Use it when you have a use for it, don't pay if you don't use it.
We are getting used to this model now with phone apps and streaming subscriptions. Expensive if you get everything but see what you use and justify if it is worthwhile to continue it.

Canon will not release a camera that depends on a subscription to work at all.

 

[David - Sydney]

Interesting; would be cool to have the R5 II with subscription!

Basics:
45mpx sensor but capped to half res when saving to card, IBIS is there but disabled
One-shoot AF
People's Eye AF
Basic speed AF
Battery power cap (camera wouldn't use more then 50% of a battery, then you have to recharge to 100% to use again)
1080p60
4k30
Flipping rear display but locked in place by electromech lock

Subscriptions:
Full 45mpx res - 200$/year
IBIS enabling - 100$/year
Full battery usage over 50% - 80$/year
Enhanced speed AF - 50$/year
Servo AF - 35$/year
Bird AF - 20$/year
Car/Bike/Plane AF - 20$/year
Dog/Cat AF - 10$/year (5$/year if you have at least two dogs and a cat, and can send documents to prove. Subject to approval by Canon)
1080p120 - 20$/year
4k60 - 50$/year
8k - 100$/year
Flip display unlock - 50$/year

Camera must connect to internet PC at least every 2 weeks to check that wasn't hacked, or has Magic Lantern firmware, or anything similar.
Yearly plans goes from 1st Jan to 31st Dec, if you join in September you pay full year.
Plans must be renowned by 12pm 1st Jan each year, so you can take pics at new years eve without ruining it; at 12:01pm the camera bricks.
Date/time will not be user selectable, camera will get them by internet when connecting every two weeks, so no way of cheating the camera with date change.
You can actually cut/saw the lock of the display, but the display frame has rfid sensor on the unhinged end, if the sensor is moved away from the camera (so display is flipped) without the proper subscription, camera will know, and first time it connect to internet will not only brick, but overheat and kills its sensor and power processor, rendering it unusable.

It will be fun

If the base model is USD1500 then this could work

 

[David - Sydney]

Sony had SW feature purchases for their RX100 many years ago if I remember correctly. I think I had a mark iii version but has been a long time.

Clearly (besides the recent custom grid line option) it hasn't been successful otherwise it would be an ongoing possibility.

 

[David - Sydney]

If they are going to convince prospective buyers to ditch the current well-liked and respected 45MP, and fork out $4K for the privilege of using another 45MP camera, then they will need a seriously compelling set of new features, here\'s a few ideas:

1) Giant improvement in read-out speed (zero rolling shutter) and low-light sensitivity that matches or at least come close to the R3.

2) 2nd Gen eye-controlled AF that matches what\'s in Apple\'s Vision Pro headset.

3) Quad-pixel AF that will go toe-to-toe with the best Sony has to offer.

I know it\'s a big ask but they had 4 years since the original R5 was released and the competition is pretty stiff.

Canon needs to surpass not just what\'s available today but what Sony and Nikon will bring as the A7R mark VI and Z8 mark II

there has been lists of both HW and firmware improvements for the R5 before.
Hardware like better heating management, full sized HDMI 2.1 port, dual USB-C ports for power and direct recording (separate to HDMI), faster/more power efficient processor, 14bit in eshutter/H+ etc
Firmware is a longer list but would include better pixel shift implementation, pre-buffer, focus breathing compensation, variable ES rate, ability to remap the Rate button to something useful, and a bunch of stuff already in lower cost bodies

 

[Pixel]

I'm leery of the claims of "AI" as just being marketing jargon. They tried to claim previously "deep learning AF" when it was actually anything but.

 

[Pixel]

2) 2nd Gen eye-controlled AF that matches what\'s in Apple\'s Vision Pro headset.

That would require partnership or licensing to Apple which Canon would NEVER do. Short of that, it's not going to match.

 

[John Wilde]

all these delays on Mark II

How can it be delayed when Canon never said when it would be announced? On Canon's internal company timeline it might be right on schedule.

 

[3kramd5]

That is not going to happen on a global basis though. AT&T has a "global Sim" product that would handle this for instance but it isn't cheap. Battery life for the connectivity also would take a hit if left on in the menus but it could be just a ping every day if connectivity does exist and if so, is there a new update to download.

Yes, the global thing would be difficult unless it's for example starlink. Battery life could be mitigated by it only turning on when the user calls it.

I agree, probably not happening. My post was only a non-photographic hypothetical. I don't think they would ever get so far over their skis as to cordon off the basic functionality expected in a camera behind a pay wall.

 

[esglord]

Holding out for the R2, or at least the R4.

 

[danfaz]

Holding out for the R2...

Sorry, I do this every time!